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What CBS News is Up Against in Defending the Fake Killian Memo's
Sept. 10, 2004 | The bandit

Posted on 09/10/2004 2:54:34 PM PDT by The Bandit

At this time it appears CBS intends to defend the Bush memo's it aired on 60-Minutes II Wednesday. It would appear their defense will rest on on the ability of CBS News to prove with absolute certainty that the ability to produce the "th" superscript mentioned exist on typewriters as early as 1968, and in fact is in President Bush's official military records released by the White House. With is said; here is what CBS News needs to demonstrate before the documents can be viewed as authentic:

1) The fonts. The font's are clearly New Roman which forces CBS to explain where such a font came from in 1972 and was available to Jerry Killian. CBS News will need to explain why when overlapping the original B/W negative of the memo's with memo's written on MS Word match up perfectly when the default new Roman font is selected.

2) CBS News will have to explain August 18, 1973 memo where Jerry Killian purportedly writes how General Staudt was pressuring Hodges when General Staudt had retired in 1972.

3) CBS News will need to produce more Killian memo's for comparison purposes. Surely this are not the only four memo's Killian ever wrote?

4) CBS News will need to produce a typewriter that produces the superscript "th" will it be the same font and size as the one in the memo's that was available to Jerry Killian in 1973..

5) CBS News will need to produce official documents from the era that used "MEMORANDUM FOR" as it was never used in the 970's.

6) CBS News will need to explain why the abbreviation for Fighter Interceptor Squadron (FIS) includes periods after each capital letter when periods were never used.

7) CBS News will need to explain the signature element is placed far to the right, instead of being left justified. The placement of the signature element to the right was not used or directed by Air Force standards until almost 20 years after the date of this letter.

8) CBS News will need to explain why the phrase "not later than" is spelled out and not written in its common military abbreviation form of "NLT".

There are eight more issues these eight issues came from that will need to be fully explained if CBS News wants to to be taken seriously in defending the Killian memo's.



TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: 60minutes; bush; cbsnews; dan; guard; killian; memo; national; rather; rathergate
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1 posted on 09/10/2004 2:54:34 PM PDT by The Bandit
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To: The Bandit

Nice shot Bandit. Right between the eyes.


2 posted on 09/10/2004 3:03:07 PM PDT by HardStarboard
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To: HardStarboard

In case they missed some of this:

"* The memos were written using a proportional typeface, where letters take up variable space according to their size, rather than fixed-pitch typeface used on typewriters, where each letter is allotted the same space. Proportional typefaces are available only on computers or on very high-end typewriters that were unlikely to be used by the National Guard.

* The memos include superscript, i.e. the "th" in "187th" appears above the line in a smaller font. Superscript was not available on typrwriters.

* The memos inclued "curly" apostrophes rather than straight apostrophes found on typewriters.

* The font used in the memos is Times Roman, which was in use for printing but not in typewriters. The Haas Atlas--the bible of fonts--does not list Times Roman as an available font for typewriters.

* The vertical spacing used in the memos, measured at 13 points, is not available in typewriters, and only became possible with the advent of computers."


3 posted on 09/10/2004 3:05:37 PM PDT by need_a_screen_name
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To: HardStarboard

Now I have my "th" mixed up. I zaped "th" from this. Oh well!


4 posted on 09/10/2004 3:06:56 PM PDT by The Bandit
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To: The Bandit

One thing I cannot recall being addressed, which in my experience is the FIRST thing a questioned documents examiner wants to know, is "where are the originals"? Does CBS claim to have them? If not, where are the FIRST GENERATION copies? If there are no FIRST GENERATION copies, only these Nth generation copies, WHY IS THAT?

My recollection is that in 1973 copiers were not nearly as ubiquitous as they are today, and cost about 25 cents a pop, the same price as a gallon of gasoline [early 1973], and one did not just go making copies of copies of copies unto the Nth Generation just for fun.


5 posted on 09/10/2004 3:07:54 PM PDT by Flash Bazbeaux ("I'll have the moo goo gai pan without the pan, and some pans.")
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To: HardStarboard

There will be a lot of dancing going on at CBS Headquarters and Dan Rather will be doing the Do-Si-Do! Ya gotta love it!! Dan "Blather" Rather caught with his pants down, again....


6 posted on 09/10/2004 3:09:55 PM PDT by tuvals (America First - Support Our Troops!)
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To: Flash Bazbeaux
One thing I cannot recall being addressed, which in my experience is the FIRST thing a questioned documents examiner wants to know, is "where are the originals"? Does CBS claim to have them? If not, where are the FIRST GENERATION copies? If there are no FIRST GENERATION copies, only these Nth generation copies, WHY IS THAT?

My recollection is that in 1973 copiers were not nearly as ubiquitous as they are today, and cost about 25 cents a pop, the same price as a gallon of gasoline [early 1973], and one did not just go making copies of copies of copies unto the Nth Generation just for fun.

Particularly since CBS said these were from Killian's "personal files." Why wouldn't they be originals? And Killian's wife, son and daughter all say the docs didn't come from them.

7 posted on 09/10/2004 3:11:24 PM PDT by NYCVirago
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To: need_a_screen_name
* The vertical spacing used in the memos, measured at 13 points, is not available in typewriters, and only became possible with the advent of computers."

Out of curiosity, what is the default setting for vertical spacing in MS Word?

8 posted on 09/10/2004 3:11:58 PM PDT by ez (TERRORISTS FOR KERRY!!!)
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To: The Bandit
BTTth
9 posted on 09/10/2004 3:12:36 PM PDT by EdReform (Free Republic - helping to keep our country a free republic. Thank you for your financial support!)
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To: The Bandit

There are more than eight additional issues.

Just a few that come to mind:
9. LTC Killian could not type.
10. The centering of the letterhead was almost impossible.
11. Major differences in the signature.
12. Wrong month specified for the flight physical.
13. Wrong use of abbreviations in general.
14. Wrong date format (zeros were not used prior to the day of the month back then).
15. Reference to LTC Killian's superior officers was made improperly.

etc.

I'm sure many Freepers can come up with much more than this without even breaking a sweat...


10 posted on 09/10/2004 3:13:19 PM PDT by EternalHope (Boycott everything French forever. Including their vassal nations.)
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To: The Bandit

They can't even prove that they did any credible, due deligence, must less explain anything in the memo.

John


11 posted on 09/10/2004 3:13:50 PM PDT by John_7Diamonds
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To: ez

The spacing varies with the font size. Think of trying to fit both 8 & 30 point characters into one "standard" height spacing.


12 posted on 09/10/2004 3:20:43 PM PDT by GoLightly
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To: ez

* The vertical spacing used in the memos, measured at 13 points, is not available in typewriters, and only became possible with the advent of computers."

Out of curiosity, what is the default setting for vertical spacing in MS Word?

----

can't say... but I would guess 13 points?


13 posted on 09/10/2004 3:20:50 PM PDT by need_a_screen_name
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To: The Bandit

I would add the fact that the correct abbreviation for a Lieutenant Colonel was, and is, LTC, not "Lt. Colonel". This was the "style" mandated by military regulations in the
late '60s and early 70s. Use of "Lt. Colonel" is a common
civilian usage and mistake committed by folks not familiar
with military acronyms and abbreviations.


14 posted on 09/10/2004 3:22:45 PM PDT by miele man
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To: The Bandit
5) CBS News will need to produce official documents from the era that used "MEMORANDUM FOR" as it was never used in the 1970's.

I'm glad someone else noticed this. The memo style looks very much like current Army style, which came in around 1990 and is a bit different than what it was prior to then. It should be easy to come up with the Air Force regulation defining the rules of preparing memoranda (which is what the TANG would be using presumably).

15 posted on 09/10/2004 3:23:14 PM PDT by fnord (Being humble doesn't mean thinking less of yourself. It means thinking more of others.)
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To: The Bandit

16 posted on 09/10/2004 3:24:24 PM PDT by VadeRetro
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To: The Bandit
Sean Hannity is all over this like A CHEAP SUIT!

CBS is going to be DONE LIKE A BAKED POTATO!

Details and Killians relatives on Hannity SHOW TONIGHT.

Tune in for the CBS BAR B QUE!

17 posted on 09/10/2004 3:25:58 PM PDT by agincourt1415 (Cinder Blocks cannot stop 155mph winds.)
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To: The Bandit

What a debacle for CBS and their candidate, who continues to have a bad August even though its now September.


18 posted on 09/10/2004 3:26:37 PM PDT by Senator Goldwater
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To: miele man

As well...my father was a 30 year naval veteran. He signed his name A.A.MOREL, CDR USN. If I ever saw the common mistake many civilians use CMDR, I would jump and scream "FAKE!!!!!!!!!!" So this LT. COLONEL vs. LTC thing really hits home for me. "FAKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"


19 posted on 09/10/2004 3:27:27 PM PDT by rlmorel
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To: John_7Diamonds
They can't even prove that they did any credible, due deligence, must less explain anything in the memo.

That's what jumped out at me when I read CBS's self-defense. They claim that they did have experts look at these documents. Seems like their "experts" are telling their journalists what they want to hear, instead of what they need to know.

If I'm the new broadcast editor at CBS News, these so-called experts are where I start the housecleaning -- right after I have Dan Rather removed from the studio by security live on the air.

20 posted on 09/10/2004 3:30:12 PM PDT by TheyConvictedOglethorpe
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