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Americans reveal Russian MiGs in Venezuela
LENTY.RU ^ | September 17th, 2004

Posted on 09/17/2004 10:21:22 AM PDT by struwwelpeter

15:21 2004-09-17

American military intelligence confirms that the Venezuelan ministry of defense has several new MiG-29 fighters. The MiG-29s for now located on one of the bases in the region of Lake Maracaibo. The fighters periodically perform training flights in the region of Curacao island in the Caribbean sea, where they were detected by the American military. Information about Venezuela's MiG-29s was also confirmed by representatives of the Columbian ministry of defence.

The purchase of Russian fighters, according to the American military, is part of a long-term plan by the Venezuelan ministry of defense to upgrade their air forces. Venezuela plans to buy about 50 Russian MiG-29 fighters in various modifications, with 40 single-seat and 10 dual-seat models. Venezuela plans to spend about 5 billion dollars for the Russian fighters, including missiles and special aviation and airfield equipment.

Until recently the only MiG-29s in Latin America were used by Peru and Cuba. Cuba only has six MiG-29s.

(Excerpt) Read more at lenty.ru ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: latinamerica; mig; napalminthemorning; russia; venezuela
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Probably posted somewhere else under a different title, perhaps this has new details.
1 posted on 09/17/2004 10:21:24 AM PDT by struwwelpeter
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To: struwwelpeter

All that money we give them for oil had to be drained off somehow.


2 posted on 09/17/2004 10:26:14 AM PDT by norraad ("What light!">Blues Brothers)
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To: struwwelpeter

...hmmmm, this would be pretty cool thing to see next month when I'm in Curacao....a little M-29 fly by would be interesting.


3 posted on 09/17/2004 10:30:39 AM PDT by taxed2death (A few billion here, a few trillion there...we're all friends right?)
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To: struwwelpeter
I wonder how the poor of Venezuela, Chavez's "people", will benefit from the purchase of these MiG-29s?


4 posted on 09/17/2004 10:32:38 AM PDT by xrp (Executing assigned posting duties flawlessly -- ZERO mistakes)
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To: xrp
I wonder how the poor of Venezuela, Chavez's "people", will benefit from the purchase of these MiG-29s?

They will benefit by the protection the MiGs provide against them, oops, I mean for them.

5 posted on 09/17/2004 10:36:08 AM PDT by vollmond (DS2 CV-66 83-87)
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To: xrp

Theres not a single country in Latin America that needs MIG-29s. This just starts a minor-league problem between Venezuela and all of its neighbors. There was a period in the 1960s where almost of the dictators in Latin America was using its military to threaten neighbors...thus keeping their instablity out of the press. It appears that we are going full-circle now.


6 posted on 09/17/2004 10:36:22 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: struwwelpeter

of course who will be flying these 29's for chavez? Does he know planes take pilots?


7 posted on 09/17/2004 10:40:24 AM PDT by Walkingfeather (q)
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To: struwwelpeter

Chavez is becoming more of a headache than he's worth. I think he'll lose his job sometime after our election.


8 posted on 09/17/2004 10:40:47 AM PDT by HawaiianGecko (Member of the Pajamanistas for over a whole month now!)
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To: HawaiianGecko

beware the Ides of November....I like it!


9 posted on 09/17/2004 10:42:31 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: HawaiianGecko

Not just his job but his life.


10 posted on 09/17/2004 10:42:31 AM PDT by Broker (Grand Pa Pettibones)
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To: struwwelpeter

Wow-if the numbers are confirmed,it will be the largest single buy of Mig-29s by a nation after India brought nearly 80 in the late 1980s.Going by the current trend,the variant probably will be the multi-role Mig-29SMT.MIG has been having a quiet revival of sorts with Algeria also showing interest in the Mig-29SMT & India deciding to buy the new generation Mig-29K for the carrier, it is buying from Russia.


11 posted on 09/17/2004 10:44:18 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
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To: Walkingfeather

1-800-Rent-a-Rus


12 posted on 09/17/2004 10:46:12 AM PDT by BroncosFan (NJ 2005: Schundler for Governor)
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To: struwwelpeter

This is not going to make the Colombians very happy at all..


13 posted on 09/17/2004 10:51:31 AM PDT by Paradox (Occam was probably right.)
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Comment #14 Removed by Moderator

To: daumal

Does anyone know how old of a model the MIG-29 is?


15 posted on 09/17/2004 10:56:09 AM PDT by sargon (How could anyone vote for the socialist, weak-on-defense fraud named John Kerry?)
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To: struwwelpeter
MiG-29s, up close and personal.


16 posted on 09/17/2004 10:56:14 AM PDT by GalaxieFiveHundred
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To: Walkingfeather
of course who will be flying these 29's for chavez? Does he know planes take pilots?

The same pilots that fly the F-16 fighter.

17 posted on 09/17/2004 10:58:13 AM PDT by ScreamingFist (Peace through Ignorance)
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To: struwwelpeter
Military Deals "Way of Influencing World Power Shifts", Says Putin (6/11/2001)
18 posted on 09/17/2004 10:59:47 AM PDT by Askel5 ( Cooperatio voluntaria ad suicidium est legi morali contraria. )
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To: GalaxieFiveHundred

Beautiful pic, now that's a keeper.


19 posted on 09/17/2004 11:02:40 AM PDT by struwwelpeter
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To: BroncosFan
FAV F-16s were used in combat during the military coup on November 27th, 1992 against Carlos Andres Perez (at that time President of Venezuela).

FAV= Venezuela Air Force.

20 posted on 09/17/2004 11:04:37 AM PDT by ScreamingFist (Peace through Ignorance)
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To: struwwelpeter

BTTT


21 posted on 09/17/2004 11:06:19 AM PDT by Fiddlstix (This Tagline for sale. (Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: sargon
Does anyone know how old of a model the MIG-29 is?

First went operational in early 80's, with upgraded export models developed in the mid-latter 90's.

22 posted on 09/17/2004 11:12:19 AM PDT by GalaxieFiveHundred
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To: pepsionice
"Theres not a single country in Latin America that needs MIG-29s. This just starts a minor-league problem between Venezuela and all of its neighbors. There was a period in the 1960s where almost of the dictators in Latin America was using its military to threaten neighbors...thus keeping their instablity out of the press. It appears that we are going full-circle now.

That is the best thing that can happen for us. If ever all the states in SA get together under one leadership we will have a big problem. That is the only group of countries that has a land route into the good old USA and Mexico would not slow them down for more than 10 min.

23 posted on 09/17/2004 11:12:45 AM PDT by Flint
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To: sargon

"the Fulcrum entered series production in 1982 "
http://www.saunalahti.fi/~fta/MiG-29.htm

The basic design is a contemporary of competing American designs.

Similar aircraft:
# F/A-18 Hornet
# F-16 Fighting Falcon
# F-15 Eagle
# Su-27 Flanker
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/russia/airdef/mig-29.htm


24 posted on 09/17/2004 11:14:12 AM PDT by PAR35
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To: Walkingfeather

They have been operating US supplied F-16s since 1983. The same package deal for F-16 conversion will be provided by the Russians for the MiG-29s.


25 posted on 09/17/2004 11:14:40 AM PDT by Tommyjo
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: GalaxieFiveHundred

Latter 90's export refurb, eh?

They looked relatively modern.

Prolly not much of a match for America's latest, though...


27 posted on 09/17/2004 11:15:00 AM PDT by sargon (How could anyone vote for the socialist, weak-on-defense fraud named John Kerry?)
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Comment #28 Removed by Moderator

To: struwwelpeter

Interesting. So, with some of the stand off weapons these can carry (including tac nuke ones) this starts to become disturbing. Personally I think it is time to return to gunboat diplomacy and the Monroe Doctrine.


29 posted on 09/17/2004 11:19:40 AM PDT by GOP_1900AD (Stomping on "PC," destroying the Left, and smoking out faux "conservatives" - Right makes right!)
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To: Tommyjo
The same package deal for F-16 conversion will be provided by the Russians for the MiG-29s.

Could you clarify hat please? Some time ago, Venezeuela requested a batch of F-16C/Ds, but the US government blocked the request.

30 posted on 09/17/2004 11:22:00 AM PDT by ScreamingFist (Peace through Ignorance)
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To: sargon

Well if upgraded with Israeli & French electronics(as India has done) & hooked up with AWACS vectoring & competent pilots,Russian planes like the Mig-29 & Su-27/30 can stand up confidently to systems like the F-15 or F-16,though not the F/A-22(which is ,well another class).


31 posted on 09/17/2004 11:22:01 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
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To: struwwelpeter
The vulnerable flank. Reagan did a terrific job in Latin America. Both Bushes have made a mess there and have caved in to the Jimmy Carter interests and relied upon Carter people. That and their so-called energy policy are real blind spots, but the Dems cannot capitalize upon these vulnerabilities because they have been even worse.
32 posted on 09/17/2004 11:28:34 AM PDT by AmericanVictory (Should we be more like them, or they like us?)
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To: sargon
Latter 90's export refurb, eh? They looked relatively modern. Prolly not much of a match for America's latest, though...

The ejection system apprears to work well enough, and fuselage makes an nifty post hole digger!


33 posted on 09/17/2004 11:34:02 AM PDT by GalaxieFiveHundred
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To: struwwelpeter
NATO media has declared Putin as the main target (example : after Beslan, they are openly accusing Putin of being a murder of the children.)
So for Russia anything other than declaring NATO the target of a pre-emptive strike would be suicide.
34 posted on 09/17/2004 11:47:27 AM PDT by Truth666
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To: norraad

Money we GAVE them for oil? You speak of PURCHASING a product, the right to purchase which was won via pre-Bush trade agreements?? Cut me a break


35 posted on 09/17/2004 12:26:32 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions=Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: xrp

Chavez was funded with UN blood for oil money via a mutual friend to both Chavez and Castro, Saddam Hussein. This isn't new news. Maybe the media finally deigned to notice it NOW, but it might carry more journalistic weight if it had been news two years ago. Mass media loses again.


36 posted on 09/17/2004 12:33:17 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions=Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: struwwelpeter

Don't worry.
Jimmy Carter will make sure that his buddy Chavez only uses these for peaceful purposes.


37 posted on 09/17/2004 12:37:13 PM PDT by bear11 ("In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act." George Orwell)
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To: taxed2death
My daughter is an RN and has been talking about spending two weeks in Venezuela with a mission that inoculates kids and does other medical work. Her husband could go with her, but I think they both need to stay home. Can anyone give me any ammunition for my stand?

Carolyn

38 posted on 09/17/2004 12:40:48 PM PDT by CDHart
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To: struwwelpeter

Another Cuba forming on mainland.

Rockets will follow, then nukes.


39 posted on 09/17/2004 12:51:02 PM PDT by MonroeDNA (Kerry is a traitor)
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To: struwwelpeter

And exactly what purpose do they serve?


40 posted on 09/17/2004 12:52:43 PM PDT by Casloy
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To: struwwelpeter

Providing the US with future Targets at a later date. We are eventualy gonna have to do something down there, it can not continue the way it is going.


41 posted on 09/17/2004 12:53:17 PM PDT by eastforker (Maybe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure what I said is what I meant_John Kerry)
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To: cake_crumb

I've heard that Larry Ellison (of Oracle Corp. fame) owns a MiG-29. Maybe we can get Larry to attack the Venezuelan Air Force.


42 posted on 09/17/2004 12:55:26 PM PDT by xrp (Executing assigned posting duties flawlessly -- ZERO mistakes)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Key word, "competent pilots" , I doubt they have any.


43 posted on 09/17/2004 12:56:03 PM PDT by eastforker (Maybe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure what I said is what I meant_John Kerry)
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To: BroncosFan
1-800-Rent-a-Rus

That worked for the North Vietnamese in the 60's.

44 posted on 09/17/2004 12:57:03 PM PDT by ASA Vet (Tourette's syndrome is just a $&#$*!% excuse for poor *%$#** language skills.)
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To: MonroeDNA

Forming?? It's BEEN there since Chavez took over. Clinton went down to Venezuela to rig the elections and be wined and dined by Chaves. Chaves isn't a charter member, but still part of the inner circle of the Turd Way. As is Putin, BTW.


45 posted on 09/17/2004 12:58:29 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions=Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: ASA Vet

Yemen is the 90s too. A lot of skilled help out there in need of the paycheck that an oil state can provide.


46 posted on 09/17/2004 1:01:22 PM PDT by BroncosFan (NJ 2005: Schundler for Governor)
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To: xrp

Well....the certain types of people in the US happen to have fighter jets capable of giving a MiG29 a run for their money. Fully armed and registered with the Dept of Homeland Security. Combine all those people...Chaves can kiss his nether regions goodbye.


47 posted on 09/17/2004 1:02:16 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions=Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: PAR35
The basic design is a contemporary of competing American designs.

Your list has the Su-27?

48 posted on 09/17/2004 1:02:18 PM PDT by ASA Vet (Tourette's syndrome is just a $&#$*!% excuse for poor *%$#** language skills.)
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To: eastforker
We are eventualy gonna have to do something down there, it can not continue the way it is going.

Yep. Definitely. The Dems know it too, and drool venom in anticipation of Iran-Contra redux.

49 posted on 09/17/2004 1:07:13 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions=Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: Casloy
And exactly what purpose do they serve?

Intercepting Stealth bombers?

MiG-29s and Su-27s have a little-known tracking device called the OEhPS, or Electro-optical Search and Track, sometimes known as Infrared Seach and Track. This device can detect the heat of an aircraft and is not bothered by radar-jamming or minimalization.

It's biggest benefit is that it's passive, emitting no signals that can warn its target. Those old movies where the pilot starts yelling "He's got lock on!" refer to radar target acquistion, but the OEhPS gives no warning until a missile comes up your exhaust pipe.

ANY escalation of military technology in Latin America is bad. For the US, and for Venezuela's neighbors. FIFTY modern interceptors is a big worry, much more than far-away Cuba's half-dozen.

50 posted on 09/17/2004 1:42:30 PM PDT by struwwelpeter
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