You bet wrong. We look at morphology, not size. See the following:
STS 14 Pelvis (on the left)
~Discovered by Robert Broom and J.T. Robinson at Sterkfontein, South Africa in 1947
~Dated to 2.5 million years
What do you think?
Posted on 11/25/2005 8:34:07 AM PST by Exton1
KU prof's e-mail irks fundamentalists
http://www.kansas.com/mld/eagle/living/religion/13252419.htm
Associated Press
LAWRENCE - Critics of a new course that equates creationism and intelligent design with mythology say an e-mail sent by the chairman of the University of Kansas religious studies department proves the course is designed to mock fundamentalist Christians.
In a recent message on a Yahoo listserv, Paul Mirecki said of the course "Special Topics in Religion: Intelligent Design, Creationisms and Other Religious Mythologies":
"The fundies want it all taught in a science class, but this will be a nice slap in their big fat face by teaching it as a religious studies class under the category mythology."
He signed the note "Doing my part (to upset) the religious right, Evil Dr. P."
Kansas Provost David Shulenburger said Wednesday that he regretted the words Mirecki used but that he supported the professor and thought the course would be taught in a professional manner.
"My understanding was that was a private e-mail communication that somehow was moved out of those channels and has become a public document," Shulenburger said.
The course was added to next semester's curriculum after the Kansas State Board of Education adopted new school science standards that question evolution.
The course will explore intelligent design, which contends that life is too complex to have evolved without a "designer." It also will cover the origins of creationism, why creationism is an American phenomenon and creationism's role in politics and education.
State Sen. Karin Brownlee, R-Olathe, said she was concerned by Mirecki's comments in the e-mail.
"His intent to make a mockery of Christian beliefs is inappropriate," she said.
Mirecki said the private e-mail was accessed by an outsider.
"They had been reading my e-mails all along," he said. "Where are the ethics in that, I ask."
When asked about conservative anger directed at him and the new course, Mirecki said: "A lot of people are mad about what's going on in Kansas, and I'm one of them."
Mirecki has been taking criticism since the course was announced.
"This man is a hateful man," said state Sen. Kay O'Connor, R-Olathe. "Are we supposed to be using tax dollars to promote hatred?"
But others support Mirecki.
Tim Miller, a fellow professor in the department of religious studies, said intelligent design proponents are showing that they don't like having their beliefs scrutinized.
"They want their religion taught as fact," Miller said. "That's simply something you can't do in a state university."
Hume Feldman, associate professor of physics and astronomy, said he planned to be a guest lecturer in the course. He said the department of religious studies was a good place for intelligent design.
"I think that is exactly the appropriate place to put these kinds of ideas," he said.
John Altevogt, a conservative columnist and activist in Kansas City, said the latest controversy was sparked by the e-mail.
"He says he's trying to offend us," Altevogt said. "The entire tenor of this thing just reeks of religious bigotry."
Brownlee said she was watching to see how the university responded to the e-mail.
"We have to set a standard that it's not culturally acceptable to mock Christianity in America," she said.
University Senate Executive Committee Governance Office - 33 Strong Hall, 4-5169
Faculty
SenEx Chair
Joe Heppert, jheppert@ku.edu , Chemistry, 864-2270 Ruth Ann Atchley, ratchley@ku.edu , Psychology, 864-9816 Richard Hale, rhale@ku.edu ,Aerospace Engineering, 864-2949 Bob Basow, basow@ku.edu , Journalism, 864-7633 Susan Craig, scraig@ku.edu , Art & Architecture, 864-3020 Margaret Severson, mseverson@Ku.edu , Social Welfare, 864-8952
University Council President Jim Carothers, jbc@ku.edu , English 864-3426 (Ex-officio on SenEx)
Paul Mirecki, Chair The Department of Religious Studies, 1300 Oread Avenue, 102 Smith Hall, College of Liberal Arts and Sciences, University of Kansas,Lawrence, KS 66045-7615 (785) 864-4663 Voice (785) 864-5205 FAX rstudies@ku.edu
My Ph.D. is in mathematics (Univ of MN, 1975), but I have also studied physics, chemistry, and astronomy at the university level, and done wide reading in philosophy of mathematics and philosophy of science beginning with a series of college level courses in philosophy. My formal study of biology ended in high school, but personal studies have kept me in touch with developments in molecular biology at the level covered in, e.g., Watson's "Molecular Biology of the Gene". I see, in checking the Amazon listing, that I am one edition behind (4th). I will have to pick up the 5th edition and see what I've missed in the last few years.
If you look back on my posts you will not see much name calling. I don't consider it productive.
Thanks for a brief glimpse into your background. That gives me some idea of who I am dealing with. I have a Ph.D. in Anthropology, and two of my fields for the exams were human osteology and fossil man.
So, let the games resume!
Those interested in following the discussions about the development of biological knowledge beyond the polemical level may also want to become familiar with this text:
Molecular Biology of the Cell, Fourth Edition (Hardcover)
by Bruce Alberts, Alexander Johnson, Julian Lewis, Martin Raff, Keith Roberts, Peter Walter
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0815332181/ref=pd_bxgy_text_b/102-5784961-9541720?%5Fencoding=UTF8
Students of computer science and mathematics will find much to fascinate them in the advances of molecular biology. Some of the most interesting challenges in the representation and formal manipulation of information are being set forth by the investigators on the frontiers of this discipline.
OK. So we've established your goal is a fundamentalist theocracy. That's what we thought, but thanks for confirming it.
Sure thing, Mullah Omar. But here in America, we have this thing called "free speech".
Being rude and antagonistic is protected speech.
No, I was pointing out that our contemporary society holds some religions as sacrosanct while leaving other religions open for cheap pot shots.
I'm sorry you missed this obvious point. Maybe if you let go of your anti-Christian bias, you'll be able to appreciate the reality of the situation.
I would expect that someone with a PhD in mathematics would understand that it is totally meaningless to apply probability in such a convoluted manner.
No silly, it took billions of years. You want days, see the bible literalists.
Wow. Believing in evolution makes one anti-God, and anti-American to the order of the islamic terrorists. Who knew?
No idea. Bones are more my field.
Yeah, I pretty much accept around that time period. There is a lot of flood evidence. I personally find it important though that every culture has had an almost identical flood story seperate of each other. That's pretty cool.
With those pictures, does that show the evolution of chimps into homo sapiens? Are those ones in between supposed to be the missing links between apes and man? If so, do you have a link that tells how they are similar? I'm not really much of a archaologist so I don't really understand those pictures. For all I know all those could all be humans(shows my ignorance).
bump
So, you're saying the Big Bang didn't occur?
Why don't you prepare an alternative scientific model of the Creation of the universe that explains the observed cosmic redshift, 3 degree Kelvin isotropic background radiation, universal H/He/Li element ratios and increasing presence of quasars & bluer stars with greater astronomical distances; then get back to us with your findings.
God said, "Let there be Heavens" or something like that. :)
You bet wrong. We look at morphology, not size. See the following:
STS 14 Pelvis (on the left)
~Discovered by Robert Broom and J.T. Robinson at Sterkfontein, South Africa in 1947
~Dated to 2.5 million years
What do you think?
The point of my post #57 was to show you some of the fossil evidence. You had written in #54 "There should be tons of fossil evidence. There isn't."
I don't expect you to know all of the details of these specimens, as that takes years of study. But the point I am trying to make is that you are dismissing a couple of hundred years of evidence by thousands of scientists, with little actual knowledge on your part of the field, theories, or data. You are acting from your religious belief.
Yeah, I pretty much accept around that time period. There is a lot of flood evidence. I personally find it important though that every culture has had an almost identical flood story seperate of each other. That's pretty cool.
On the flood--I have been in a lot of residential sites in the western US which cross-cut the 4,000-5,000 time period and there is no evidence of a large scale flood. Rather, we have general continuity of stratigraphy, occupation, pollen, macrobotanical (plant parts) remains, radiocarbon dates, etc.
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