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Trial over Italian Islam 'insult' : the battle of Oriana Fallaci
BBC NEWS europe ^ | 25th may 2005 | an italian

Posted on 05/25/2005 5:07:01 AM PDT by an italian

Controversial Italian journalist Oriana Fallaci is to face trial for allegedly insulting the Muslim faith in her latest book, a court in Italy says. Ms Fallaci is being sued by the head of the Muslim Union of Italy, who says The Force of Reason is defamatory.

The journalist caused an uproar with The Rage and the Pride, published two weeks after the 11 September attacks.

In it, she said Western culture was superior to Islam and Muslim immigrants in the West had "multiplied like rats".

Her lawyers have defended her right to express controversial opinions.

"At the heart of her thinking is the following reasoning: the fight against Islamic terrorism is made more difficult by intellectual terrorism cloaked in anti-racism," Gilles Goldhagen, said in 2002, when a French judge was hearing a case to ban The Rage and the Pride.

'No good Islam'

The Force of Reason is said to have gone to print about 24 hours after the 11 March 2004 train bombings in Spain.

In it, Ms Fallaci argues that Europe is turning into "an Islamic province, an Islamic colony" and that "to believe that a good Islam and a bad Islam exist goes against all reason".

Italian preliminary investigative judge Armando Grasso ordered the formulation of charges against the author, saying the book had expressions which were "unequivocally offensive to Islam".

Adel Smith, president of the Muslim Union of Italy, sued the writer on 8 April 2004. He says Ms Fallaci has been advocating and spreading hate against Islam and Muslims, sometimes by allegedly distorting real historical facts and inventing others.

The case is being tried in the northern town of Bergamo, where the book was published. The prosecution has 10 days to come up with a charge.

Ms Fallaci, who lives in New York, was a Resistance fighter in World War II and a former war correspondent.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Government; Philosophy; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: eurabia; europeanmuslims; islam; italy; jihadineurope; orianafallaci; trial
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Oriana is not only my favorite writer. She's my woman model. I stand with her.

Claudia

1 posted on 05/25/2005 5:07:01 AM PDT by an italian
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To: an italian

That's going on my reading list.

Hope she stays alert and keeps low because the "Religion of Peace" will be out to get her.

(Islam = hypocrites)


2 posted on 05/25/2005 5:19:56 AM PDT by schwing_wifey (Coffee, Today's Toons, and Flaming Trolls - Yeeeaaaarrrgggggg PDT +9hours)
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To: an italian
We like La Fallaci over here too!

(I'd love to be called as a witness in this trial!)

ML/NJ

3 posted on 05/25/2005 5:22:52 AM PDT by ml/nj
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To: an italian

"I stand with her."

I second that emotion.

Oriana, know the freepers are with you! At least a whole lot of us are!


4 posted on 05/25/2005 5:23:30 AM PDT by jocon307 (Legal immigrant Irish grandmother rolls in grave, yet again.)
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To: an italian
Ms Fallaci argues that Europe is turning into "an Islamic province, an Islamic colony" and that "to believe that a good Islam and a bad Islam exist goes against all reason".

I, too, would be honored to call her my sister. A voice of reason in a world gone mad.

I not only plan to buy her new book, The Force of Reason, but would like to do more. It would be great if there was a world-wide group which would stand behind her with financial as well as moral aid, something along the line of "Friends of Oriana". I would feel honored to contribute to her defense monthly for as long as it takes.

If any human being is in a position to define and respond to the leprosy on humanity called islam, this woman is. Her lifetime politics is antithecal to mine, but honesty and consistency, as well as integrity define this woman, and her systematic growth against all forms of tyranny and against the degradation of the human spirit in any form is worth defending.

Count me in.

5 posted on 05/25/2005 5:32:10 AM PDT by Publius6961 (The most abundant things in the universe are hydrogen, ignorance and stupidity.)
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To: an italian

"The Rage and the Pride" was excellent. Ms. Fallaci writes with such intensity that you can't help but feel her anger and outrage as you're reading.


6 posted on 05/25/2005 5:36:55 AM PDT by SilentServiceCPOWife (Welcome to the Hotel Free Republic-You can check out any time you like but you can never leave)
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To: Publius6961; All

In Italy we are trying to make her Senator. I'd love to see her in politics: she has the same ideas of mine, she's strong and above all whatever she does she does with passion.

She's a great woman, a great Italian fellow. I'm honored and proud to stand up at his same side.


7 posted on 05/25/2005 5:38:15 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: an italian

The sad part is that in Europe and Canada, this woman is seen as a dinosaur from another century. The combination of islamic aggressive public relations and the acquiesence to Europeans to the role of guilty oppressors is the perfect political storm to let the muslims prpogate their lifestyle to the point of over-running what was once the heart of Christiandom. Europe has given up.


8 posted on 05/25/2005 5:38:59 AM PDT by doc30 (Democrats are to morals what and Etch-A-Sketch is to Art.)
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To: an italian
The case is being tried in the northern town of Bergamo, where the book was published. The prosecution has 10 days to come up with a charge.

The charge...
Let me see.

Improper use of the truth and pointing out the obvious?
Abusing the rights of the largest current criminal enterprise on the planet operating under the guise of a religion?
Using excessive intellectual force against pure evil?

Animal abuse?
The possibilities are endless...

9 posted on 05/25/2005 5:39:25 AM PDT by Publius6961 (The most abundant things in the universe are hydrogen, ignorance and stupidity.)
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To: an italian
Ok, here is what I don't get. Face trial? The charge being? Isn't this just a weeee bit ridiculous?
10 posted on 05/25/2005 5:39:32 AM PDT by JasonC
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To: MAK1179; briansb

Ping for a "Best Author of the Century" award


11 posted on 05/25/2005 5:41:56 AM PDT by Lloyd227 (American Forces armed with what? Spit balls?)
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To: an italian
Oriana is not only my favorite writer. She's my woman model. I stand with her.

Claudia, you took the words out of my mouth. She is, imo, the world's greatest journalist. Have you ever read "Interview with History?" That should be required reading at every college campus anywhere. Like Christopher Hitchens, agree or disagree, she's the real thing. She walks the walk.

12 posted on 05/25/2005 5:43:19 AM PDT by N. Beaujon (http://www.nbeaujon.com)
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To: an italian

The same could happen here in the U.S.

Look at what Democrat John Conyers of Detroit has proposed:

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/

From the littlegreenfootballs website:

"Here is the text of the resolution proposed to Congress by US Representative John Conyers, Jr., a Detroit Democrat, taking a first tentative step toward a blasphemy law in the United States: Text of My Resolution Regarding Relgious [sic] Intolerance. (Expressing the sense of the House of Representatives condemning bigotry and religious intolerance, and recognizing that holy books of every religion should be treated with dignity and respect."

Part of John Conyers resolution:

"Whereas believers of all religions, including the Abrahamic faiths of Christianity, Judaism and Islam, should be treated with respect and dignity;

Whereas the word Islam comes from the Arabic root word meaning “peace” and “submission”;

1 Resolved, That the House of Representatives–

(1) condemns bigotry, acts of violence, and intolerance against any religious group, including our friends, neighbors, and citizens of the Islamic faith;

(2) declares that the civil rights and civil liberties of all individuals, including those of the Islamic faith, should be protected;

(3) recognizes that the Quran, the holy book of Islam, as any other holy book of any religion, should be treated with dignity and respect; and

(4) calls upon local, State, and Federal authorities to work to prevent bias-motivated crimes and acts against all individuals, including those of the Islamic faith.

http://www.conyersblog.us/archives/00000103.htm





13 posted on 05/25/2005 5:43:19 AM PDT by milford421
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To: JasonC
Ok, here is what I don't get. Face trial? The charge being? Isn't this just a weeee bit ridiculous?

Well, yes.
It's as silly as the Mafia suing for defamation... ... multiplied a million times.

Ariana needs some expert help compiling the crimes of islam in just the last 50 years.

The list of atrocities this criminal group has perpetrated would take months simply to read in court. The maggots have made a huge mistake.

14 posted on 05/25/2005 5:45:00 AM PDT by Publius6961 (The most abundant things in the universe are hydrogen, ignorance and stupidity.)
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To: milford421
This classic clown seems to never have had a firm grasp on anything logical and intellectual. Specifically, in this instance, the concept of "separation of church and state".

If blasphemy and desecration become a federal crime, I plan to become a habitual criminal.

15 posted on 05/25/2005 5:48:28 AM PDT by Publius6961 (The most abundant things in the universe are hydrogen, ignorance and stupidity.)
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To: an italian
I'd go to jail for spreading the TRUTH.
16 posted on 05/25/2005 5:55:15 AM PDT by Dallas59 (" I have a great team that is going to beat George W. Bush" John Kerry -2004)
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To: milford421
This sorry son of a b*tch wants to protect the rights of Muslims and make it a crime to express our opinions on same when he and all the other liberal b¨¨tards in this country attack Christions and Jews daily? Hey Bill, screw you!
17 posted on 05/25/2005 5:56:50 AM PDT by Americanexpat (A strong democracy through citizen oversight.)
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To: an italian



http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=4315&search=arlandson


18 posted on 05/25/2005 5:58:01 AM PDT by Vaquero ('I'm a Red Stater, trapped in the body of a Blue State')
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To: La Enchiladita

great book ping!


19 posted on 05/25/2005 6:05:04 AM PDT by Ros42
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To: an italian
All of us at some point have said or written something that was offensive to Wahabi Islam...myself daily. That's just too bad. Each day I read new outrages perpetrated by an evil, medieval society against all human dignity, and each day the Muslims feign outrage against...us. They burn our flags, behead our citizens, shred our holy books and desecrate our holy places.

It's about time writers come out publicly and decry this brutal sham of a religion, and I don't care if they are offended. I am offended.

20 posted on 05/25/2005 6:08:44 AM PDT by Sender (Team Infidel USA)
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To: Americanexpat

It is yet another step in the process of dhimmitude...


21 posted on 05/25/2005 6:12:35 AM PDT by milford421
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To: an italian
Islam can't stand the truth!
22 posted on 05/25/2005 6:13:04 AM PDT by Gritty ("Wherever Mohammedans went,a broad line of blood marked the track,civilisation disappeared-Gladstone)
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To: jocon307

I'm all for Oriana too. She's a feisty one, greatly needed in these times.


23 posted on 05/25/2005 6:25:41 AM PDT by bboop
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To: milford421

Apparently the 'good' Congressman missed the part in the Constitution that says "Congress SHALL MAKE NO LAW...etc."

I don't see this going anywhere.


24 posted on 05/25/2005 6:29:45 AM PDT by Bigh4u2 (Denial is the first requirement to be a liberal)
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To: an italian
"to believe that a good Islam and a bad Islam exist goes against all reason".

Sanity is a crime in Italy?

25 posted on 05/25/2005 6:32:11 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Dallas59
I don't think there is any jail involved. Unless I am mistaken, this is a civil lawsuit. Also, she lives in New York - what is she being sued in Italy for? Also, would the bailiff please kick the nutjob plaintifs in the butt? If they collect for Islam, I've got some bills to present.
26 posted on 05/25/2005 6:38:03 AM PDT by JasonC
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To: Bigh4u2

I wish I could share your optimism, but too many advances have been made recently.

Resolutions have been known to have "slipped through" and have become law.

Conyers seems to be off, for the most part, most American's radar screens...


27 posted on 05/25/2005 6:39:00 AM PDT by milford421
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To: milford421

I understand your sentiment, but if such a law were to pass through Congress I believe it would be overturned by the SCOTUS.

The First Ammendment of the Constitution makes it very clear that they cannot propose ANY legislation for or against religious bias.

If they let this slip through then our country is done as a Republic.


28 posted on 05/25/2005 6:42:19 AM PDT by Bigh4u2 (Denial is the first requirement to be a liberal)
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To: Bigh4u2

"If they let this slip through then our country is done as a Republic."

Yup...


29 posted on 05/25/2005 6:46:06 AM PDT by milford421
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To: doc30
The combination of islamic aggressive public relations and the acquiesence to Europeans to the role of guilty oppressors is the perfect political storm to let the muslims prpogate their lifestyle to the point of over-running what was once the heart of Christiandom.

That's it in a nutshell. And there's no way out of this unless Europe is hit by a series of 911s. Bin Laden overplayed his hand, and almost provided a much needed wake-up call for Europeans.

30 posted on 05/25/2005 7:00:55 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: an italian
Claudia,

She comes from a long line of partigiani. Her father was in the resistance during WWII, and I love the fact that she calls herself a Christian atheist. Not because I'm an atheist, but because I know exactly what she's trying to get at with that phrase as it relates to her polictics, both recent and past.

I don't think her health is all that good. Thought I remember reading that she was diagnosed with cancer a few years back. May she continue to live and write well.

Signed,
another Italian
nato al '56, emigrato al '58.


31 posted on 05/25/2005 7:06:29 AM PDT by AlbionGirl
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To: AlbionGirl
"I do not believe in vile acquittals, phony appeasements, easy forgiveness. Even less, in the exploitation or the blackmail of the word Peace. When peace stands for surrender, fear, loss of dignity and freedom, it is no longer peace. It is suicide."

- Oriana Fallaci

32 posted on 05/25/2005 8:18:00 AM PDT by EternalVigilance ("We, the people, are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts..." -Abraham Lincoln)
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To: AlbionGirl
Well... you're one of the few FReepers who accepted the idea of a Christian atheist. Well done. I'm one of them too.

Oriana is a great woman. Oriana herself fought as a partigiano. She fought in the movement of "Giustizia e Librtàà" ("Justice and Freedom") with the nickname of "Emilia". She was an Italian soldier. My generation has to be thankful.

Everybody in Italy comes from a family in which there are someone who fought Fascism in the WWII. That's why we are better than France. ;-)
33 posted on 05/25/2005 8:27:03 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: Bigh4u2
If they let this slip through then our country is done as a Republic.

Not without a real fight.

34 posted on 05/25/2005 8:33:40 AM PDT by Publius6961 (The most abundant things in the universe are hydrogen, ignorance and stupidity.)
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To: an italian
As I said, I'm not an atheist. The influence of Jesus Christ in my life is immeasureable.

There is an old saying that goes, 'better an atheist who acts like a Christian, than a christian who acts like an atheist.'

Her beliefs are her own, but her phrase 'christian atheist' is an acknowledgment that Christianity, for all the faults of its adherents, is not to be easily dismissed, and has given the world so much more than people realize or are willing to admit.

She's honest, and there is no greater quality or aspiration than honesty when you are a journalist. And perhaps that's true for any profession.

35 posted on 05/25/2005 8:37:48 AM PDT by AlbionGirl
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To: All; schwing_wifey; ml/nj; jocon307; Publius6961; SilentServiceCPOWife; doc30; JasonC; Lloyd227; ...
Well guys: that's what.

I just adore her. She's, I've already said it, the myth of my young years. I grew up with her books. From them I started to love Freedom and to fight for it, no cares what's the price. Thank her now I'm interested in Politics, I respect Politics. I started to love my Country thank to Oriana Fallaci.

I've read all her books, and I fell in love with her ideas. When I read "A man" (the book about her lover, Alekos Panagulis, the hero of the Greek Resistance, I fell in love with him) I stand with her, with America today. Just because her books have moved me.

She's a great woman, and no one can touches me Oriana Fallaci. No one.
36 posted on 05/25/2005 8:40:06 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: SilentServiceCPOWife

Islamist have brainwashed Italian liberals into believing that any writings critical of Islam should be banned. I've read the Rage and the Pride. Although its translation (her own) is a bit awkward at times , the anticdotes are interesting and informative. She is able to provide an insight into the back areas of third world countries that mainstream media passes by.


37 posted on 05/25/2005 8:40:27 AM PDT by Barney Gumble (Even the Devil can quote scripture when it suits his purpose)
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To: AlbionGirl

Honesty is not the greater quality of journalism... Is the greatest quality of Life...


38 posted on 05/25/2005 8:41:43 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: an italian
Adel Smith, president of the Muslim Union of Italy

Isn't this the same guy that tried to get crucifixes removed from schools? Do you know what happened in that case?

I thought Italy had pretty strong freedom of expression laws - I'm surprised something like this is going to trial.

What do you think the outcome will be and what is the feeling of most italians regarding this case - doe she have a lot of popular support?

Aldo

39 posted on 05/25/2005 8:55:17 AM PDT by aquila48
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To: aquila48
Do you want really to know how the story ended? They won. And in my Country (the Country in which lives the Pope!) we can't show our religious symbols. Not in schools, not in hospitals.

I'm an atheist, but I'm Italian. And I'm proud of my Country. i recognize Italy has strong Christian roots. My classmates are all very religious people: why they have to not say it? In respect of who? The Islam? The religion that kill us like flyes and that can stone you if you say a "pater noster" on their land??? (By the way who cares their lands??? Only deserts and nothing.).

That's not just. And that's not intelligent too.
40 posted on 05/25/2005 9:04:18 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: an italian
Do you want really to know how the story ended? They won. And in my Country (the Country in which lives the Pope!) we can't show our religious symbols. Not in schools, not in hospitals.

What a shame! I was born in Abruzzo (I came to the US a long time ago) where the case took place. I can't imagine people not raising hell - I guess italians have changed.

How sad though that they are giving up their culture so easily, and to people that want to kill them.

This, in the name of tolerance and multiculturalism - they're tolerant of every one but themselves, respect other's culture, but not their own!!

41 posted on 05/25/2005 9:15:23 AM PDT by aquila48
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To: an italian
Oriana on Italians and America:

America is a country that has great things to teach us. Speaking of heroic efficiency let me sing the praises of the Mayor of New York. That Rudolph Giuliani, whom we Italians should thank on our knees. Because he has an Italian last name, he is of Italian extraction, and he makes us look good in the entire world. He is a great, in fact a very great Mayor. This is coming from someone who is never happy about anything or anyone, starting with herself. He is a Mayor worthy of another great Mayor with an Italian last name, Fiorello La Guardia, and many of our Mayors should go to be schooled by him. Present themselves with their heads bowed, in fact with ashes on their heads, and ask him: “Mr. Giuliani, please tell us how to do it.” it.”

He does not delegate his duties to others. He does not waste time in being a prick and thirsting for power. He does not divide his time between being Mayor and a senator or a representative. (is there anyone listening in the three cities of Stendhal, namely Naples, Florence and Rome?). Running to the site immediately, he entered the second skyscraper, and he risked being transformed into ashes with the others. He saved himself by a hair and by chance. Within four days he had the city back on it’s feet again. A city that has nine and a half million residents, note, and two million only in Manhattan. How he did it, I don’t know. He is ill like me, poor man, he makes believe he is well: he works just the same. However, I work at a table, sitting comfortably! He instead…He looked like a general that was personally participating in a battle. A soldier that throws himself forward with his bayonet. “Come on people, Get on with it! Let’s pull up our sleeves and get to work!, hurry!!” He was able to do this because these people were, are, like he is. People without conceit and laziness, my father would have said “people with balls”. As to the admirable capacity to unite, the compact almost martial manner in which the Americans respond to tragedies and the enemy, well, I must admit that there and then it even surprised me. I knew that at the time of Pearl Harbor, the population rallied around Roosevelt, who had entered into the war against Hitler’s Germany and Mussolini’s Italy and Hirohito’s Japan. I had smelled it, after Kennedy’s assassination.

I don’t know if in Italy you saw and understood what happened in New York, when Bush went there to thank the workers (men and women) that are digging in the ruins of the two towers, trying to save survivors but have not found anything but a nose here a finger there. Without giving up, nonetheless. Without fatalism, so that if you ask them how they do it, they reply, “I can allow myself to be exhausted not to be defeated.” Everyone. Young, very young, old, middle age. Whites, blacks, yellows, browns, purple… Did you see them? While Bush thanks them they waved little American flags, lifted a clenched fist and roared: “USA! USA! USA!”. In a totalitarian state, I would have thought, “look how well the powers have organized this demonstration!”. In America, no! In America one does not organize these things. You can’t command them, you can’t stage them. Especially not in a disenchanted metropolis such as New York, and especially not with New York City workers! They are terrible types, the workers of New York. Freer than the wind. They don’t even obey their unions. But if you touch their flag, if you touch their country…


42 posted on 05/25/2005 9:19:52 AM PDT by Alouette (The only thing learned from history is that nobody ever learns from history.)
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To: Alouette

Read my home-page.


43 posted on 05/25/2005 9:22:20 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: aquila48

Yes sir, but consider that there are still Italians that want to fight: Oriana is not alone.


44 posted on 05/25/2005 9:24:17 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: an italian
Years ago, I took a class in Italian in college. The professor would always write Viva il Papa! at the top of all his exam papers.

If he did that today he would probably be arrested.

45 posted on 05/25/2005 9:31:48 AM PDT by Alouette (The only thing learned from history is that nobody ever learns from history.)
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To: Alouette
People would say he's a racist. But if they fill the places yelling "Allah akbar" everything is ok.

I'm so angry.
46 posted on 05/25/2005 9:34:17 AM PDT by an italian (without Victory there is no Survival...)
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To: an italian

Hello, from a Texan Italian!


47 posted on 05/25/2005 9:41:05 AM PDT by Alkhin ("Oh! Oh!" cried my idiot crew. "It's a ghoul - we are lost!" ~ Jack Aubrey)
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To: an italian

I'll have to put "Force of Reason" on my reading list. Thanks for posting this article.


48 posted on 05/25/2005 9:46:25 AM PDT by Liberty Valance (If you must filibuster, let the Constitution do the talkin')
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To: an italian

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0847827534/qid=1117039681/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-3000318-1019223?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

The book won't be available here until August 23rd.


49 posted on 05/25/2005 9:52:38 AM PDT by Liberty Valance (If you must filibuster, let the Constitution do the talkin')
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To: an italian
an italian, I totally agree! It's wonderful to find someone who appreciates and knows her. I have a signed copy of A Man ;). I first discovered her when she wrote about Aldo Moro's murder. I couldn't believe her prose. I dont think you can really understand today's world unless you've read "Interview with History." She interviews everyone who has shaped the post-cold war world. Her inviews with Kissinger, Golda Meir and Khomeini are timeless. I rarely find anyone in the US who knows who she is.

PS-If anyone can take on a fatwa she can, unlike that whiney Salmon Rushdie.

50 posted on 05/25/2005 10:45:14 AM PDT by N. Beaujon (http://www.nbeaujon.com)
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