Courtesy of Raytheon Missile Systems
The Phalanx 1B Close-In Weapon System could be a "last line of defense" for ships. The weapon fires 3,000 to 4,500 armor-piercing rounds per minute. The new version features infrared radar.
Posted on 05/19/2005 10:24:09 AM PDT by Righty_McRight
The U.S. Army is looking at a Raytheon-made ship-defense system to shoot down mortar rounds that are fired at U.S. troops in Iraq.
The Army is studying Raytheon's Phalanx Close-In Weapon System - a radar-guided, ship-mounted version of a multibarreled Gatling gun - among several technologies to counter mortar and small-rocket threats, the company and the Army said.
The program is called C-RAM, short for "counter rocket artillery mortar" system.
The Phalanx is made by Tucson-based Raytheon Missile Systems in Louisville, Ky.
The Army has received two of the latest Phalanx 1B systems for evaluation under a Navy contract signed in March, said John Eagles, spokesman for Raytheon Missile Systems in Louisville, which employs about 350.
A "last line of defense" for ships, the Phalanx is a rapid-fire, computer-controlled radar and 20-millimeter gun system that can automatically track and destroy close-range enemy threats such as low-flying cruise missiles, small boats and helicopters. Since 1979, more than 850 Phalanx systems have been built and deployed in the navies of 22 allied nations, Raytheon says.
Firing 3,000 to 4,500 armor-piercing rounds per minute, the Phalanx was battle-tested by the British during the Falklands War. The advanced Phalanx 1B version includes advanced Forward Looking Infrared Radar and beefier gun barrels.
"The capability is there; the capability has been proven," Eagles said.
"The Army knows that the second-most-lethal threat they've got over there is mortars," he said, citing improvised bombs as the top threat.
Mortars are short-barreled, portable artillery weapons used to lob shells at targets within a few miles. They can be set up, fired and packed up in a matter of minutes, making it difficult for defenders to target mortar teams.
Harvey Perritt, a spokesman for the U.S. Army Training and Doctrine Command at Fort Monroe, Va., confirmed that the Army is researching ways to counter the mortar threat and that Raytheon is one of the contractors involved.
Perritt declined to give any further details of the project.
A military analyst said the Army is considering the Phalanx along with other countermeasures, including adapted anti-aircraft guns and rockets that detonate in the path of incoming projectiles, spewing out a pattern of shrapnel to increase the likelihood of a hit.
"The (insurgent) mortar teams are a problem, and they are looking at a number of different approaches to the problem," said John Pike, director of Globalsecurity.org.
"The enemy mortar teams know the U.S. snipers can't get out more than a mile or so" to shoot them, Pike added.
Pike said the Phalanx is a well-regarded ship-defense weapon, though it's seen little combat action with the U.S. Navy.
One possible drawback of using the Phalanx system, Pike said, is the danger its rapid-fire hail of projectiles poses to U.S. troops and civilians.
House Armed Services Committee Chairman Duncan Hunter, R-Calif., is seeking to earmark $75 million in fiscal 2006 funding to develop and field a C-RAM system, said Joe Kasper, Hunter's press secretary.
Tucson firm gets AF contract
Tucson-based NP Photonics Inc., a supplier of fiber-optic and laser components, has been awarded a two-year, $750,000 Phase II Small Business Innovation Research contract by the Air Force Research Laboratories at Kirtland Air Force Base in Albuquerque.
The SBIR contract will allow NP to further develop its compact "Panoramic Optical Power Amplifier," which uses the company's proprietary fiber-optic technology to amplify two-dimensional images, the company said.
Amplification of dimly lighted images is important in many military applications, particularly laser tracking of remote targets, the company said.
The company, located in the University of Arizona Science and Technology Park, 9030 S. Rita Road, also recently expanded its Scorpion line of fiber-optic light sources for telecommunications, research and sensor applications.
Gah! I CIWS to defend against mortar fire?? Who'll defend against the CIWS! Nevermind where to put it (without it becoming a target).
Gah! A CIWS to defend against mortar fire?? Who'll defend against the CIWS! Nevermind where to put it (without it becoming a target).
It would also happily (and automatically) ventilate anything moving towards the base at more than 30mph. Can we say "speed limit enforced by R2D2 with a hardon"?
Put it behind the walls of the Green Zone. Anything comes over the walls, the CIWS shreds it.
I gather it's a "baby" version of the C-Wiz..but still..the friendly fire risk is great..
DING!!!
Usually not on Americans, what's your point? :) You can get 20mm time-fused rounds that will blow themselves up after a couple of seconds of flight time.
That said, a version in 7.62 would probably work better.
Affectionately known as "R2-D2" to former Navy personnel, you don't want to be on the receiving end of that barrel.
r2d2 with chubbie, coming soon to a battlefield near you.
Gunner's Ping!!
This could work. But I think that it will be mostly ineffective simply because of the possibility of massive collateral damage.
20,000 20mm rounds impacting a neighborhood will kill a pile of kids. Whether they actually got hit by our rounds or not.
Only a SWAG but could 6 or more shooters with RPG's volley fired along with a coordinated mortar attack from three tubes jam this puppy ??.......wonder what it's capability is to counter multiple targets at once ?
Two words: Land Battleship.
It's a commonly held belief in the fleet that CWIS actually stands for, "Christ it won't shoot!" Anyone with CWIS experience will appreciate the acronym and humor. Did I spell that right?
The chubbie of DOOM!! LOL
saturating the defenses? sure. any defense can be 'whelmed by volume.
That should be CIWS. As for me CICS is correct.
Since we already have a radar that can track something as small and fast as a bullet, why not link the radar to a computer that back-calculates the origination point of mortar round then automatically targets and fires a mortar round right back at them? Heck even make the mortar a smart device.
Awesome technology, but if its firing thousands of rounds/minute, one has to assume that a lot of those are going to miss the target.
They're going to fall somewhere.
Not a problem if these defenses are on the front lines and the mortar comes in from a defined enemy position.
But what about any deployments within a protected zone, or nearby population centers?
Its not a problem out on the open ocean, but it seems like these would be easy weapons to use against ourselves - i.e. lob a mortar in from a populated area in the hope that the collateral damage caused by the defensive weapon causes more harm (either real or pyschological) than the mortar every could.
Hmmm...Let's just say a couple thousand rounds fell on a friendly village. I would bet the village is no longer considered friendly......May as well keep firing.....
War...ain't pretty.
Great Pic..thanks...awesome weapons system...
Yep....30,000 20 mike mike rounds up in the air could pose a threat to whatever is downrange behind the target..
What goes up ..must come down...
oops drop a zero there.
Like to see the Army and Marine Corps get A-10 Warthogs
While the inbound round is still in the air?
(yes, it's a quick after-th-fact response...)
And they won't employ that for fear of collateral damage.
My first thought about this is that where ever this is deployed, there are going to be a whole lot of unhappy neighbors within a few miles!
Remember gravity... It's not just a good idea. It's the law!
When these things are firing off a ship, no problem, since there's probably nothing but ocean when the projectiles come back down. But on land, well somebody's going to be getting a whole bunch of 20mm cannon shells falling down on their heads!
Mark
The AN/TPQ-36 Firefinder Radar is a lightweight, small, highly mobile radar set capable of detecting weapon projectiles launched at any angle within selected 90-degree azimuth sectors over 360 degrees of coverage. The AN/TPQ-36 can locate simultaneous and volley-fire weapons. It can also be used to register and adjust friendly fire. Upon projectile detection, the weapon location is computed and is used to direct counter-battery fires.
The system consists of an operational control group, OK-398/TPQ-36, and an antenna transceiver group, OY-71/TPQ-36. It is used by the artillery battalions to provide an effective capability to locate hostile weapons, both mortars and short- to medium-range weapons.
The Marine Corps will be receiving a Version 8 configuration, currently involving Toby Hanna Army Depot & Grumman Electronics Programs. This new configuration consists of a new Operations Control Group (OCG) using the Army Lightweight Multipurpose Shelter (LMS) mounted on a M1097 HMMWV. This HMMWV tows the Antenna Transceiver Group (ATG) with the integrated Modular Azimuth Positioning System (MAPS) mounted on the M116A2E1 trailer. The OCG is controlled by an operator either located within the shelter or remotely located. The second M1097 HMMWV will carry the MEP112A generator mounted on an M116A2E1 trailer. An additional reconnaissance vehicle/crew carrier, a fourth HMMWV, will be added to the Marine Corps Table of Equipment.
The AN/TPQ-36(V) was originally developed in the 70’s and fielded in the early 80’s. 130 systems were built for the US Army and Marine Corps. The system has proven to be very effective in numerous situations and continues to be used by the Army, Marines, National Guard and many Foreign Military Sales Customers. However, as the system ages, it is increasingly difficult to obtain many of the components. The system’s reliability is also degrading.
The AN/TPQ-36(V)7 (HMMWV Version), downsized the AN/TPQ-36 configuration for the active force. The AN/TPQ-36(V)7 is a highly mobile short range radar which can locate mortars, artillery and rockets within the accuracy of that weapons system. It was downsized from 5-ton trucks (in the (V)5 configuration) to M1097 HMMWV's which improved it's mobility. The operations control group is mounted on an M1097 HMMWV that tows the M116a2 cargo trailer. A second M1097 HMMWV carries a MEP 112A generator and tows the Antenna Transciever Group (ATG) mounted on a modified M116A2 trailer. The M998 HMMWV reconnaissance vehicle tows a second MEP 112a generator mounted on a second M116A2 cargo trailer. A Modular Azimuth Positioning System (MAPS) gives a self-survey capability. It has memory keep alive circuits which allow an operator to shut power to the system off and not lose stored data. As long as there is power in the vehicle battery, memory is maintained. Downsizing of vehicles allowed for downsizing the crew from 8 to 6 personnel. The new configuration will have a drive on/off capability and can be transported in two sorties by C-130 and larger aircraft. The system can be helicopter lifted. Fielding of the AN/TPQ-36(V)7 was completed the third quarter of 1995.
PM FIREFINDER initiated the development of a new Operations Central (OC) in the early 1990’s to replace the OCG. Although this has resolved the problems with the radar electronics, no improvements have been made to the ATG since its inception. While the development of the new OCG was on-going, PM Forward Area Air Defense (FAAD) Sensors selected a derivative of the AN/TPQ-36(V) ATG for the Ground Based Sensor (now Sentinel) program. This variant, the AN/MPQ-64(V), was initially 85% common with the AN/TPQ-36(V) ATG. However, during the course of producing the AN/MPQ-64(V), numerous parts were identified that were either no longer procurable, or newer, more efficient parts had became available. As a result, many new parts were identified and incorporated in the production.
An initial review of the improvements made to the AN/MPQ-64(V) ATG showed that many of the new parts may be F3 compatible with the AN/TPQ-36(V). Others may require some Non-Recurring (NRE) to develop kits to facilitate installation. An IPT was established between the FIREFINDER and SENTINEL communities to identify those components that are directly plug-in compatible and those that will require some NRE to incorporate.
The AN/TPQ-36(V)8 (electronics upgrade) provides reduced emplace and displace times, faster access to data, increased memory and digital map storage, a new high speed signal processor for processing up to 20 targets per minute, remote operations up to 100 meters from ATG, and an enhanced probability of detection. These changes will be accomplished by: a new hard disk drive; a flat panel display/control unit, a signal/data processorand a portable laptop computer mounted in a Lightweight Multi-Purpose Shelter (LMS). The AN/TPQ-36(V)8 will use the same antenna as the AN/TPQ-36(V)7. A low noise amplifier is switched for a newer one which will (with version 11 software) help reduce false locations. The heart of the system is the new Operations Central (OC) which has a new, smaller but more powerful signal processor. The new shelter uses common hardware/software to provide operator interface with the new signal processor. The Pentium based LCU's use a windows like environment to make operations as simple as "point and click." There are full size color monitors for visuals and a map plotter for reference. A CD-ROM device will allow for use of digital tactical elevation data (DTED) on CD-ROM as well as a 1.275 GB hard drive for storage of operational and maintenance programs and other data. The new signal processor is the cornerstone of the upgrade. It will allow for processing more targets per minute with 90% correct target classification. False locations will be reduced. Operations will be remotable by removing the left LCU and configuring the Control Display Terminal (CDT).
Primary function: Mobile radar set.
Manufacturer: Hughes Aircraft Company
Length:
Shelter: 106 inches (269 centimeters)
Antenna/transceiver: 181.1 inches (459 centimeters)
Width:
Shelter: 82.7 inches (210.06 centimeters)
Antenna/transceiver: 82.7 inches (210.06 centimeters)
Height:
Shelter: 70.9 inches (180.09 centimeters)
Antenna/transceiver:
In operation: 145.7 inches (370 centimeters)
In transit: 82.7 inches (210 centimeters)
Weight:
Shelter: 2,400 pounds (1089.6 kilograms)
Antenna/transceiver: 3,200 pounds (1452.8 kilograms)
Power requirements: 115/200 VAC, three-phase, four-wire, 400 Hz, 10kw
Support equipment: two M923 five-ton trucks, two 10kw generators
Units: Headquarters batteries in artillery regiments, counter-battery radar platoons
Crew: 9 enlisted
Introduction date: January 1985
Unit Replacement Cost: $1,548,500
Marine Corps Inventory: 22
http://www.global-defence.com/2000/pages/mortar.html
Smart mortars...
This does work, and there are a bunch of very mangled mortar rounds lying around in a certain desert to prove it. There is a self-destruct frangible round that solves the collateral damage issue. Some production and quality control issues that are being worked to get these rounds in required quantities.
Don't get out ahead of the ragheads with countermeasures, but this is not a standalone system - part of a defense in depth/redundancy. Most effective part of the system is actually an effective warning, soldiers under cover have very little to worry about mortar rounds or 107mm rockets
All of this is not very practical in our current footprint, but that will change and then this makes sense when put together with the other pieces.
The Marines were much happier using AV8b Harriers for their purpose, close air support in support of amphibious landings. As for the Army, when the USAF considered cancelling the presumably non-glamourous A-10 project early in its preproduction stage, the Army very casually sent a handful- a dozen or so- of Army aviators with experience in both helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft to *observe* Marine Harrier training. The implication was that if the USAF failed to procure the equipment needed for the protection of Army ground troops, the Army would take care of the problem themselves, as they had earlier with attack helicopters and the Caribou Army-support cargo aircraft used extensively in Vietnam.
Whether the Army would have had the political support at the time topull it off is an interesting matter for speculation, but it became a moot point: the Air Force brass couldn't take the chance, particularly if the debate became a public one, and grudgingly went along with the production and acquisition of a bit fewer than a thousand A10s... if only to keep the Army's hands out of out of the CAS business.
It was a pretty good investment for the Army to send those few Army flyers to checkout the Marine Harriers, bluff or not. It got the US military a super aircraft that's served well for three decades, and the present A-10c *borg Hawg* modifications will likely see the Wartie remain in service for yet another decade or two.
Frangible rounds! Perfect solution, of course I would've thought of that (NOT!). I love American Ingenuity!
Thanks for the info.
Our "firefinder" rader can already do pretty much what you suggest. But it has its limits, and it that doesn't do anything to stop the projectiles that are already in flight toward our troops.
In the past at least, all 20mm ammo was contact fused. It raises the question as to whether modern 20mm bullets can be made to explode either on contact or after a predefined flight time. In such case only fragments of exploded 20mm cannon projectiles would fall to earth - at far less speed than the whole projectile would fall and with no remaining explosive.That might still play hob with a tire that ran over it, but it wouldn't induce massive collateral damage.
That's what I was hoping (my #39) to hear.
I'm still working on my bass-seeking missle. once it's perfected, I'll let you know.
This ain't never gonna happen. All that lead, steel and DU or whatever is in those puppies are going to be coming right down on the local orphanage, hospital etc you can best believe.
There was some recent posting of a interesting fellow's 22 caliber gatling gun -- I'd imagine some smaller caliber and cheaper ammo would be a better match to mortar shells, and shot could be designed to aerodynmaically go unstable after so many microseconds out of the barrel, and thus limit unintended collateral effect.
Wonderful . . . I'm left wondering exactly why a gatling gun is preferred to a single large cannon firing one or two large caliber, proximity fused projectiles.
Phalanax is not the only gun system being worked. There is also a 30/40mm AA gun being tested. The key is to integrate the gun system into the counter-mortar radar arrays and to be able to automatically slew and fire the gun when the proper engagement criteria is met.
IIRC this machine is able to track multiple targets, determine which is the greatest threat and address them in order of threat level. Any tracking technology can be overwhelmed with enough choices but it would take more than 6 fired from pretty darn close.
Silly as it sounds, we don't build them anymore. All the tooling has been destroyed.
Regards,
GtG
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
