"Intel indicates possible tag-team trolls. Maintain readiness and recon intensively."
Posted on 08/11/2004 7:08:05 AM PDT by The Wizard
Yeah but the North had to take over the South to teach them English. (ducking)
The founders envisioned a Union of the colonies.
That's why the formed a Continental Congress.
That's why they made sure that the Declaration of Independence was an acceptable document to all the colonial delegations.
That's why the Articles of Confederation were adopted.
That's why the elements of the Articles that weakened the Federal Union were replaced soon after with a more strongly Federal document.
None of the prominent Americans whom we consider the Founding Fathers: Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Adams, Jay, Hamilton, Madison, Morris, etc. contemplated a divided America as anything other than a tragic end to the cause.
Your implied contention, that the Founders either envisioned or desiderated a divided America is itself nonsense.
What you are calling victories, I am calling works in progress. I really hope for the sake of my children that the victories come.
PS hahahaha
I will take this post as your childish way of admitting that you lack the resources to offer an intelligent opinion on this forum.
What do you think you've been doing?
You can have more than an Amen...
You can have a Todd Beamer ("Let's roll")
You can have a "Gladiator" ("At my signal, unleash hell")
You can have another "Gladiator" ("What we do now echoes into eternity...strength and honor")
You can have a Bush43 ("I can hear you, the rest of the world hears you, and the people who knocked these buildings down will hear all of us soon")
Finally, you can have a tagline from an unknown FReeper: ("May God have mercy on my enemies...because I won't.")
"Intel indicates possible tag-team trolls. Maintain readiness and recon intensively."
You are free to speculate, it might be interesting to observe the theoretical.
Lincoln didn't ignore the Constitution.
Incorrect, he did it on several occasions. Even attempting to arrest the Chief Justice when opposed.
He was of the opinion that the Constitution did not mandate its own destruction.
Mandate? What an odd way to phrase his opinion, which of course carries no constitutional weight since it isn't the President's job to wage war on states to compel them to agree with him.
Ascribing the death toll of the Civil War entirely to Lincoln is, of course, silly.
It was within his power to have prevented it.
One might as well say that it was Johnston's fault for not taking Washington immediately after First Manassas.
Not THAT is silly.
If one reads The Federalist with attention, one will see that the legality of secession was not contemplated by the original advocates of the US Constitution.
The states did not join the union by signing the Federalist. And not contemplating secession doesn't forbid it.
And the physical fact of Union, far from being merely conceptual, had real implications for the safety and prosperity of the inhabitants of the US.
600,000 of whom lost thier saftey and prosperity over the issue, I guess they don't count.
But did not compel it. Do you think the Union would have been formed if the parties were told they were coming in no matter what they wanted? If they were told that once in they could never leave? That stretches the imagination not to mention history.
Your implied contention, that the Founders either envisioned or desiderated a divided America is itself nonsense.
Since I never implied any such thing, your comment is nonsensical. But it was a nice try at a strawman.
The Taliban fall, Saddam's removal, the end of the Lybian WMD programme, the Pakistani support in the war on terror and the Saudi one are five major victories. The steps to democracy in the Middle East is a work in progress.
It is my opinion that he made lasting contributions to the US as well as inflicting lasting damage. I do believe that he saw the damage he did as regrettable and undertaken only under necessity - I do not believe that he wilfully did mischief for its own sake.
An added problem is that far too many of the "Lincoln as saint" partisans have a thinly-disguised, self-righteous hatred of the South as a cultural entity.
Knowing as you do that I'm aware of this, you might suppose that I intend my point to stand in spite of that historical tidbit.
I meant to imply that if you assume that our national "house" is not complete without the southern states, what reason is there to think that it's complete now?
let's see you bad mouth an american hero, which bad enough but you bad mouth a REPUBLICAN hero.
You bad mouth the USA, in fact you wish you were not even from the united states.
I could make a point of your support of racism and slavery but i hope , in your case, that it isn't true.
I liked it better when you guys all voted for dems.
though I'll say this about southerns, they are usually very polite
I'm not too fond of Lincoln either.
Sorry for the double post! My DSL line was hung up for a while.
Crawl back under your rock; you're wasting bandwidth here.
Bravo Sierra. During debates on the militia, one James Madison proposed allowing the federal government more control over the officers to prevent secession. That motion failed to be passed. Besides that, there were several discussions as to the legality of the soon to occur secession from the Articles.
Could you not also say the same about the "Lincoln As Demon" partisans, and their hatred of the North as a cultural entity?
This is a terminal fight; neither side will ever bend, or listen to the other. It's like trying to talk to a troll.
We are disagreeing over terms, not so much over substance.
Afghanistan and Iraq still have US troops fighting therein. Progress has been made, but the fighting is still going on. Works in progress.
Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are still rounding up terrorists. It ain't over yet. Progress has been made. Works in progress.
I agree that Libya seems to want to rejoin the civilized world.
Hey barryellen, you're reading a whole lot more into this discussion than actually exists. When I first discovered FR, I did the same thing. So I lurked for a few years before I ever posted. I'm glad I did. I'm certainly not implying that you should, however. Welcome to FR. Enjoy the ride.
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