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The Temple Mount's Jewish History: More Than a Matter of Faith
Camera ^ | 11APR05 | Tamar Sternthal

Posted on 04/11/2005 8:27:52 AM PDT by familyop

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1 posted on 04/11/2005 8:27:52 AM PDT by familyop
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To: SJackson
Ping!
2 posted on 04/11/2005 8:28:28 AM PDT by familyop ("Let us try" sounds better, don't you think? "Essayons" is so...Roman.)
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To: familyop

Interesting. I will bookmark to read later.


3 posted on 04/11/2005 8:38:38 AM PDT by cvq3842
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To: Salem; Alouette; IAF ThunderPilot; jabotinsky; Yehuda; Nachum; Malachi; American in Israel; ...

Temple Mount history - Ping!


4 posted on 04/11/2005 8:39:12 AM PDT by Convert from ECUSA (tired of all the shucking and jiving)
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To: familyop

I very much look forward to the building of the third temple. Then, among other things, this "BCE" and "CE" garbage will be gone for good.


5 posted on 04/11/2005 8:42:03 AM PDT by newgeezer (Just my opinion, of course. Your mileage may vary.)
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To: familyop

Under every mosque is a church or a synagogue.


6 posted on 04/11/2005 8:59:37 AM PDT by WarPaint (Islam out of the USA. No, the world. http://www.protesting-islamd.com)
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To: familyop

b


7 posted on 04/11/2005 9:00:08 AM PDT by MoralSense
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To: 1bigdictator; 1st-P-In-The-Pod; 2sheep; A Jovial Cad; A_Conservative_in_Cambridge; a_witness; ...
FRmail me to be added or removed from this Judaic/pro-Israel ping list.

WARNING: This is a high volume ping list

8 posted on 04/11/2005 9:05:11 AM PDT by Alouette (If I owned Hell and I owned Brooklyn, I'd live in Hell and rent out Brooklyn.)
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To: familyop

The only reason Islam built a mosque on the most holy site of the Jews was to deny it to them. Since Islam is a made up religion that borrowed heavily from Judaism and Christianity, it needed to manufacture for itself an identity.

The whole debacle of the "Dome of the Rock" mosque was akin to a dog urinating on its "territory."

9 posted on 04/11/2005 9:12:31 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: familyop

I'm sick of the MSM spin on this. They perpetuate a legitimate Muslim entitlement to the Temple Mount and perpetuate the myth that only Jewish "extremists" are interested in access to this holy site.

This site was holy to Jews 1000 years before Islam existed.

It is a disgrace that the Israeli government allows the Wafq to control it. Appeasement never works.


10 posted on 04/11/2005 9:30:37 AM PDT by dervish (Let Europe pay for NATO)
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To: familyop

Whose Jerusalem ?
Whose Land ?

1. Nationhood and Jerusalem: Israel became a nation in 1312 B.C.E., two thousand years before the rise of Islam.
2. Arab refugees in Israel began identifying themselves as part of a Palestinian people in 1967, two decades after the establishment of the modern State of Israel.

3. Since the Jewish conquest in 1272 B.C.E; the Jews have had dominion over the land for one thousand years with a continuous presence in the land for the past 3,300 years.

4. The only Arab dominion since the conquest in 635 C.E. lasted no more than 22 years.

5. For over 3,300 years, Jerusalem has been the Jewish capital. Jerusalem has never been the capital of any Arab or Muslim entity. Even when the Jordanians occupied Jerusalem, they never sought to make it their capital, and Arab leaders did not come to visit.

6. Jerusalem is mentioned over 700 times in Tanach, the Jewish Holy Scriptures. Jerusalem is not mentioned once in the Koran.

7. King David founded the city of Jerusalem. Mohammed never came to Jerusalem.

8. Jews pray facing Jerusalem. Muslims pray with their backs toward Jerusalem.

9. Arab and Jewish Refugees In 1948 the Arab refugees were encouraged to leave Israel by Arab leaders promising to purge the land of Jews. Sixty-eight percent left without ever seeing an Israeli soldier.

10. The Jewish refugees were forced to flee from Arab lands due to Arab brutality, persecution and pogroms.

11. The number of Arab refugees who left Israel in 1948 is estimated to be around 630,000. The number of Jewish refugees from Arab lands is estimated to be the same.

12. Arab refugees were INTENTIONALLY not absorbed or integrated into the Arab lands to which they fled, despite the vast Arab territory. Out of the 100,000,000 refugees since World War II, theirs is the only refugee group in the world that has never been absorbed or integrated into their own peoples' lands. Jewish refugees were completely absorbed into Israel, a country no larger than the state of New Jersey.

13. The Arab - Israeli Conflict; The Arabs are represented by eight separate nations, not including the Palestinians. There is only one Jewish nation. The Arab nations initiated all five wars and lost. Israel defended itself each time and won.

14. The P.L.O.'s Charter still calls for the destruction of the State of Israel. Israel has given the Palestinians most of the West Bank land. Autonomy under the Palestinian Authority has supplied them with weapons.

15. Under Jordanian rule, Jewish holy sites were desecrated and the Jews were denied access to places of worship. Under Israeli rule, all Muslim and Christian sites have been preserved and made accessible to people of all faiths.

16. The U.N. Record on Israel and the Arabs: Of the 175 Security Council resolutions passed before 1990, 97 were directed against Israel.

17. Of the 690 General Assembly resolutions voted on before 1990, 429 were directed against Israel.

18. The U.N was silent while 58 Jerusalem Synagogues were destroyed by the Jordanians.

19. The U.N. was silent while the Jordanians systematically desecrated the ancient Jewish cemetery on the Mount of Olives.

20. The U.N. was silent while the Jordanians enforced an apartheid-like policy of preventing Jews from visiting the Temple Mount and the Western Wall.


11 posted on 04/11/2005 9:46:19 AM PDT by Marguerite
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To: Alouette; Convert from ECUSA

Thank you for pinging that out. Too few people know about 586 and 70.


12 posted on 04/11/2005 9:49:37 AM PDT by familyop ("Let us try" sounds better, don't you think? "Essayons" is so...Roman.)
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To: familyop

Your welcome!


13 posted on 04/11/2005 10:05:34 AM PDT by Convert from ECUSA (tired of all the shucking and jiving)
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To: familyop
Of course the media don't believe the Jewish Temples stood there. That's in the Bible and the Bible is "mythology" (chas vechalilah!). Besides, isn't that the "redneck" book that advocates "oppressing minorities" (like the Jews, for example)?

The other day I read something by the late unlamented William Dudley Pelley (yimach shemo vezikhro!), the leader of the pro-Nazi Silver Shirts in the Thirties. He attacked the Bible as being made up of lies and utterly rejected HaShem (the Biblical G-d) and Moses, saying the Egyptians ran the Jews out because they had imposed a "New Deal" on the country. He also maintained that if anyone broke ranks on this and questioned Biblical truth they mysteriously died under sinister circumstances. Can anyone imagine such an idiot today thinking there was world conspiracy to protect the Bible?

If any Learned Elders of Zion are out there reading this, please feel free to secretly murder every higher critical faculty member in every "Bible" department at every secular and elite university. I certainly won't shed any tears, however much the Pelleys of our own day bawl about it!

HaShem 'Ish Milchamah!!!

14 posted on 04/11/2005 10:15:35 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (Vayivra' 'Eloqim 'et Ha'Adam betzalmo, betzelem 'Eloqim bara' 'oto; zakhar uneqevah bara' 'otam.)
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To: newgeezer
I very much look forward to the building of the third temple. Then, among other things, this "BCE" and "CE" garbage will be gone for good.

I very much understand your bristling at the imposition of political correctness, however I hope you will try to understand that not everyone who uses those designations does so for reasons of political correctness. Some of us do it in order to avoid what we sincerely believe to be implication in idolatry.

I hope you can respect that even if you can't agree with it, just as I respect your position.

15 posted on 04/11/2005 10:18:26 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (Vayivra' 'Eloqim 'et Ha'Adam betzalmo, betzelem 'Eloqim bara' 'oto; zakhar uneqevah bara' 'otam.)
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To: blam; FairOpinion; Ernest_at_the_Beach; SunkenCiv; 24Karet; 3AngelaD; 4ConservativeJustices; ...
The Moslems running the Rock have been removing and dumping all "Time of Ignorance" artifacts from the site and dumping them elsewhere. Old link:
Temple Mount Wall in Danger
by Herschel Shanks
The surface of the Temple Mount has been controlled by the Waqf, the Muslim religious trust, for decades even after the Old City came under Israeli rule in the Six-Day War of 1967. The Waqf has been guilty of nearly 40 violations of Israel's antiquities laws since 1967, but Israel has not taken any steps to block its actions. Another possibility involves recent construction by the Waqf. In 1999 the Muslim group began a major clearance project inside the wall adjacent to where the bulge now appears. Using a bulldozer, the Waqf removed hundreds of truckloads of dirt (containing archaeologically rich material) and dumped it in the adjacent Kidron Valley.

Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on, off, or alter the "Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list --
Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
The GGG Digest
-- Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

16 posted on 04/11/2005 10:46:42 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (Deviance or rebellion without consequences is conformity.)
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Temple Mount Wall Collapses
Jewish World
12:23 Sep 25 2003
One side of a wall in the Temple Mount compound - completely visible to worshippers at the Western Wall - collapsed on Tuesday, uncovering an area of some 40 square meters of dirt and fill... Archaeologist Dr. Eilat Mazar, a member of the Committee to Prevent the Destruction of Temple Mount Antiquities, said that the collapse is connected with the illegal construction works being carried out on the Temple Mount by the Moslem Waqf... "No one is concerned about preserving the ancient compound," she said, "nor has anyone mapped, surveyed or buttressed the hollow areas under the Temple Mount and under the mosques... If a catastrophe occurs, the whole world will blame Israel."

17 posted on 04/11/2005 10:49:12 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (Deviance or rebellion without consequences is conformity.)
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Temple Mount in Congress
by S.F.
Biblical Archaeology Review
Congress is considering a bill that would cut American $200 million in aid to the Palestinian Authority until it stops construction on Jerusalem's Temple Mount -- construction that critics charge has been destroying remains from the First and Second Temple periods... Construction atop the Temple Mount -- the platform that once held the First and Second Temples and which today holds the Al-Aqsa mosque and the Dome of the Rock -- was begun in late 1999 by the Waqf, the Muslim religious council responsible for the mount, ostensibly to enlarge an emergency exit for an underground mosque in the southeast corner of the mount. Since then many truckloads of earth filled with ancient artifacts have been hauled off the mount and much of the southeast corner has been paved over. None of the work has been supervised by the Israel Antiquities Authority (IAA), as required by Israeli law... The official also noted that the impetus behind the construction came not from Yasser Arafat nor even from Waqf officials, but from Raed Salah, the mayor of Umm el-Fahm, the second largest Arab city in Israel, and the leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel. Salah raised the funds for the work on the Temple Mount and brought in hundreds of volunteers to carry it out.<
Israel warning on Jerusalem site
BBC
Sunday, 26 September, 2004
An Israeli minister has warned that part of a holy site in Jerusalem sacred to both Muslims and Jews may collapse beneath the weight of worshippers... Repair work on the ancient site has already led to disagreements between Israeli officials with responsibility for looking after it, and their Palestinian counterparts, the Waqf authority. The foundations of the mosque are old and unstable and a combination of roofing work on the building and a small earthquake have worsened its structural condition. Part of the 800-year-old supporting wall leading to the compound crumbled in February... Islamic militants have blamed Israel for the collapse, saying officials were trying to destabilise the complex by carrying out archaeological excavations in an area outside the compound.

18 posted on 04/11/2005 10:53:01 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (Deviance or rebellion without consequences is conformity.)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.
19 posted on 04/11/2005 11:12:17 AM PDT by SJackson (You simply have to accept the fact that we are all corrupt-Mahmud Abbas to senior UN official, 1996)
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To: SkyPilot
Actually, I have seen some very good evidence that everyone may be fighting over the wrong ruins. I won't claim to be an expert on the subject, I have simply read a few articles, but I love archeology and was very intrigued by the arguments in the links below. Here is a summary:

Titus (the Roman general ordered to destroy Jerusalem), Josephus (the Jewish historian that many see as a traitor) and Eleazar (a leader of the Jewish rebels at Masada) all state that the temple was completely destroyed. Even scriptures prophesied that no two stones would be left on top of each other, yet the Western Wall shows a lot of stones still in place. When Muhammad arrived, unaware of historical documents showing the temple was completely destroyed, he designated the largest ruins he could find as the Temple Mount and everyone accepted that as true. Then the "we took your temple" fighting began, as I believe was the intention.

The known dimensions of the actual temple would have this foundation being much bigger than the actual Temple structure required. However, we do know that Rome had a large fort here, Fort Antonio, to house up to 3000 soldiers that were based in Jerusalem. It is also known that Rome left a military presence in the area, after destroying Jerusalem.

It would make sense, as the research below states, that Muhammad would have a much easier time finding the ruins of a large military fortress that was never dismantled than finding the ruins of a temple that was destroyed and completely dismantled as a warning to all future rebels in the Roman Empire.

Right or wrong, there is a chance that Muhammad did a big "I stole your Temple", and then Jews and Christians retaliated with a big "give it back". Once you get behind a cause, then spend several hundred years fighting and dying for it, it becomes very difficult to step back and ask if it is accurate. On the other hand, maybe that is the best time to do so. Maybe the real Temple Mount is accessible, and maybe it can be restored without the bloodshed necessary t gain access to the Al-Aqsa Mosque.

I love reading issues like this, so if you know of other links on the topic, even other theories, please send me the links.

http://israel.cephasministry.com/who_moved_the_temple.html
http://askelm.com/temple/index.htm
http://askelm.com/books/book008.htm

As well as a critique of the research linked above at:
http://www.askelm.com/temple/t010513.htm
20 posted on 04/11/2005 11:34:37 AM PDT by djmv
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