Putin: Ally or Terrorist? (Russian FSB/KGB Real Culprits Behind "Chechen Terrorism")

The New American ^ | February 2002 | William Jasper

[Luis Gonzalez]

The Guardian is fully on the side of Putin on this.

Attack the source, ignore the issue.

[A. Pole]

[Destro:] So is Poland a Trojan Horse nation working for the secret KGB?

[GIJoel:]YES.

Heady stuff!

[Poohbah]

OK, the harmonic balance of the Universe has been shot to hell: I agree with you.

[Luis Gonzalez]

You think Pravda is anti-Putin, pro-Islamic?

Pravda.RU:Russia:More in detail

Special forces use tanks to kill terrorists
16:54 2004-09-03
A group of militants has been blocked in the south of Beslan. A special unit of the Caucasian military district is struggling with the terrorists. Tank fire can be heard in the area of the building, where the encircled gunmen are hiding, Interfax said. Battle helicopters are hovering over the area.

Local residents are doing their best to help the military men find the terrorists. One of the suicide bombers is reportedly hiding somewhere in the town.

Newsru

[Poohbah]

OK. But be VERY careful re: the Guardian; any relationship between what they report and what actually happens is purely coincidental...

BTW, I really don't give a damn HOW Islamist terrorists die. As long as they're dead, they're good terrorists.

Of course, my response to 9/11 would've involved saturation nuclear bombardment of the Islamic world; the war would be long over.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"Yeah, I do. They haven't used WMDs. They could simply flatten Chechnya...and Dagestan...and most of Northern Iran. They haven't. Ergo, they are holding back."

Oh...I see.

They could have engaged in more effective genocide, so they get a pass from you on the genocide they've engaged in thus far?

[Destro]

The building is the one the terrorists escaped into not the school one.

[Poohbah]

The only people who call it genocide are the shills for the Islamists.

[MarMema]

When the Tsar sent his fleets to NYC and San Fran harbors in 1861 as a direct threat to England and France not to enterfer in the War between the States. In the Boxer Rebelion, in WW1 and WW2 and in Afghanistan. When Putin came out on record that he gave evidence on Saddam's hanky panky to Bush and when he defended Bush's war on TV and reminded our left media of the Kosovo blunder.

I'd say that's a pretty good start.

[UltraKonservativen]

Wait a minute! before you go buying into all this double crossing bulfeathers conspiracy..ask yourself
1) What do the russians want from Chechnya?
2) Isn't there an easier way to get it than to fake horrible terrorist crimes?
3) Get real

[Luis Gonzalez]

"Of course, my response to 9/11 would've involved saturation nuclear bombardment of the Islamic world; the war would be long over."

That would have included bombing the US to rid pursleves of the ten million Muslims here.

Here are your primary targets:

Rank	Country	Muslim Population
1	Indonesia	182,570,000
2	Pakistan	134,480,000
3	India	121,000,000
4	Bangladesh	114,080,000
5	Turkey	65,510,000
6	Iran	62,430,000
7	Egypt	58,630,000
8	Nigeria	53,000,000
9	Algeria	30,530,000
10	Morocco	28,780,000
You would have the United States, Ronald Reagan's shining city on a hill, the last best hope of man on this Earth, be forever remembered at the worst genocidal monster in the history of mankind.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"The only people who call it genocide are the shills for the Islamists."

"Let us call it by its real name," wrote Boston Globe columnist Jeff Jacoby on October 28, 1999. "What Russia is committing in Chechnya is the mass murder of civilians.... And not only is the West failing to rise up against his [Putin’s] bloodbath, it is actively helping to finance it,"

Jeff Jacoby...Islamist chill.

[Poohbah]

You would have the United States, Ronald Reagan's shining city on a hill, the last best hope of man on this Earth, be forever remembered at the worst genocidal monster in the history of mankind.

Trust me, Islamists are working assiduously toward that goal. I'd just beat them to the punch. "Do unto others what they intend to do to you; but do it first."

Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice; moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.

[Poohbah]

Jeff Jacoby...Islamist chill.

He got his info from CAIR and the WRMEA.

[quant5]

OK - Here is my opinion of all this information or disinformation, whatever you want to call it. All of the CURRENT facts show Putin squashing democracy and grabbing autonomous power. The CURRENT facts are revealing that Russia is going back towards Communism and Socialism at best. I don't know if it is a coincidence this is happening or if this ex-KGB defector Gloitzny or whatever his name is revealed the secret plan. It does not matter to me.

What does matter is that we must be wary of a guy (Putin) who's whole life was dedicated to hate the West and defeat us. Also Russia is a country that openly has supported terrorist regimes for decades. When I see Putin ordering the termination of the Iranian nuclear project and demanding all fissle fuels and components be shipped back to Russia, then I will will have some faith. Till then, I still see Russia as a VERY big dangerous enemy.

[struwwelpeter]

Here's an oldie but a goodie:

Maskhadov supports US and UK activities in Iraq

NEWS RU.com (3/28/2003)

Aslan Maskhadov expressed his support of the United States and Great Britain, whose efforts are directed toward the overthrow of a "cruel dictator", but called on Washington and the international coalition after their urgent undertakings, to resolve the Russian-Chechnyan conflict. This information was published by one of the Chechyan separatist agencies.

Chief the so-called political department of the ministry of foreign affairs of the unacknowledged republic of Ichkeriya Roman Halilov stated to the ANSA agency that "the war in Iraq raises many questions, but one can be expressed with the confidence: Saddam is a cruel dictator... and the international community has a right to challenge similar tyrants to answer for their actions".

"The Chechyan people offers to the people of Iraq their friendliest feelings and considers that the Iraqis, and all peoples of the world will win only if Saddam Hussein - a protege of the former communist USSR and KGB who is also openly supported by the Putin regime which wages genocide on the Chechnyan people - is cast down", added Roman Halilov.

This statement by Maskhadov caused sharp censure from the official government the Chechnyan Republic and by representatives of clergy.

[quant5]

"Both are mental and moral nincompoops, and I don't mind being quoted on that."

I'll vote for Bush the cowboy but other then that, your right about both men. I don't believe the conspiracy theorists. Drawing conclusions on evidence from "reporters" or media with no credibility whatsoever convinces me of nothing.

I think Russia started an ugly war, committed war crimes and now hapless widows of murdered Chechens are getting their revenge against innocent children. The behavior of the terrorists there are all consistent with the rest of the terrorists in every other continent. Outright satanic.

[quant5]

"Did he or did he not order the actions that killed the people in the Moscow theater?"

No, he did not order the actions that got those people killed. The terrorists ordered the action. If it is FSB agents posing as Islamic crazies, then they must be awful good at training dozens of female FSB muslim/whahabbi/chechen double agents. Hey, all is possible but it is a GIANT stretch.

[quant5]

"the Soviets deliberately murdered over 30 million of their own people, and that's the low estimate. Putin is one of them, and now he presides over "Russia."

Yes, they did but the Gulags stopped in the sixties. That is where the mult-millions died. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that you will not be able to support your economic system with such population decreases. In fact, I would wager the Gulags what caused the economic collapse of the Soviet Union a short couple of decades later.

Also, Putin is a very young president. He would have been around 15 when the Gulags stopped, so he did not preside over it as you suggest. Don't get me wrong, I am no fan of Putin at all. I think he is a dangerous adversary but for other reasons.

[John Valentine]

Just to clarify, my intention was not to accuse Bush and Putin of being mental and moral nincompoops - that reference was aimed at the conspiricy theorists.