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KU prof's e-mail irks fundamentalists (Christian Bashing OK)
Wichita Eagle ^ | 25 Nov 2005 | Associated Press

Posted on 11/25/2005 8:34:07 AM PST by Exton1

KU prof's e-mail irks fundamentalists

http://www.kansas.com/mld/eagle/living/religion/13252419.htm

Associated Press

LAWRENCE - Critics of a new course that equates creationism and intelligent design with mythology say an e-mail sent by the chairman of the University of Kansas religious studies department proves the course is designed to mock fundamentalist Christians.

In a recent message on a Yahoo listserv, Paul Mirecki said of the course "Special Topics in Religion: Intelligent Design, Creationisms and Other Religious Mythologies":

"The fundies want it all taught in a science class, but this will be a nice slap in their big fat face by teaching it as a religious studies class under the category mythology."

He signed the note "Doing my part (to upset) the religious right, Evil Dr. P."

Kansas Provost David Shulenburger said Wednesday that he regretted the words Mirecki used but that he supported the professor and thought the course would be taught in a professional manner.

"My understanding was that was a private e-mail communication that somehow was moved out of those channels and has become a public document," Shulenburger said.

The course was added to next semester's curriculum after the Kansas State Board of Education adopted new school science standards that question evolution.

The course will explore intelligent design, which contends that life is too complex to have evolved without a "designer." It also will cover the origins of creationism, why creationism is an American phenomenon and creationism's role in politics and education.

State Sen. Karin Brownlee, R-Olathe, said she was concerned by Mirecki's comments in the e-mail.

"His intent to make a mockery of Christian beliefs is inappropriate," she said.

Mirecki said the private e-mail was accessed by an outsider.

"They had been reading my e-mails all along," he said. "Where are the ethics in that, I ask."

When asked about conservative anger directed at him and the new course, Mirecki said: "A lot of people are mad about what's going on in Kansas, and I'm one of them."

Mirecki has been taking criticism since the course was announced.

"This man is a hateful man," said state Sen. Kay O'Connor, R-Olathe. "Are we supposed to be using tax dollars to promote hatred?"

But others support Mirecki.

Tim Miller, a fellow professor in the department of religious studies, said intelligent design proponents are showing that they don't like having their beliefs scrutinized.

"They want their religion taught as fact," Miller said. "That's simply something you can't do in a state university."

Hume Feldman, associate professor of physics and astronomy, said he planned to be a guest lecturer in the course. He said the department of religious studies was a good place for intelligent design.

"I think that is exactly the appropriate place to put these kinds of ideas," he said.

John Altevogt, a conservative columnist and activist in Kansas City, said the latest controversy was sparked by the e-mail.

"He says he's trying to offend us," Altevogt said. "The entire tenor of this thing just reeks of religious bigotry."

Brownlee said she was watching to see how the university responded to the e-mail.

"We have to set a standard that it's not culturally acceptable to mock Christianity in America," she said.

University Senate Executive Committee Governance Office - 33 Strong Hall, 4-5169

Faculty

SenEx Chair

Joe Heppert, jheppert@ku.edu , Chemistry, 864-2270 Ruth Ann Atchley, ratchley@ku.edu , Psychology, 864-9816 Richard Hale, rhale@ku.edu ,Aerospace Engineering, 864-2949 Bob Basow, basow@ku.edu , Journalism, 864-7633 Susan Craig, scraig@ku.edu , Art & Architecture, 864-3020 Margaret Severson, mseverson@Ku.edu , Social Welfare, 864-8952
University Council President Jim Carothers, jbc@ku.edu , English 864-3426 (Ex-officio on SenEx)

Paul Mirecki, Chair The Department of Religious Studies, 1300 Oread Avenue, 102 Smith Hall, College of Liberal Arts and Sciences, University of Kansas,Lawrence, KS 66045-7615 (785) 864-4663 Voice (785) 864-5205 FAX rstudies@ku.edu


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Kansas
KEYWORDS: bigot; christian; crevolist; goddoodit; ku; lefty; leftybigot; mirecki; muslim; religion
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To: dsc
How interesting that you call me a "Mullah," when you defend the "right" of this professor to abuse his authority by infringing on freedom of religion, while I am arguing for the free exercise of religion. Usually a person has to be a DUmmy to get things that twisted.

This from the same idiot who thinks we need to start shooting academics? You are a joke on any forum.

121 posted on 11/25/2005 2:26:36 PM PST by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: Quark2005; dsc
His comments were cited from a Yahoo listserv. How does this involve public funds?

His comments may or may not, but certainly the class would.

As to his comments, "My understanding was that was a private e-mail communication that somehow was moved out of those channels and has become a public document," Shulenburger said.

I would wager that public funds were used somewhere.

122 posted on 11/25/2005 2:37:29 PM PST by AndrewC (Darwinian logic -- It is just-so if it is just-so)
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To: Right Wing Professor
Get real, bubba.

There is a difference between criticism and mockery. To wit.

Criticism: The act of criticizing, especially adversely. A critical comment or judgment.
The practice of analyzing, classifying, interpreting, or evaluating literary or other artistic works. A critical article or essay; a critique. The investigation of the origin and history of literary documents; textual criticism.

Mockery: Scornfully contemptuous ridicule; derision. A specific act of ridicule or derision. An object of scorn or ridicule: made a mockery of the rules. A false, derisive, or impudent imitation: The trial was a mockery of justice. Something ludicrously futile or unsuitable: The few packages of food seemed a mockery in the face of such enormous destitution.

Failure to realize the difference proves, again, the bankruptcy of professorial pretendence.

123 posted on 11/25/2005 2:37:44 PM PST by Thumper1960 ("There is no 'tolerance', there are only changing fashions in intolerance." - 'The Western Standard')
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To: Thumper1960
There is a difference between criticism and mockery.

Sure. And some things deserve only mockery...

Failure to realize the difference proves, again, the bankruptcy of professorial pretendence.

...; for example, worthy of mockery are people who make up words like 'pretendence'.

124 posted on 11/25/2005 3:13:48 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor
[set a standard that it's not culturally acceptable to mock Christianity in America," she said.
Ah, I see. So Christianity is to be above criticism. Somebody email Senator Brownlee a copy of the First Amendment.]

criticism <> mockery
125 posted on 11/25/2005 3:14:21 PM PST by starbase (One singular sensation.)
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To: dsc
There are limits even on free speech, the old "fire in a crowded theater" being the most familiar example. Speech that interferes with the free exercise of religion is another.

Mocking religion does not interefere with its free exercise.

How interesting that you call me a "Mullah," when you defend the "right" of this professor to abuse his authority by infringing on freedom of religion, while I am arguing for the free exercise of religion.

How did the professor interfere with free exercise?

126 posted on 11/25/2005 3:15:17 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: AmishDude
That's what makes it monkey-work. It's just an algorithm. Grab the handle. Turn the crank. There's your answer. The real questions are: Can you prove that the algorithm always gives a maximum parsimony tree? That's "proof" now. Not proof-by-example. What is the average-time performance? What conditions on the sequences will fail to produce average-time performance? Can they be considered "unnatural"? Can you construct a tree in polynomial time such that the number of changes to connect all elements on the tree is always at most (1+epsilon)M where M is the minimum and epsilon is a fixed positive constant.

These are exercises for a math class, not a biology class.

Get a clue.

127 posted on 11/25/2005 3:17:08 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: starbase; Right Wing Professor

criticism <> mockery

Since we're parsing and splitting rhetorical/definitional hairs, mockery is certainly a subset of criticism.

128 posted on 11/25/2005 3:25:27 PM PST by ml1954 (NOT the disruptive troll seen frequently on CREVO threads)
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To: onja; Coyoteman
But also there are no trees before the supposed time of the flood. They all magically start at around 4000 or so years.

you really, REALLY need to look beyond creationist sources if you are going to debate this issue.

You have been lied to - there were trees FAR earlier than 4000 years ago (2000BC) and FAR earlier than 4000BC (6000 years ago)

if you desire evidence, look up Amber. That is pertified pine tree sap. There are quite a few examples of such, even some containing trapped insects, dating from before the KT Event (~65 MILLION years ago) where there was pine sap, there were pines. I encourage you to seek more - there is quite a staggering amount of it.

while you are at it, you might wish to contemplate the problem for YEC (and especially the Flood notion) posed by the existence of the iridium layer known as the KT Boundary. If you wish, I will illustrate why it is a serious problem for Flood Believers, but I would prefer to leave you to work it out on your own.

129 posted on 11/25/2005 3:56:46 PM PST by King Prout (many accuse me of being overly literal... this would not be a problem if many were not under-precise)
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To: onja; Coyoteman
(lost a line somehow)

But also there are no trees before the supposed time of the flood. They all magically start at around 4000 or so years.

you really, REALLY need to look beyond creationist sources if you are going to debate this issue.

You have been lied to - there were trees FAR earlier than 4000 years ago (2000BC) and FAR earlier than 4000BC (6000 years ago)

if you desire evidence, look up Amber. That is pertified pine tree sap. There are quite a few examples of such, even some containing trapped insects, dating from before the KT Event (~65 MILLION years ago)
where there was pine tree sap, there were pine trees.

that is one minor sample of evidence.

I encourage you to seek more - there is quite a staggering amount of it.

while you are at it, you might wish to contemplate the problem for YEC (and especially the Flood notion) posed by the existence of the iridium layer known as the KT Boundary. If you wish, I will illustrate why it is a serious problem for Flood Believers, but I would prefer to leave you to work it out on your own.

130 posted on 11/25/2005 4:07:04 PM PST by King Prout (many accuse me of being overly literal... this would not be a problem if many were not under-precise)
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To: balrog666

"This from the same idiot who thinks we need to start shooting academics? You are a joke on any forum."

Trying to perpetuate a fallacy, eh? That's very "scientific" of you.


131 posted on 11/25/2005 4:33:54 PM PST by dsc
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To: Quark2005

"His comments were cited from a Yahoo listserv. How does this involve public funds?"

His remarks serve only to blow his cover. The abuse of authority and misuse of public funds lies in what he did and plans to do with regard to the class.


132 posted on 11/25/2005 4:38:53 PM PST by dsc
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To: dsc
Trying to perpetuate a fallacy, eh? That's very "scientific" of you.

He's a SIPO. Scientist In Pretension Only

133 posted on 11/25/2005 4:44:46 PM PST by AndrewC (Darwinian logic -- It is just-so if it is just-so)
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To: Right Wing Professor

"Mocking religion does not interefere with its free exercise."

It can. Free exercise includes equal access to public facilities. Making believers objects of mockery impairs their equal access.

"How did the professor interfere with free exercise?"

By attempting to make believers objects of mockery, thereby impairing their equal access to the university.


134 posted on 11/25/2005 4:49:06 PM PST by dsc
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To: AmishDude
You are welcome to defend your faith by claiming that it is a better faith than others, but that does not make it any less a faith.

And calling a well-established method a "faith" doesn't make it a faith.
135 posted on 11/25/2005 4:49:27 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: dsc

It can. Free exercise includes equal access to public facilities. Making believers objects of mockery impairs their equal access.

By attempting to make believers objects of mockery, thereby impairing their equal access to the university.

You have learned and adopted the ways of the left-wing postmodern deconstructionists well, grasshopper. However, any criticism you may have ever had of their methods has now become invalid as you have become as one with them in your methods.

136 posted on 11/25/2005 4:58:35 PM PST by ml1954 (NOT the disruptive troll seen frequently on CREVO threads)
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To: Right Wing Professor
You mean to say that you instruct your students to crank out an algorithm (which exists as software on many platforms, including java right on the web) and you don't even verify that it always works?

What I ask are fundamental questions regarding your technique. Again, running the algorithm is not conceptually difficult. There's nothing to understand, it's all shallow.

137 posted on 11/25/2005 5:04:14 PM PST by AmishDude (Your corporate slogan could be here! FReepmail me for my confiscatory rates.)
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To: Dimensio
And calling a well-established method a "faith" doesn't make it a faith.

You have a great deal of faith in the notion that the method is well-established (care to quantify?) and in the means by which the method was established.

138 posted on 11/25/2005 5:05:35 PM PST by AmishDude (Your corporate slogan could be here! FReepmail me for my confiscatory rates.)
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To: ml1954

"You have learned and adopted"

Road apples.

What I am learning here is that there are those on the atheistic evolution side who are every bit as intellectually dishonest as Michael Moore and Al Franken.


139 posted on 11/25/2005 5:08:45 PM PST by dsc
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To: AmishDude
You have a great deal of faith in the notion that the method is well-established (care to quantify?) and in the means by which the method was established.

Are you suggesting that science abandon the scientific method? I'm having trouble discerning what it is you're trying to argue here.

140 posted on 11/25/2005 5:14:45 PM PST by Quark2005 (Science aims to elucidate. Pseudoscience aims to obfuscate.)
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