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PAJAMAHADEEN ALERT: Facts on Humvee Armor Big Media Ignores
Posted on 12/10/2004 7:04:48 PM PST by Doctor Raoul
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To: Doctor Raoul; armyman; Arrowhead1952; darkwing104; txradioguy; Long Cut; Jet Jaguar; SFC Chromey; ..
What ABC, AP, CBS, CNN, FOX, MSNBC, NBC, NY Times DON'T want YOU to know.
The Truth!
41
posted on
12/11/2004 10:03:31 AM PST
by
68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
(Free Republic, where you get the REAL stories that the main stream media refuses to carry!)
To: TADSLOS
What horsefeathers. Future wars are not going to be over in 4 days just because somebody wishes they would be. That is absurd. You train and plan as you fight, not the other way around. Shall we issue all our men only one mag because the war should be over as soon as each shoots a couple of the enemy? And call it deployable logistics and staying focused on rapid decision?
The rapid redeploy go light crowd have gone round the bend on this one. We aren't 96 hours into an emergency war where the number one priority is whether something fits in a C-130. We've had years to ship whatever we want on a slow boat clear around the world, we've spent tens of billions, we have thousands of contractors in country, we've know IEDs were the enemy's preferred means for almost a year and a half.
Wars sometimes are matters of attrition that last years, and we should win them anyway. Those wishing it were not so are wishing, not facing military realities. I'm all for rapidly breaking the enemy's main fielded forces, but only in maneuverist cartoons do wars end with a cheering section and a parade because somebody drove behind the enemy. In the real world, you have to hold the ground and kill anyone who still wants some, as long as it takes. Learn a lesson from reality every once and a while.
42
posted on
12/11/2004 10:12:08 AM PST
by
JasonC
To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub; WorkingClassFilth; Doctor Raoul
An old-timer aquaintance of mine recounts tales of welding Sherman armor in a circle of GI's holding ponchos so the Germans couldn't see the salvage operation going on.
Difference is today some MSM reporter would get behind those ponchos in a "brave" attempt to try to earn a name for himself by reporting that we were deceiving the enemy.
43
posted on
12/11/2004 10:13:27 AM PST
by
Fawnn
(Canteen wOOhOO Consultant and CookingWithPam.com person - Faith makes things possible, not easy.)
To: Doctor Raoul
44
posted on
12/11/2004 10:27:07 AM PST
by
Mr. K
((this space for rent))
To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
46
posted on
12/11/2004 10:32:56 AM PST
by
E.G.C.
To: Doctor Raoul; lodwick; Cuttnhorse; operation clinton cleanup; Servant of the 9; catpuppy; ...
I called UPS. They will ship to Iraq, but you have to pick up your shippment at their offices in Baghdad or Basra. They don't deliver to anyone's door. WHAT?!?!?!?!
UPS doesn't do home deliveries in Iraq ?!?!?!?
I Demand a Federal Investigation as to why!!
/ s >
47
posted on
12/11/2004 10:36:15 AM PST
by
Mo1
(Should be called Oil for Fraud and not Oil for Food)
To: Doctor Raoul
Tell all liberals: We could just drop one biiiig bomb and solve the whole problem.
48
posted on
12/11/2004 10:48:27 AM PST
by
bannie
(Jamma Nana!)
To: Doctor Raoul
This whole kerfluffle raises some hard questions and I don't know where to get the answers.
- How many of our troops were killed while riding in regular HumVees?
- How many were killed by weapons the armor would have defeated? One general pointed out that some IEDs have flipped tanks over.
- How would the terrorists have altered their tactics & weapons if all the HumVees had been armored?
- If the Administration knew there would be an insurgency of this scope after the war, would they have removed Saddam anyway?
- Would it have been a viable argument to say Saddam is a gathering threat but, in case there's an insurgency afterward, we need to wait until our HumVees are up-armored before we can remove him?
- If we did first up-armor the HumVees, how many nanoseconds would elapse before liberal pantywaists complained the "military-industrial complex" was enriching themselves using money that should go to schools?
Feel free to add your own
To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
To: Muzzle_em
51
posted on
12/11/2004 11:41:32 AM PST
by
Seeking the truth
( www.0cents.com - Pajama Patrol Badge stuff is here!!)
To: SLB
52
posted on
12/11/2004 11:43:39 AM PST
by
Seeking the truth
( www.0cents.com - Pajama Patrol Badge stuff is here!!)
To: TC Rider
ggod point: the Humvee was designed as a rapid deployment vehicle, not as an armored one; an up-armored Humvee M1114 weighs 2000 lbs more than an unarmored one, resulting in sluggish performance, stabilty/suspension issues, increased wear and tear, etc.
53
posted on
12/11/2004 11:56:06 AM PST
by
FBD
("You have enemies? Good-That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." Churchhill)
To: Mr. K
I think the administration should view it as useful feedback and say they will be talking to the troops directly like this from now on The administration viewed it from the start as useful feedback. What on earth made you think they didn't?
To: cyncooper
I think I meant to say that the administration should tell the MEDIA to F@&* OFF
55
posted on
12/11/2004 12:10:26 PM PST
by
Mr. K
((this space for rent))
To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub; JasonC; All
The up-armored M1114 Humvee adds 2,000 pounds of weight to the standard Humvee, for a standard protection kit.
I understand that this additional weight results in excessive suspension wear, sluggish performance, etc.
The drive train and suspension also need to be beefed up, to handle this extra weight.
Why weren't the Humvee armored in the first place?
(snip):
http://www.defense-update.com/features/du-3-04/up-armored-humvee.htm "During and after the Kosovo conflict, the US Army decided to protect a small part of its Humvee fleet. The armored version would be heavier resulting in reduced deployment flexibility. The US Marine Corps, requiring operational speed for its forces, opted not to protect its Humvees.
Where active combat role was considered, the Humvee was selected for its excellent cross country and road, air and helicopter mobility and load capacity.
"It was never intended to perform as armored combat vehicles. Such specification precluded armor protection, in order to maintain its low empty weight and thus high mobility standard."
http://www.defense-update.com/features/du-3-04/up-armored-humvee.htm
56
posted on
12/11/2004 12:16:26 PM PST
by
FBD
("You have enemies? Good-That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." Churchhill)
To: Doctor Raoul
Is Durbin a hypocrite for saying anything while he protects the pork at home? That a rhetorical question, right?
As the correct answer is "A" - Yes of course he is. And that's his good point!
BTW, Durbin doesn't bring any pork home (nothing of 'value' anyway). He could give two shi'ites about Illinois, the state he is supposed to represent. And as to the Rock Island Arsenal, he'd be pleased as punch if the place closed down tomorrow and a HUGE abortion clinic replaced it. And IIRC next to CA & NY we get LESS our our tax dollars back than any other state.
In plain English -- Durbin SUCKS!!
Wait.... I lied. His other 'good point' is that he does answer all his mail, even from known self-admitted Republicans. But he still sucks.
57
posted on
12/11/2004 12:28:58 PM PST
by
Condor51
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Gen G Patton<P>)
To: x1stcav
"They have it a lot better than in my day, the same as I had it a lot better than in my father's, etc." -whaaaaat? you mean you didn't have one of these bad boys with a remote controlled weapon? ;^D
IDF Up-Armored M-1113 ECV with remote controlled weapon station
58
posted on
12/11/2004 12:31:05 PM PST
by
FBD
("You have enemies? Good-That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." Churchhill)
To: Mr. K
To: Doctor Raoul
60
posted on
12/11/2004 12:38:59 PM PST
by
Ernest_at_the_Beach
(A Proud member of Free Republic ~~The New Face of the Fourth Estate since 1996.)
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