Posted on 10/15/2005 3:15:52 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
This argument is pure sophistry anyway. "Oh, you can't find where he said exactly that, so you aren't justified in expecting a strict constructionist."
The term "strict constructionsit" is so indefiniate as to be useless. O'Connor and Souter probably assert that they fit that mold. So to disambiguate the term "strict constructionist," it is convenient to name some examples. There is no dispute, Bush said "strict constructionst", "not legislate from the bench" "faithfully interpret the laws under the Constitution," and similar. As a matter of offerin a benchmark for what that meant, he offered Scalia and Thomas.
If somebody wants to argue that he didn't make that promise, then the person advancing the argument is just looking for a word game fight.
Some folks just get stuck on stupid.
Thank you very much.
Let this be put on the record for all of FR:
"BUSH: Voters should assume that I have no litmus test on that issue or any other issue. The voters will know I'll put competent judges on the bench, people who will strictly interpret the Constitution and will not use the bench to write social policy.
And that's going to be a big difference between my opponent and me. I believe that -- I believe that the judges ought not to take the place of the legislative branch of government, that they're appointed for life and that they ought to look at the Constitution as sacred. They shouldn't misuse their bench. I don't believe in liberal, activist judges. I believe in -- I believe in strict constructionists. And those are the kind of judges I will appoint.
I've named four Supreme Court judges in the state of Texas, and I would ask the people to check out their qualifications, their deliberations. They're good, solid men and women who have made good sound judgments on behalf of the people of Texas."
You're doing it again.
You will be a useful idiot to Hitlery, just like the Perot people were for Bill. Matter of fact, I wouldn't be surprised if George Soros and Hitlery are not even now, making plans for some third party, bought off 'messiah', which someone like you will be be stirred up and driven to, since emotional types are easy to manipulate by the MSM. Yes, they will both be sitting around some table, sipping cognac, LAUGHING at you. "What a sucker, what a dupe, ..."
I have heard it reported and referred to by pundits.
Cartoonists take great liberties...so I wouldn't hang my hat on them.
As an observer and reader of the posts here...don't think you were called a liar -- hope you don't believe it either -- still just a recollection/belief until someone can document it. Jim has called the FR Dogs out and many of us are looking still.
Oh....crap...just realized this sounds like a CBS report...Guilty...don't need no stinking proof (are the docs dry yet???). [grin!]
It does explain why Scalia can write and Miers can't.
All I'm saying is I repeated the oft repeated quote that Bush "promised justices in the mold of Scalia and Thomas" and was called on it. I didn't want to be inaccurate, so Googled for it and could not find Bush actually stating those exact words. Gore stated them. Don't know if he was the first or not, but many pundits, writers and posters since have attributed Bush for the quote. It's now a dirct promise. But it appears Bush never stated those exact words. It appears to be urban legend.
http://mediamatters.org/
http://www.discoverthenetwork.org/groupprofile.asp?grpid=7150
Self-described "progressive" media "monitor" which tracks content that "forwards a conservative agenda."
Creation of Democratic Party funders and operatives
Headed by confessed liar and political turncoat David Brock
Attacks conservatives for holding conservative opinions
Lied about its connections to groups affiliated with leftwing financier George Soros
In its short history, Media Matters has established itself as one of the most vocal and irresponsible combat organs of the Democratic Party. In 2004 the organization boasted that its website had elicited some 150,000 comments in its discussion forums and that over 22,000 subscribers had registered to receive its e-mail alerts. Brock has also become a regular feature on leftwing radio stations like Air America, where he appears every Wednesday. The show, according to Brock, "is a great means for us to be able to disseminate our material
" More specifically, programs like those of Air America provide Brock with a venue to defame conservatives as individuals who "are simply willing to lie," and who "are not necessarily trying to win these arguments on a factual level" - a perfect self-description. Media Matters staffers are also favorites of such supposedly non-partisan radio programs as National Public Radio's On The Media, which invites them to complain, as Media Matters senior advisor Jamison Foser did during a July 2005 appearance, that media coverage of the Bush administration is insufficiently critical.
You could not be more mistaken. The people who are upset with this nomination are the fathest thing from self centered as can be. The arguments coming from this side represent a principle of open, tranparent government, under the system envisioned by the founders. You "party first" blokes are willing to use stealth to win elections.
The GOP is not advancing the conservative agenda as it said it would. The GOP has the burden of wooing voters. If you want the GOP to succesdd, you better start wooing and stop kicking people in the knees.
That Democrats have been able to use a procedural motion to wield an veto over the government is an abomination that the GOP has allowed to happen. We cannot accept the Democrats' terms, which state that no known conservative can be confirmed even though the Senate is not in their control.
I know. But where is the direct quote from Bush. That's all I'm asking.
I can't believe you just said that!
Also, I have read a number of posts here that seem to be taking it for granted that Bush or some spokesman is actively spinning that there was no promise or statement like "in the mold of Scalia of Thomas". I read the entire article and the one it linked to and saw nothing like that. And I've seen nothing like that anywhere else.
This is getting out of hand.
There are fewer 2000 recordings and transcripts/texts and I didn't find any discussion of SCOTUS appointments in any of the material I've reviewed to date.
That would be the "fair hearing" full of "I can't answer" like Roberts and Ginsburg.
I did find this from July 2000 (BEFORE the Gore debates): "Presidential candidate George W. Bush has publicly stated that Antonin Scalia and Clarence Thomas, the current Court's most far-right Justices, will be the models for his appointments." It's from the nutjob People for the American Way and not an exact quote. It is, however, suggestive that the Gore debates were not the source of this Scalia-Thomas notion. I'm still looking.
It's not worth digging up. This is a stupid word game that distracts from the problem at hand. The people saying "you can't find where he said that" are basically trying to advance the argument that "Bush didn't promise strict constructionists."
An that argument works directly against their "trust him" rationale for supporting Miers.
Stuck on Stupid.
I think you're right. Leftist Democrats are astoundingly good at getting what they want on the bench: statist, anti-gun, anti-traditional family, pro-choice judges.
Republicans are absolutely terrible at it, and have an awful track record.
What is the difference? Leftist Democrats are very comfortable with the secular humanist ideology of their base, and Republicans are deeply uncomfortable with the ideology of their base - religious conservatives, economic conservatives, combination, etc.
I agree with you.
But just for argument's sake, let's assume Bush DID "promise" to nominate judges "in the mold of Thomas or Scalia."
And that leads me to my question: How are Harriet Miers's qualifications and known beliefs NOT like Thomas's, before his confirmation?
"First: Does anyone really think a Justice with a long and clearly published track record proving that person would be like Justices Scalia or Thomas would have even the slightest chance of getting confirmed?"
The Republicans in the WH must certainly try. That's part of the bargain.
"We do NOT have a conservative majority in the Senate...45 votes, tops, would ever go for a clearly conservative nominee."
That's speculation, but let's grant that. Say that 10 Republicans defect on a conservative nom. The thing is, they do not get to choose the next nominee. Bush does. If they reject the next one, Bush gets to choose again, and so on. The advantage you're supposed to have with a supposedly conservative President is that he can choose only conservative Justices to be confirmed. Doesn't matter how long it takes, or how many are intially turned down. If the pressure is kept up, eventually one would get through.
But such a display of resolve against other politicians is uncharacteristic of Bush. His background has shown him to be a "uniter, not a divider" who works with Democrats, not against them.
I agree. LOL!
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