Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Air America- or "Con" America?
various FR links & blogs | 08-02-05 | the heavy equipment guy

Posted on 08/02/2005 5:11:48 AM PDT by backhoe

  Air Enron (Michelle Malkin) 

DarleenClickAAR1.jpg
-- According to Lombino's latest article, Air America's current owners have known about ... a large cash infusion from Gloria Wise Boys & Girls Club, a non-profit organization funded primarily by government grants.
 Despite the near-total MSM blackout, this story just keeps getting more and more interesting.
 Previous:
Air Deadbeat: the saga continues
The Air America loophole
Air America is scrambling
Air America: Don't blame us
Air America: Stealing from poor kids?!
 
 RADIO MAN CATCHES $TATIC (con man blamed for Air America $500K snafu) -- A top staffer at the Gloria Wise Boys & Girls Club in The Bronx "conned" the organization into lending nearly $800,000 to the left-wing radio network Air America — a move that eventually doomed the youth group...
 Err America.... founded by a con artist, and staffed by con artists.
 But remember,  it's  "for the children"...
 
  Bigger Than We Thought; Air America, Cohen Got More Than $800,000? -- The question now is, "How much of the money embezzled from needy children and seniors went directly into the pockets of bleeding hearts Franken, Rhodes and Garafolo?"
 
  Funds of a Bronx Youth Group Allegedly Lent to Air America (Scandal Now Tops $800,000)
 
  'CAMP AIR AMERICA' STILL SOLICITING --Flap's got a great round-up of links for the beginner to the story, which means all MSM reporters. Wizbang looks at the Drobnys. Macho Nachos talks to lawyers.
Thus far only the New York Dail News has run any news story on the debacle.
We know every twist and turn in Rush Limbaugh's medical history, but no one in MSM has the time to follow the Air America money, even when bloggers have laid out the roadmap?
 
  Air America: MSM Doesn't Follow The Money
 
 Captains Quarters:
http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/005096.php
 
 Inside Air America's Troubles: Optimism and Shaky Finances
 The Wall Street Journal ^ | June 21, 2004
 http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1157198/posts
 
 
 Michelle Malkin has the continuing FLAP about Air America radio, THE AIR AMERICA LOOPHOLE.
 Blogger Leon H. takes a hard look at Air America’s latest explanation for the public funding mess involving NYC non-profits.
 MSM has finally picked up the story.
 Some others following the money:
The Captain - pay the money back!
Macsmind - Stealing from poor kids?
Danny Carlton - Air America has taken to embezzlement.
Venomous Kate - it’s not just the programming that stinks.
Michelle Malkin with LOTS more detail
Isn’t it rich? - Outrage, anyone?
BizzyBlog - Wonders if the liberal network will even be around six months from now.
ItsAPundit
Interested-Participant - Air America possibly in the cross hairs of an embarrassing scandal.
Basil’s Blog - Breakfast Special
The Pirate’s Cove - How low can you go?
Two Babes and a Brain - Sorry kids, guess you’ll have to make due with deflated soccer balls.
Decision ‘08 - Sure looks like Air America benefitted from diverted funds intended for inner-city youth.
Mrs. Greyhawk - Why isn’t the NYT covering this scandal?
Cannuckistan Chronicles - …if you’re “Air America”, you hijack funding that was supposed to go toward inner city kids.
JunkYardBlog - Stealing from the poor to make themselves rich?
Red State Rant - out of the mouths of babes.
The Llama Butchers - Al Franken is a big fat thief.
Ace of Spades HQ - Are you kidding me?
Commonwealth Conservative - Air America stealing from poor kids?
Jeff the Babtist - Answer to Air America’s funding problems - fraud.
Say Anything - Air America could be in big trouble.
Almost Daily - There’s a stink in the Air America
Independent Sources - Air America’s Failings No Longer Funny
Literal Barrage - Al Franken Is A Big, Fat Liar Who Steals From Poor Kids And Old People
Jeff Gannon - Liberal radio more important than inner-city kids’ programs?
Michelle Malkin, Double Toothpicks,
 
 

Be sure to check out the simplified version of this post and also further analysis here and here!

In tracking the recent Air America fiasco, it came to me that there was much to this story that I didn't properly understand.

 

Air America Steals Half Million Dollars From Bronx Kids Charity

And the kicker is they're not sorry... Here's the short version of the story, covered first by Brian Maloney with followups from Michelle Malkin and Captain Ed. The leader of the Bronx-based Gloria Wise Club, Charles Rosen, reportedly loaned $480,000 in the startup Air America radio network, at the request...

[Full Story]
 
 Here's the transcript of the CNN "Inside Politcs" segment on Air America's Children's Crusade:
 
 Franken Unaware Of Ex-Colleague's Alleged Loans (Err America $$$ Scandal)
 
 Robin Hood and Air America - ($480K transferred from public funds to Franken's Air America!)
 
 AIR AMERICA: STEALING FROM POOR KIDS?!
 
 Report: Air America Funding Probed
 KEYWORDS: AIRAMERICA; ALFRANKEN;


TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 229; airamerica; airscamerica; alfranken; conair; liberaltalkradio; maleponytails
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-93 next last
Use the "keyword" database to access more background information on this shameless band of rotters.
1 posted on 08/02/2005 5:11:49 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: FreedomPoster

Here 'tis...


2 posted on 08/02/2005 5:12:51 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

Pull the plug.


3 posted on 08/02/2005 5:12:51 AM PDT by Senator Goldwater
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

Uhhhhhhhhh................

This is a Michelle Malkin thread right?



So....., where are the pics?


4 posted on 08/02/2005 5:14:15 AM PDT by WhiteGuy (Vote for gridlock - Make the elected personally liable for their wasteful spending)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

When will this "network" give up? Denial ain't just a river in Egypt


5 posted on 08/02/2005 5:14:46 AM PDT by Vision (When Hillary Says She's Going To Put The Military On Our Borders...She Becomes Our Next President)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Senator Goldwater
Pull the plug.

Aw, let's let 'em twist in the wind a little, first. It's amusing to see these blowhards hoisted on their own petards. Not that the Jackal Pack Press is interested, but word is still getting out.

6 posted on 08/02/2005 5:15:13 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

This news actually surprised me. I must be getting old.


7 posted on 08/02/2005 5:15:46 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle (God has blessed Republicans with really stupid enemies.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

Their paltry ratings have been tantamount to them twisting in the wind.


8 posted on 08/02/2005 5:17:59 AM PDT by Senator Goldwater
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Balding_Eagle
This news actually surprised me. I must be getting old.

Hell, man, I know I'm getting old-- I'm rigging a block and tackle to skid 300lbs. of generator up a half-flight of stairs, instead of just shoving it, but this story has me feeling kind of amused, for a change.

I wonder if we could work "Pirates of the Air" into the title?

9 posted on 08/02/2005 5:22:03 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

Bookmark


10 posted on 08/02/2005 5:22:54 AM PDT by BunnySlippers (Be a Good Mullah Now ...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BunnySlippers
Thanks for looking...
11 posted on 08/02/2005 5:27:29 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

Nice. You rock.


12 posted on 08/02/2005 5:27:37 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (NRA)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: FreedomPoster

Thank you kindly.


13 posted on 08/02/2005 5:28:53 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

Comment #14 Removed by Moderator

To: backhoe

I've posted this twice and I'll do it a third time:

It's a scandal...

(a) only if Republicans are involved

(b) only if the MSM decides to report on it


15 posted on 08/02/2005 6:15:55 AM PDT by MplsSteve
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: MplsSteve

"RADIO MAN CATCHES $TATIC (con man blamed for Air America $500K snafu)"

If this was Rush Limbaugh, would it be called a "SNAFU"?
I wish my back would have a $500K SNAFU in my favor one of these weeks, then give me two years to pay it back.


16 posted on 08/02/2005 6:34:24 AM PDT by Holicheese (Timmy like windmills!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Baynative
Did anyone really expect anything put together by these liberals to be above board and truthful?

One of these days, they have got to surprise us, and be honest- but I'm not holding my breath, waiting.

17 posted on 08/02/2005 6:55:13 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Holicheese

Thanks for pointing out the word "snafu" like it was a belch at a dinner party. It's a CRIME!!!


18 posted on 08/02/2005 9:12:22 AM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion: The Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Ann Archy; All

Limbaugh talking about this now...


19 posted on 08/02/2005 9:13:42 AM PDT by mewzilla (Property must be secured or liberty cannot exist. John Adams)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: mewzilla

Limbaugh mentioning how the New Media is covering this story, not the MSM.


20 posted on 08/02/2005 9:15:12 AM PDT by mewzilla (Property must be secured or liberty cannot exist. John Adams)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: Ann Archy

Please note that when they found the 800 FBI files in the Clinton White House, they called that a SNAFU too. Sandy Berger...SNAFU.


21 posted on 08/02/2005 9:23:54 AM PDT by Holicheese (Timmy like windmills!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: MplsSteve; Baynative; backhoe

On another thread FREEPER LIBSTRIPPER posted an incisive analysis of this blatant fraud, as follows:


There's a lot here for the feds to get involved in. First of all, there's a good chance that a lot of the money NYC dolled out to Gloria Wise was Federal money.


If so, it's Federal money that was being stolen.


The IRS has a lot to be interested in. Gloria Wise is a 501(c)(3) public charity. Its directors and officers are prohibited by the U. S. Internal Revenue Code from engaging in self dealing.

Cohen, the development director of Gloria Wise, was also the founder of Air America; he worked for and authorized the $800,000 of "loans" to Air America.


Even if they were bona fide loans, that would still raise serious issues of self dealing as far as Cohen and Gloria Wise are concerned and, at a minimum, would jeopardize Gloria Wise's tax exempt status.


However, it's highly doubtful that the $875,000 was ever loaned by Gloria Wise to either Air America or Cohen; rather, it was probably stolen.


As of now there's no indication that Gloria Wise took any
of the normal due diligence steps generally necessary to support such a loan, including: (a) obtaining a business plan from Air America, (b) getting a promissory note at
a market interest rate, (c) obtaining a security agreement, and (d) getting personal guarantees from Air America's principals.


Absent such conventional loan paper work, it looks strongly like Gloria Wise embezzled the money from NYC grants and Air America knowingly, through Cohen, its agent and founder, stole the money from Gloria Wise and used it.


Since NYC probably got a lot of that money initially from the Federal government, The U. S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York ought to start an investigation.


The situation is just about as bad with Cohen personally, since it's likely that Gloria Wise provided him with medical insurance to cover his cancer treatments and the $35,000 "loan" was actually a personal embezzlement.



22 posted on 08/02/2005 9:41:15 AM PDT by Liz (You may not be interested in politics; doesn't mean politics isn't interested in you. Pericles)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: All
 Sitting Out The Scandal; Comparing Coverage: MSM, Talk Radio, Blogosphere -- If you're running Air America Radio right about now, are you

A) horrified your dirty secrets are being aired by bloggers and others, or

B) thrilled, knowing it will shortly be back to business as usual, since the mainstream media has decided to look the other way at your network's past dirty dealings and recent conflicting statements.


23 posted on 08/02/2005 9:50:35 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Liz

I agree with you. This is something the IRS ought to look into.

But so far, the MSM has done a stellar (as usual) job of ignoring the scandal.

That's what irritates me so much.


24 posted on 08/02/2005 10:17:01 AM PDT by MplsSteve
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: backhoe
ANYONE CALLED DAN RATHER TO SEE IF HE CAN HELP WITH THE DOCUMENTATION?
25 posted on 08/02/2005 10:21:24 AM PDT by pointsal
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Holicheese

FUBAR is what ALL the Dems are.


26 posted on 08/02/2005 11:21:38 AM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion: The Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Liz

Thanks for giving me the credit.


27 posted on 08/02/2005 1:06:35 PM PDT by libstripper
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: All
 Franken Finally Speaks; What Took So Long? Is He Credible?
28 posted on 08/02/2005 1:12:19 PM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: libstripper

Great job----keep it up.


29 posted on 08/02/2005 1:25:36 PM PDT by Liz (You may not be interested in politics; doesn't mean politics isn't interested in you. Pericles)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

March 2004:




Inside Air America's Troubles: Optimism and Shaky Finances
The Wall Street Journal ^ | June 21, 2004 | JULIA ANGWIN and SARAH MCBRIDE

Posted on 06/21/2004 3:36:36 AM PDT by visagoth


On March 30, the night before Air America went on the air, the liberal radio network threw itself a $70,000 party at Manhattan's hip Maritime Hotel. More than 1,000 guests, including Yoko Ono and Tim Robbins, drank red, white and blue vodka cocktails as they toasted the network's bid to challenge the dominance of conservative talk radio.




Oh, gosh, I love it. I just love it. There is the Boys and Girls Club money - $70,000 of it. Come on, Tim and Yoko, give it back!

Squirm, Al Frankenberry, squirm.





30 posted on 08/02/2005 2:48:43 PM PDT by Fido969 ("The story is true" - Dan Rather)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: All

If you are so inclined, here's the AIR AMERICA toll-free PHONE NUMBER........ 1-866-303-2270.


31 posted on 08/02/2005 2:59:01 PM PDT by Liz (You may not be interested in politics; doesn't mean politics isn't interested in you. Pericles)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: Liz; libstripper

Thanks for the info- libstripper, that's a good take on the situation. These folks are going to have to do some fancy dancing to skate out of this scandal without facing criminal charges.


32 posted on 08/02/2005 3:31:33 PM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: backhoe

Bookmarked. Damn you're good.


33 posted on 08/03/2005 12:01:57 AM PDT by processing please hold (Islam and Christianity do not mix ----9-11 taught us that)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
 Air America and the race hustlers -- But the raging reverends are nowhere to be found as a scandal involving the liberal radio network Air America and a Bronx, N.Y.-based inner city charity for poor children brews... Race hustlers care about only one color: green.

34 posted on 08/03/2005 1:26:12 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: pbrown
Thanks for the

Bring
Up
My
Post

35 posted on 08/03/2005 1:52:37 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: All
 The Continuing Scandal At Air America (potential wire fraud, forgery, fraud by deception, more) -- The New York Sun takes on the Air America story today and advances it by leaps and bounds -- Now we have potential wire fraud, forgery, and fraud by deception, and  a host of other potent charges...

36 posted on 08/03/2005 2:36:29 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: All
 No laughing matter (Air America steals from poor children and Alzheimer's sufferers)

37 posted on 08/03/2005 2:43:56 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All

Here's the link: http://www.nysun.com/article/17846. Its date is August 1, 2005. Gives the best summary of the scandal of any of the articles to date.


38 posted on 08/03/2005 3:05:49 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: All
 Transcript of Michelle Malkin on Hugh Hewitt's show discussing the Air America scandal -- Once again doing the job of mainstream media, these two biggies of the blogosphere, Michelle Malkin and Hugh Hewitt, spent a couple of segments earlier this afternoon comparing notes on the Gloria Wise/Air America scandal...  as some bloggers have pointed out, Leon H. at Macho Nachos has pointed out, and Stephen Bainbridge pointed out earlier, even previous to this last scandal, that the former people who were involved in Progress Media, which was run by Evan Cohen, many of them were still retained when Piquant LLC was formed. So this whole alibi that Air America has been giving, that this was new ownership, and they had no idea what was happening, it just strains credulity.  And there was a lawyer who commented over at Captain's Quarters today, who said that a lot of the financials from Gloria Wise should be available to any mainstream media person who wants it. So, I'm going to start looking into that angle.

39 posted on 08/03/2005 3:31:36 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
 Missing the Perfect Storm [MSM silence to 'Air America' rip-off]

40 posted on 08/03/2005 4:55:44 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
 PAY UP, LEFTIES! (Air America's new owners, Piquant LLC claim no role in loans) -- first it was less than $500,000, then $800,000, now it's up to  $900,000... Duh. It was just an accident they took tax dollars amounting to $875,000 from "the children" to finance a left-wing agenda (poster climbs back onto turnip truck).
 If Rush had engaged in shenanigans like this, the media would be all over it.

41 posted on 08/03/2005 7:53:58 AM PDT by backhoe ("It's so easy to spend someone else's money." [My Dad, circa 1958])
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: All
 Radio Daze: Inside Air America's Troubles; Optimism and Shaky Finances (liberal conniving) -- If this were any other "big business" the libs would be screaming from the rafters.
Note link, and date:  makethemaccountable.com ^ | June 21, 2004 |
 
 
 Air America Investigation Update- The Al & Jessie Connection!  I am sure you all have wondered why none of the usual urban liberal shakedown artists have chimed in on the Air America Scandal (Air America Under Investigation- Possibly Funded with Non-Profit Grant Money)
 
 Air America Keeps Poor Kids Waiting
 

42 posted on 08/03/2005 10:27:20 AM PDT by backhoe ("It's so easy to spend someone else's money." [My Dad, circa 1958])
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: All
 Where's Our Money? Club: Full AAR Repayment Overdue

43 posted on 08/03/2005 4:47:55 PM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: backhoe
Great job 'ere backhoe! I always go looking for your threads. Add me to any ping list you have please! Thanks!

Bumped for future reference!

(My tagline says it all!)

44 posted on 08/03/2005 6:55:21 PM PDT by America's Resolve (Liberal Democrats are liars, cheats and thieves with no morals, scruples, ethics or honor!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: America's Resolve

Thanks for looking. I quit keeping ping lists a long time ago- got tired of those rude "take me off yer GD list!" emails!


45 posted on 08/04/2005 2:19:32 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: All
 LIB RADIO LOSES EXCUSE FOR LOAN-REPAY DELAY (Air America's deceit---won't pay up for illegal loan) -- A great way to make a living, isn't it? Some how either start a charitable organization, or weasel your way into a top job and make $200-$300 K per year.
46 posted on 08/04/2005 4:23:00 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
The Muckraking N.Y. Times (John Roberts' children, by Michelle Malkin) -- Well, now we know why the NYTimes hasn't bothered to cover Air Enron/Air Scamerica. They're too preoccupied with prying into the adoption records of Supreme Court nominee John Roberts' young children,
 John H. at Power Line: "[N]ow that the Times' investigation into John Roberts' four and five year old children has fizzled out and been abandoned, can they free up some resources to start checking into Air America's financial chicanery?"
 

Fortunately, plenty of others are covering the story while the Times twiddles its thumbs. The latest:

Investor's Business Daily
Washington Times
New York Post
Power Line
Radio Blogger
Hugh Hewitt (Hugh's new Daily Standard column is here).
Edward Morrissey
Rush Limbaugh
Austin Bay
Leon H. at Macho Nachos has a follow up on Air America and legal matters
Scrappleface spoofs: "Air America Hires Dan Rather as Scandal Spokesman"

The New York Sun's David Lombino is undoubtedly digging further.

And, of course, Brian Maloney at the Radio Equalizer remains the first and last stop for news and analysis.


47 posted on 08/05/2005 3:49:47 AM PDT by backhoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
AIR ENRON: THE BLAME GAME
 
 Terms, Please! Neither Party Able To Keep Story Straight (Air America Scandal Latest)
 
 AIR ENRON: QUESTIONS, QUESTIONS
 

48 posted on 08/05/2005 3:44:31 PM PDT by backhoe (Just an old Keyboard Cowboy, ridin' the trackball into the Sunset...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
 

The Air Out There (What did Al Franken know, and when did he know it?)
-- It appears that Air America, the liberal talk radio network, received in its startup period a six-figure loan from the Gloria Wise Boys and Girls Club in the Bronx. This is an organization that receives most of its funds from government agencies and is supposed to provide services to children and Alzheimer's patients.

49 posted on 08/05/2005 4:40:01 PM PDT by backhoe (Just an old Keyboard Cowboy, ridin' the trackball into the Sunset...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
A scandal below the radar (AirScamerica) -- Someone needs to put a face on this. How many kids were denied a chance at camp because of the agenda af a few ideological fanatics. These kids don't give a rats ass about politics, but they pay the price.
 This story has legs:
 http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/articles/0805maceachern05.html
 Increasing Liberal Anger Over Air America Coverage
 
 Air America's 'Deep Throat'; Plus, Bill Press Has Major Conflict Of Interest

50 posted on 08/06/2005 3:15:42 AM PDT by backhoe (Just an old Keyboard Cowboy, ridin' the trackball into the Sunset...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-93 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson