Skip to comments.Gang rapist claims right to assault
Posted on 12/09/2005 2:52:39 PM PST by Mount Athos
THE eldest of four Pakistani gang rapist brothers has admitted lying at trial and apologised to his victims but said he thought he had a right to rape the "promiscuous" teenage girls.
MSK, 27, told the NSW Supreme Court yesterday that this was because the girls did not wear headscarves, were drinking alcohol and were unaccompanied when they went to his Ashfield home. MSK also blamed his intoxication, "cultural beliefs" and an undiagnosed mental disorder.
He and his brothers MAK, 25, MRK, 21, and MMK, 19 - who cannot be named for legal reasons - are serving between 10 and 22 years for raping two girls in 2002. All except MRK are yet to be sentenced for several other rapes.
Yesterday evidence was being heard on a sentence for MSK for the rapes of two more girls, TW, then 14, and CH, then 13. He admitted that some of the evidence he had given at an earlier trial was fabricated, particularly that he had had consensual sex with TW and that she had coaxed him.
"It was a pretty big untruth when you said that it was consensual sex, wasn't it?" asked the Crown prosecutor, Ken McKay.
"Yes," he replied.
You chose to lie about that, correct? - Yes.
During a long apology to TW, who was in court, he stopped mid-sentence to reprimand her.
"I wish to say this to [TW], that at the time when I commit these offences I come from such a background which led me to - don't shake your head, I'm telling you something - I say now that I hurt you and I'm extremely, extremely apologetic to you and I'm, I wish to say one thing more.
"I'm serving 22 years I'm just requesting to you that you one day may come that you realise that the person who assaulted me is in prison and I should forgive him. I'm asking for your forgiveness." He said it was only now, since he had gained a "better understanding of Australian culture", that he knew the rapes were wrong.
He arrived in Sydney for the ninth and final time four days before committing several rapes over six months. He had planned to study medicine.
He agreed he knew the girls did not want to have sex. "[TW] said no but I go ahead with it because I believe that at the time I commit these offences, I believe that she was promiscuous " he said. "She don't know us, I don't know her, like she was not related to us and she was not wearing any purdah like she was not covered her face, she was not wearing any headscarf and she started drinking with us and she was singing.
"First off, I was actually, I was not taking my medication so I was under the influence of voices and secondly I believe at the time when I commit these offences that she had no right to say no."
Mr McKay said the voices excuse was a last-ditch strategy to avoid justice. "You wanted to hurt and terrorise these girls and you did that. You used acts of sexual intercourse on them."
The matter was adjourned until next Friday.
Religion of peace ping.
Aren't the last two pretty much the same thing?
and an undiagnosed mental disorder.
Its not undiagnosed, its called radical islam.
He's not lying about his rape-based cultural upbringings.
Rape is punishable by hanging in Pakistan.
The difference is that the character of the victim can be questioned in Pakistan, unlike in most Western states (and even that is a recent development, where rape is still grossly underreported by women).
Religion of pieces.
One of his so-called "cultural beliefs" is that he is forbidden to use alcohol. Hypocrisy, for sure. The undiagnosed mental disorder is easy; it is called ISLAM!
A "radical Islamist" would never admit to intoxication. Alcohol is banned by Islam.
For raping a girl because she was drinking alcohol!?!?
...or lack thereof
and an undiagnosed mental disorder
Is Islam mentioned in the DSM-IV?
Religion of Feces..
Do they have the "buddy" system in Aussieland, or are the prisons not quite as brutal there?
There are over a billion Muslims in the world. Most live peacefully. Fundamentalism, no matter what its ilk, generally attempts to control people, usually unsuccessfully.
Read what he actually has to say.
It sounds like he's remorseful.
Lock him up, certainly. He did the crime, he deserves to do the crime.
But remember - if Islam is a religion of submission, Christianity is a religion of repentance and redemption.
"undiagnosed mental disorder"
I think that is called being muslim and thinking you have the right to rape women. Either that or it is when you are an a$$hole POS. I get the two mixed up.
They are the sons of a medical doctor and they are rapists. Lee Glendinning reports on two of four brothers found guilty of gang rape in attacks that upended the NSW legal system:
Ok, let's agree with the rapist.
And since he has been "promiscous" his inmates in prison have the same "right".
but, do they hang the offender or the victim?
"Muzzzies" is the new word for them...just like the "skinnies" in Mogadishu.....or "Charlie" in Vietnam...and on and on and on....the Earth's dregs....
Undiagnosed mental disorder religion of rape bump
Men found guilty of rape in Muslim countries face the death penalty.
Incidentally, the death penalty is not in accordance with sharia, which stipulates that unmarried men be lashed for committing rape, and married men be stoned to death (because they are committing adultery).
The problem for women is that burden of proof is quite high.
Oh, I see, it is the religion of piece, not peace and this allows them to rape at will. Well, that makes it ok then. I thought he raped them because he was a vicious, lying, criminal, scumbag, muslim terrorist! This clarifies it and makes it right/S
Yeah, right. It takes four male witnesses to the crime to charge a muslim male with rape. It almost never happens, and I want to know what kind of men would stand around watching a women get raped and do nothing about it when they have the rapist outnumbered 4 to 1. This religion sucks, I have tried to be tolerant but the more I see and hear of these scummy bast*** the more I realize they are evil clear through.
Oh this guy needs a beating, one so bad, so brutal, and so painful that even his spawn are born obedient.
So is Islam therefore a major World Religion, or a bizarre Misogynist Misanthropic Doomsday Death Cult?
I hope it is the former, but fear it is the latter...
Do you have any idea how far from reality your statement is?
MSK = Mohammed SK
MAK = Mohammed AK
MMK = Mohammed MK
MRK = Mohammed RK
No - The four witnesses are required to prove adultery, not rape.
As for religion, as I posted before, there are over a billion Muslims in the world. There are many Muslim countries which are peaceful and even promote women's rights.
And as for standing and watching during a gang rape, that happens pretty much everywhere. It's not restricted to Pakistanis. It is common throughout the world. Including in the US. It has nothing to do with Islam and more to do with attitudes toward women.
That is the law on the books in Pakistan, and where a rapist is found guilty, it is carried out.
In the Western world, rapists get anywhere from 2 years to life sentences for rape. Do you know how many of those rapists actually serve full sentences? Less than 1 in 10.
I suspect in the Western countries, more rapists will serve sentences because of DNA evidence. But what will remain an issue is consent.
I never stated that women are not punished for adultery in Islam. Nor have I ever stated that in Pakistan, women have rights equal to those of men.
But the gross Islamophobic generalizations in this thread need to be refuted.
This crime had nothing to do with Pakistani "culture". It had to do with thugs who were caught, and then tried to justify their crimes. Just as every criminal does.
Rape Only Prostitutes ?
Or perhaps it means:
Rape Our People
"It has nothing to do with Islam and more to do with attitudes toward women."
Bull. Islam is a religious codification of misogyny and exhorts its members to subjugate women. And rape victims in muslim countries don't get justice. They get murdered by their nearest and dearest for 'dishonoring' the family. Wake up.
Battered Westerner Syndrome inflicted by myopic Muslim defenders
Last Thursday, in Sydney, the pack leader of a group of Lebanese Muslim gang-rapists was sentenced to 55 years in jail. I suppose I ought to say "Lebanese-Australian" Muslim gang-rapists, since the accused were Australian citizens. But, identity-wise, the rambunctious young lads considered themselves heavy on the Lebanese, light on the Australian. During their gang rapes, the lucky lady would be told she was about to be "f---ed Leb style" and that she deserved it because she was an "Australian pig."
But, inevitably, it's the heavy sentence that's "controversial." After September 11th, Americans were advised to ask themselves, "Why do they hate us?" Now Australians need to ask themselves, "Why do they rape us?" As Monroe Reimers put it on the letters page of The Sydney Morning Herald:
"As terrible as the crime was, we must not confuse justice with revenge. We need answers. Where has this hatred come from? How have we contributed to it? Perhaps it's time to take a good hard look at the racism by exclusion practiced with such a vengeance by our community and cultural institutions."
Indeed. Many's the time, laboring under the burden of some or other ghastly Ottawa policy, I've thought of pinning some gal down and sodomizing her while 14 of my pals look on and await their turn. But I fear in my case the Monroe Reimers of the world would be rather less eager to search for "root causes." Gang rape as a legitimate expression of the campaign for social justice is a privilege reserved only unto a few.
Mr. Reimers, though, will be happy to know his view is echoed across the hemispheres. Five days before 9/11, the Norwegian newspaper Dagbladet reported that 65% of the country's rapes were committed by "non-Western" immigrants -- a category which, in Norway, is almost wholly Muslim. A professor at the University of Oslo explained that one reason for the disproportionate Muslim share of the rape market was that in their native lands "rape is scarcely punished" because it is generally believed that "it is women who are responsible for rape."
So Muslim immigrants to Norway should be made aware that things are a little different in Scandinavia? Not at all! Rather, the professor insisted, "Norwegian women must take their share of responsibility for these rapes" because their manner of dress would be regarded by Muslim men as inappropriate. "Norwegian women must realize that we live in a multicultural society and adapt themselves to it." Or to modify Queen Victoria's wedding-night advice to her daughter: Lie back and think of Yemen.
France? Well, I can't bring you any ethnic rape statistics from the Fifth Republic because the authorities go to great lengths not to keep any. But, even though the phenomenon of immigrant gang rape does not exist, there's already a word for it: the "tournante" -- or "take your turn." Last year, 11 Muslim men were arrested for enjoying a grand old tournante with a 14-year old girl in a cellar.
Denmark? "Three quarters of rapes are carried out by non-Danes," says Peter Skaarup, chairman of the People's Party, a member of the governing coalition.
Well, you get the idea. Whether or not Muslim cultures are more prone to rape is a question we shall explore another day. What's interesting is how easily even this most extreme manifestation of multiculturalism is subsumed within the usual pieties. Norwegian women must learn to be, in a very real sense, less "exclusionary." Lebanese male immigrants, fleeing a war-torn wasteland and finding refuge in a land of peace, freedom and opportunity, are inevitably transformed into gang rapists by Australian racism.
After September 11th, a friend in London said to me she couldn't stand all the America-needs-to-ask-itself stuff because she used to work at a rape crisis centre and she'd heard this blame-the-victim routine a thousand times before. America was asking for it: like those Norwegian women, it was being "provocative." My friend thought the multiculti apologists were treating America as a metaphorical rape victim. But, even so, it comes as a surprise to realize they do exactly the same to actual rape victims. After the O.J. verdict, it was noted by some feminists that "race trumped gender." What we've seen since September 11th is that multiculturalism trumps everything. Its grip on the imagination of the Western elites is unshakeable. Even President Bush, in the month after September 11th, felt obliged to line up a series of photo-ops so he could declare that "Islam is peace" while surrounded by representatives of the Council on American-Islamic Relations, an organization which objected, on the grounds of "ethnic and religious stereotyping," to the prosecution of two men in Chicago for the "honour killing" of their female cousin.
On this "Islam is peace" business, Bassam Tibi, a Muslim professor at Goettingen University in Germany, gave a helpful speech a few months back: "Both sides should acknowledge candidly that although they might use identical terms these mean different things to each of them," he said. "The word 'peace,' for example, implies to a Muslim the extension of the Dar al-Islam -- or 'House of Islam' -- to the entire world. This is completely different from the Enlightenment concept of eternal peace that dominates Western thought." Only when the entire world is a Dar al-Islam will it be a Dar a-Salam, or "House of Peace."
On the face of it, that sounds ridiculous. The "Muslim world" -- the arc stretching from North Africa through South Asia -- is economically, militarily, scientifically and artistically irrelevant. But, looked at through the prism of Norwegian rape or French crime, the idea of a Dar al-Islam doesn't sound so ridiculous. The "code of silence" that surrounds rape in tightly knit Muslim families is, so to speak, amplified by the broader "code of silence" surrounding multicultural issues in the West. If all cultures are of equal value, how do you point out any defects?
As I understand it, the benefits of multiculturalism are that the sterile white-bread cultures of Australia, Canada and Britain get some great ethnic restaurants and a Commonwealth Games opening ceremony that lasts until two in the morning. But, in the case of those Muslim ghettoes in Sydney, in Oslo, in Paris, in Copenhagen and in Manchester, multiculturalism means that the worst attributes of Muslim culture -- the subjugation of women -- combine with the worst attributes of Western culture -- licence and self-gratification. Tattoed, pierced Pakistani skinhead gangs swaggering down the streets of Northern England are as much a product of multiculturalism as the turban-wearing Sikh Mountie in the vice-regal escort at Rideau Hall. Yet even in the face of the crudest assaults on its most cherished causes -- women's rights, gay rights -- the political class turns squeamishly away.
Once upon a time we knew what to do. A British district officer, coming upon a scene of suttee, was told by the locals that in Hindu culture it was the custom to cremate a widow on her husband's funeral pyre. He replied that in British culture it was the custom to hang chaps who did that sort of thing. There are many great things about India -- curry, pyjamas, sitars, software engineers -- but suttee was not one of them. What a pity we're no longer capable of being "judgmental" and "discriminating." We're told the old-school imperialists were racists, that they thought of the wogs as inferior. But, if so, they at least considered them capable of improvement. The multiculturalists are just as racist. The only difference is that they think the wogs can never reform: Good heavens, you can't expect a Muslim in Norway not to go about raping the womenfolk! Much better just to get used to it.
As one is always obliged to explain when tiptoeing around this territory, I'm not a racist, only a culturist. I believe Western culture -- rule of law, universal suffrage, etc. -- is preferable to Arab culture: that's why there are millions of Muslims in Scandinavia, and four Scandinavians in Syria. Follow the traffic. I support immigration, but with assimilation. Without it, like a Hindu widow, we're slowly climbing on the funeral pyre of our lost empires. You see it in European foreign policy already: they're scared of their mysterious, swelling, unstoppable Muslim populations.
Islam For All reported the other day that, at present demographic rates, in 20 years' time the majority of Holland's children (the population under 18) will be Muslim. It will be the first Islamic country in western Europe since the loss of Spain. Europe is the colony now.
Or as Charles Johnson, whose excellent "Little Green Footballs" Web site turns up dozens of fascinating Islamic tidbits every day, suggested: "Maybe we should start a betting pool: Which European country will be the first to institute shari'a?"
What was the purpose of that post?
Criminals are criminals the world over. That is what this story is about. Islam, Pakistan, and Lebanon are irrelevant.
Incidentally, those guys wouldn't try that in Lebanon, where the males of the women raped would kill the girl who was raped to restore family "honour", then string up the rapists by their balls as punishment.
Is anyone here suggesting that rapists don't exist in non Muslim countries? That rapists in predominantly Christian countries the US have never attempted to portray the women they terrorize as unchaste sluts who "asked for it"? Why do you think rape shield laws were enacted (only after much lobbying by feminists, I should add)?
If Islam is a culture of misogyny, why have there been female leaders elected in predominantly Islamic countries?
Any country in which women do not assert and demand their rights is misogynistic.
Actually, it may be. Years ago, I knew a social worker who was working with a group of Albanian(Muslim) immigrants. Their rite of passage for boys was rape--if you rape a woman, you become a man.
Al -Nisa 4: 24 "And all married women (are forbidden unto you) save those (captives) whom your right hand possess. "
"..."cultural beliefs" and an undiagnosed mental disorder"
If he intended for this to be redundant -- as I read it -- then maybe they are beginning to see the light.
"But the gross Islamophobic generalizations in this thread need to be refuted."
Mohammed's High Regard For Women
M uch has been spoken about the inhuman treatment of women in Islam. If one wants to know the reason behind this, one has to closely examine Mohammed's personal life. As far as women are conecerned, they were just objects of sexual desire for Prophet Mohammed.
Here I expose the insatiable sexual appetite that Mohammed possessed. This goes to show that among others, one of the main reasons for forming this insidious religion, Islam, was so that sex was freely available to the male followers in the name of Allah. As I have already proved in my article, Wondrous Treatment of Women In Islam, the Quran justifies treating a woman as nothing but an object for sexual desire and sometimes even an ordinary object would be treated better. Suras in the Quran seem to pop up conveniently, so that Mohammed can justify his perverted sexual actions. For example, when Mohammed wanted his adopted son's wife, he suddenly got a revelation from Allah declaring it right to take another man's wife. When he wanted to stop his wives from quarreling or to accept more wives, he got a quick revelation for it. My above points are illustrated from the verses taken from Sura 33...read more...
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 - "When thou goest forth to war against thine enemies, and the LORD thy God hath delivered them into thine hands, and thou hast taken them captive, And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her, that thou wouldest have her to thy wife; Then thou shalt bring her home to thine house; and she shall shave her head, and pare her nails; And she shall put the raiment of her captivity from off her, and shall remain in thine house, and bewail her father and her mother a full month: and after that thou shalt go in unto her, and be her husband, and she shall be thy wife. And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not make merchandise of her, because thou hast humbled her."
Deuteronomy 20:14 - "But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself"
Leviticus 19:20-22 - "And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all redeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged; they shall not be put to death, because she was not free. And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the LORD, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, even a ram for a trespass offering. And the priest shall make an atonement for him with the ram of the trespass offering before the LORD for his sin which he hath done: and the sin which he hath done shall be forgiven him."
Several of the women Mohammed married were widows who were much older than him. His marriages were to provide for them.
But, if that's the tact you wish to take, what's your view on Solomon?
The following is the story of Safiyah Bint Huyeiy Ibn Akhtab, the Jewish woman who was captured when Muhammads troops attacked Kheibar and brought her to the Prophet as part of his share of the booty. This story, is reported in the Book of Tabaqat and is published also in the trusted Islamic site. http://www.muslimunited.org/topics/prophet/wives.html Safiyah was seventeen and very beautiful when Muslims killed her father, husband and many of her relatives. In the same day the Prophet of Allah wanted to sleep with her. Here is the exact text of the story.Safiyah was born in Medinah. She belonged to the Jewish tribe of Banu 'I-Nadir. When this tribe was expelled from Medinah in the year 4 A.H, Huyaiy was one of those who settled in the fertile colony of Khaibar together with Kinana ibn al-Rabi' to whom Safiyah was married a little before the Muslims attacked Khaibar. She was then seventeen. She had formerly been the wife of Sallam ibn Mishkam, who divorced her. One mile from Khaibar. Here the Prophet married Safiyah. She was groomed and made-up for the Prophet by Umm Sulaim, the mother of Anas ibn Malik. They spent the night there. Abu Ayyub al-Ansari guarded the tent of the Prophet the whole night. When, in the early dawn, the Prophet saw Abu Ayyub strolling up and down, he asked him what he meant by this sentry-go; he replied: "I was afraid for you with this young lady. You had killed her father, her husband and many of her relatives, and till recently she was an unbeliever. I was really afraid for you on her account". The Prophet prayed for Abu Ayyub al-Ansari (Ibn Hisham, p. 766) Safiyah had requested the Prophet to wait till he had gone a stage away from Khaibar. "Why?" asked the Prophet. "I was afraid for you on account of the Jews who still happened to be near at Khaibar!"The reason Safiyah rejected the sexual advances of the 57-year-old Muhammad should be obvious to any objective person. I believe most women prefer to mourn than jump into bed with the killer of their father, husband and many relatives on the same day of their death. But the fact that the prophet of Allah could not contain his sexual urges for one day to let this young girl grieve, says a lot of his thinking and moral character.
Then there's all those women he took as slaves and gave out to his men as booty... some example for muslims to emulate!