Posted on 02/22/2005 12:46:48 PM PST by Clint N. Suhks
ROME (Reuters) - Homosexual marriages are part of "a new ideology of evil" that is insidiously threatening society, Pope John Paul says in a new book published Tuesday.
In "Memory and Identity," the Pope also calls abortion a "legal extermination" comparable to attempts to wipe out Jews and other groups in the 20th century.
He also reveals that he is convinced the Turkish gunman who shot him in 1981 did not act alone and suggests that the former Communist Bloc may have been behind the plot to kill him.
The 84-year-old Pontiff's book, a highly philosophical and intricate work on the nature of good and evil, is based on conversations with philosopher friends in 1993 and later with some of his aides.
In one section about the role of lawmakers, the Pope takes another swipe at gay marriages when he refers to "pressures" on the European Parliament to allow them.
"It is legitimate and necessary to ask oneself if this is not perhaps part of a new ideology of evil, perhaps more insidious and hidden, which attempts to pit human rights against the family and against man," he writes.
The Pope's fifth book for mass circulation, issued by Italian publisher Rizzoli, sparked controversy in Germany and elsewhere after Jewish groups protested against leaked excerpts comparing the Holocaust to abortion.
In at least two sections of the book, the Pope talks about the Nazi attempt to exterminate Jews and the wholesale slaughter of political opponents by Communist regimes after World War II.
"LEGAL EXTERMINATION"
In following paragraphs he says that legally elected parliaments in formerly totalitarian countries were today allowing what he called new forms of evil and new exterminations.
"There is still, however a legal extermination of human beings who have been conceived but not yet born," he writes.
(Excerpt) Read more at reuters.myway.com ...
I didn't kick him in the teeth--that's your characterization. I was making the point that his conservatism in matters of morals is at odds with his liberalism in matters of faith. It's a distinction lost on many Catholics who presume that because he is conservative in the one area, he is also on their side in the other. This isn't true--and it's one of the bones of contention between traditionalists and conservative Catholics. Conservative Catholics make abortion and homosexuality their touchstones--but ignore the breakdown in faith as a result of failed papal policies and the introduction of doctrinal novelties. This was an important distinction to bring up in that context. It is not enough that the Pope says gay marriage is wrong--even other religionists will say as much. He needs to start defending Catholic Tradition and the deposit of faith--and this he doesn't do.
If you teach,spent a semester on World War II and developed your final to gage what your students had learned,would you give high marks to the student who turned in his test with a very comprehensive description of the French Revolution?
Seriously, if you take the time to check it out, there is a substantial body of prophecy - both in scripture and in private revelation - that the Church must and will mimic the passion, death, and resurrection of Christ.
I really dont care if you think I am crazy......we are going to Calvary, even as I write this.
It is fitting.
Well, step back and take a closer look at it for a minute. In all honesty, there's no kick of teeth here. The hard truths have to addressed.
There can be observed a genuine incongruity between the true state of things in the Church and in the world, and the sort of giddy reaction to the pope saying the right thing. There's a problem with portraying a bright side when that bright side consists of hurraying the upholding of the most basic, the most elementary, of truths. There's a minimalism there that flys in the face of our real and true condition at this time.
What ultima pointed out is true. What's more, things done right cannot cancel things out things done wrong or things left undone. The best thing that could have been done would have been to uphold the Catholicism of tradition in principle and practice all these years; if this had been done, the opposition to evil would have been in the doing and not just in the saying.
There's no kicking in of teeth here. Just an identifying of the very origin of moral decay: loss of the Catholic Faith, loss of its proper practice in abundance in the world. More of this in existence in the world would improve virtually everything else. Somebody's got to say it. It takes more guts than celebrating.
It's not viewed that way on this end; not at all.
I know Ph.Ds who are idiots also. But that was not my point. My point was that I was not lacking in literacy, that my comments about this pope were reasoned and based on facts. As for the Pope's style--I have yet to find anyone who can tell me what Crossing the Threshold of Hope was all about--or Redemptor Hominis. What does he mean when he says "Man is the path the Church must follow?" Such a sentiment is strange coming from a pope--and hardly even Catholic. Man should be following the Church, not the other way around. And both should be following Christ.
Well said. Wish I'd put it so well.
Since when are we taking exams around here?If you'll look at my first post--it was on topic. I made the distinction between the Pope's conservatism in matters of morality and his liberalism in matters of faith. I was pounced on and had to fight off the pack for daring to call the Pope liberal.
There is no denying that you do make some great points. "Man is the path the Church must follow" is a very troubling sentence, I agree. I will have to wait until I read Threshold of Hope and Redemptor Hominis before any more comments. What year were they published?
Just as with the Church,so it is with the Pope. One has to read with the knowledge of what has been said before,many of you do not wish to see anything but trouble,when it come to Pope John Paul II. So when he says something that is totally in line with Catholic teaching you leap frog to another subject and hold the Pope,speaking on the other subject up for ridicule.
You only diminish yourself and your compadres and I speak as one who has had much empathy and respect for your position in the past but observing the action on Free Republic lately,I am fast losing it.
I'll say it again, you can't kill the truth because it is self evident.
i recognize you and the place you come from and just want to say thanks. God bless.
My comment about the test was drawing on a previous discussion we had and I thought you said you lectured or taught,nevertheless I know you got my drift.
You're right and there'll be no shortage of Pilates along the way.
Praising God with a nervous tremble here
God bless
I think it's as simple as the fact that you don't have a grasp on exactly what the action consists of. You mischaracterize the nature of what's taking place here.
Consider this: if you had, in the past, respect for a position but then later change your mind based upon your perception of the actions of others, then your original respect had more to do with character than it did thought or idea or principle.
In other words, it was based on sentiment; a sort of personalizing of what's supposed to be based upon principle.
Sentiments, they come and they go. Principles are steadfast. You need to approach this discussion from principle.
Nobody is going to feel compelled to ran after that respect in order to retreive it. It's your job to seek and find it.
I have done this and find that the "principles" I supported in common with many of you are no longer as important as I once thought they were. In fact,many of them were really out of step with scripture,which must never be contradicted by "tradition".
My decreasing empathy and respect forced me to step beck an apply the "cui bono" to some positions and issues,and the result was a lessening of support for the hard Traditional positions and an increased understating and support for John Paul II and the Magisterium.
So I guess I should say thankyou to all of you.
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