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Report: Fetuses Don't Feel Pain
FOXNews ^ | 8/23/05 | AP

Posted on 08/23/2005 2:34:59 PM PDT by workerbee

A review of medical evidence has found that fetuses likely don't feel pain until the final months of pregnancy, a powerful challenge to abortion opponents who hope that discussions about fetal pain will make women think twice about ending pregnancies.

Critics angrily disputed the findings and claimed the report is biased.

"They have literally stuck their hands into a hornet's nest," said Dr. Kanwaljeet Anand, a fetal pain (search) researcher at the University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences, who believes fetuses as young as 20 weeks old feel pain. "This is going to inflame a lot of scientists who are very, very concerned and are far more knowledgeable in this area than the authors appear to be. This is not the last word -- definitely not."

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abortion; cultureofdeath; fetalpain; fetus; fetuses; lies; pain; silentscream
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To: linkinpunk

What makes you think this will stop third trimester abortions? They'll just find a more "humane" way of murder. A local monster injects the babies with a cardiac drug which stops their heart before he destroys them. He probably thinks that is "humane".


81 posted on 08/23/2005 4:24:24 PM PDT by mollynme (cogito, ergo freepum)
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To: Theophilus
If the sensitivity of a new born baby (we've had seven) is any indication, a fetus may feel pain far more intensely that another person who has already been born. Why? I guess because the brand new perfectly fed and functioning nervous system has experienced little sensation in the warm, floating, cushioned environment of the womb. The skin is so thin and the distance for the nerve impulses is so small. The rapidly growing brain, having never suffered the deterioration of pollution, a joint, a drink or elementary education, not yet distracted and occupied by the tools and tasks of thought, the inputs of sight or the mechanics of movement can only focus on the sensations of it's cradling surroundings and the assuring muffled sound of the mother's heartbeat. Imagine the agony of being burned and/or suddenly ripped apart while in that condition?!?!?

Wow, that's a pretty powerful argument. Thanks.

82 posted on 08/23/2005 4:30:11 PM PDT by adaven (www.conservative-talk.com)
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To: mollynme

If they think that this study is important enough to report, then they should be willing to do something about it.

Personally, I would like to see a full airing from the medical community on the pain babies feel in the womb.

My daughter was born two months early. And for the next six weeks, nurses came in and stuck a needle in her heel to take blood. And that little fetus felt enough pain to cry every time.


83 posted on 08/23/2005 4:34:46 PM PDT by linkinpunk
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To: workerbee

Starving is easy too.


84 posted on 08/23/2005 4:35:20 PM PDT by stocksthatgoup (Polls = Proof that when the MSM want your opinion they will give it to you.)
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To: floriduh voter
"did they ask one???"

Well, they just know these kinds of things; especially the things that are helpful for the Death Culture, you know?

85 posted on 08/23/2005 4:36:45 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Atheist and Fool are synonyms; Evolution is where fools hide from the sunrise)
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To: mollynme

What I am saying is that this study also admits (by omission) that babies DO FEEL PAIN at a certain point in the womb.

So why not agree to do something about that?


86 posted on 08/23/2005 4:38:07 PM PDT by linkinpunk
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To: workerbee

Fetuses May Not Feel Pain in Early Months
http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/08/23/D8C5O7M00.html
LINDSEY TANNER
AP Medical Writer


87 posted on 08/23/2005 4:54:59 PM PDT by rocksblues (I support the war on terror)
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To: SaveTheChief
Exactly. But the left has based its views on abortion not on any sound science, as it so often likes to claim, but the utilitarian principle that the best government is that which allows for the most pleasure and the least pain. For them, the argument that "fetuses feel no pain" serves as just a nail in their plank.

Of course the fact that some animals, even ones as advanced as fishes, don't appear to feel pain either doesn't stop the same utilitarians from use the pleasure/pain argument when arguing in favor of animal rights. But then again, logical inconsitency is the stock in trade of Peter Singer types.

88 posted on 08/23/2005 4:56:30 PM PDT by RightWingAtheist (Creationism is not conservative!)
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To: workerbee
The authors include the administrator of a UCSF abortion clinic, but the researchers dispute the claim that the report is biased.

These people are Nazis and if anybody takes umbrage to my use of the word Nazi, well thats too damn bad so go complain about it elsewhere.

89 posted on 08/23/2005 4:58:37 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Theophilus

You obviously remember very vividly the experience of being born.


90 posted on 08/23/2005 4:59:12 PM PDT by RightWingAtheist (Creationism is not conservative!)
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To: zendari

I really don't think you want the liberals' answer to that question......


91 posted on 08/23/2005 5:02:48 PM PDT by cincinnati65 (Just up the road a piece.......)
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To: Shalom Israel
"Time for another sequel to "Silent Scream".

Definitely. Speaking of screaming, wait until the Roberts confirmation hearings. This study/article was made in anticipation of that debate, IMHO....

92 posted on 08/23/2005 5:05:44 PM PDT by eureka! (Hey Lefties: Only 3 and 1/3 more years of W. Hehehehe....)
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To: RightWingAtheist
These people are disgusting. They aren't fetal pain researchers , they are Nazi scientists with an agenda. From the article:

"Administering anesthesia directly to the fetus is also sometimes done but generally to reduce the release of potentially harmful fetal stress hormones (search), Rosen (Nazi scientist) said. There is little research on its effects, the authors said."

Well the release of fetal stress hormones, which is measurable, is a direct result of pain. Babies earlier than 20 weeks have been found to release these hormones when stuck with a needle in utero. It's observable and measurable. Now tell me why should anybody trust a scientist if the scientific community doesn't reject this meta study laced with bs?

93 posted on 08/23/2005 5:10:47 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: jwalsh07
Now tell me why should anybody trust a scientist if the scientific community doesn't reject this meta study laced with bs?

Because science doesn't work through surface judgements, but from carefully examining the evidence and arguments. While some may immediately either hold this study up or put it down because of their personal beliefs, most scientists will treat it with the same skepticism and closer examination that they would any other paper making sweeping judgements.

94 posted on 08/23/2005 5:14:54 PM PDT by RightWingAtheist (Creationism is not conservative!)
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To: RightWingAtheist
I'm a patient man, I didn't demand immediate condemnation but if condemnation does not obtain, my opinion of scientists in general will reflect that absence.

And this isn't science by any definition, it's politics.

95 posted on 08/23/2005 5:19:38 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: workerbee

(If true....)

Neither do quadriplegics.

And so...?

Dan


96 posted on 08/23/2005 5:20:50 PM PDT by BibChr ("...behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, so what wisdom is in them?" [Jer. 8:9])
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To: Tim Long

Well, they did mention that one of the authors of the paper personally runs an abortion mill, and not only do they give ample time to a critic of the paper who has the appropriate research credentials to do so, he is most definitely not a Christian (judging by his name, he's probably Sikh or from a Sikh family background). On any other network, they probably wouldn't mentioned that one of the authors has a vested interest in the results (in constrast, in other instances where politics and sciences intersect, they always take care to point out the political and business "ties" of scientists on the "conservative" side but not those on the "liberal" side), and they would probably go to a fire-breathing fire-and-brimstone preacher to get the pro-life opinion on the story.


97 posted on 08/23/2005 5:23:42 PM PDT by RightWingAtheist (Creationism is not conservative!)
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To: jwalsh07

You're confusing scientific judgement with moral judgment. A good scientist may assess this article as being scientifically sound, yet empathetically insist that it should not be used as the final word in deciding a complex issue. Certainly, this article does not make me sway at all in my pro-life views; even if fetuses don't feel pain, it does not stop me from viewing abortion as a particularly barbaric form of muder.


98 posted on 08/23/2005 5:27:08 PM PDT by RightWingAtheist (Creationism is not conservative!)
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To: RightWingAtheist

Good point, but what say you to the Matt Drudge incident?


99 posted on 08/23/2005 5:31:59 PM PDT by Tim Long
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To: RightWingAtheist
You're confusing scientific judgement with moral judgment.

Absolutely wrong, they are NOT fetal pain researchers, they are politicos with an agenda who did a meta study of other peoples work and used SOME of the data to justify their predetermined conclusion in order to scuttle fetal pain bills. You're confusing science and politics.

A good scientist may assess this article as being scientifically sound, yet empathetically insist that it should not be used as the final word in deciding a complex issue.

I already told you why it is scientifically unsound, you just chose to ignore it and I am not a scientist. It doesn't pass the laugh test if you have any aquaintance at all with the brain, the nervous system and fetal pain research. It is garbage.

Certainly, this article does not make me sway at all in my pro-life views; even if fetuses don't feel pain, it does not stop me from viewing abortion as a particularly barbaric form of muder.

Well, thats laudable but you should recognize dogcrap when you see it, it saves time cleaning your shoes.

100 posted on 08/23/2005 5:34:25 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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