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BREAKTHROUGH OF THE YEAR: Evolution in Action
Science ^ | December 2005 | Elizabeth Culotta and Elizabeth Pennisi

Posted on 01/03/2006 12:16:26 PM PST by MRMEAN

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To: CarolinaGuitarman

Yes of course.


121 posted on 01/03/2006 3:03:32 PM PST by zeeba neighba (I have my Christmas Newfie . He's eating my foot as I type)
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To: ThomasNast

Do you have an actual argument, or just non-sequiturs and inane analogies?


122 posted on 01/03/2006 3:03:46 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: highball; Coyoteman; Dimensio
the·o·ry Audio pronunciation of "theory" ( P )
Pronunciation Key (th-r, thîr)
n. pl. the·o·ries

1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.

Ok what do we have here a set a statements... just because someone with a degree says something its true? Do you believe Ward Churchill?

Widely accepted? It is widely accepted by liberals that that George W. Bush lied about WMD's is that statement true?

You know what Yogi Berra says about predictions...
It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future

123 posted on 01/03/2006 3:03:50 PM PST by Echo Talon
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To: darbymcgill
But it seems to me that the achievement of symmetry via random mutation would be significantly more complex.

Symmetry itself is not that remarkable no matter how it is generated -- nature is full of it. All that would be required is for a symmetry generating mutation to confer advantages on the host such that the symmetry would be conserved. In some cases, evolution actually breaks natural symmetry (e.g. flatfish eyes) when it has survival advantages.

124 posted on 01/03/2006 3:04:45 PM PST by tortoise (All these moments lost in time, like tears in the rain.)
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To: zeeba neighba

"Yes of course."

What is it? Don't forget all the plants that would die from the flooding, or the ants that would drown, and so on.


125 posted on 01/03/2006 3:04:57 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: Dimensio; 101st-Eagle
And there is another set of people who regard it as "an irrefutable fact, never to be challenged because science says so."

Perhaps a quote from one of these people to illustrate your point?

I'd like to see one of those quotes as well.

It's one of the charges frequently tossed out by creationists, but they rarely follow up with anything resembling evidence.

126 posted on 01/03/2006 3:05:00 PM PST by highball ("I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Shalom Israel
how do we know that ERVs are in fact artifacts of retro-viruses, rather than an endogenous structure with some resemblances to a virus?

Unfortunately I'm not a geneticist either, I only play one on FR. I would assume that it's the pattern found that would indicate these ERV sections. There are something like 2000 of them found so far.

You make a good point about the "mistake" in math tests. Another interesting mistake is the primate "Vitamin C" gene, that is broken in several primate species and humans in exactly the same manner. It fits with evolution theory that a primate living in a forest rich in fruit could lose the ability to produce vitamin C via harmful mutation and never be affected. Had the creature lived in another environment with no vitamin C in his diet, he would have died, and the mutation would have died with it.

It fits that science has also discovered that non-functioning parts of genomes accumulate random mutations at a steady rate, while functioning genes are identical across species and over time. That's because harmful mutations are not propagated, while mutations in "dead code" are. This demonstrates that natural selection is necessary for the continued existence of life. Without it, even a "designed" species would eventually die out because of harmful mutations.

Counting the random mutations in the dead code is another method of determining the time since two species split. The more mutations, the more time. And science has found that these clocks fit well with existing morphological estimates for species split.

The news hasn't yet sunk in to the general population, but I'd bet that with the recent microbiological information tracking DNA changes between species has added more confirmation to Evolution theory in the last year or two than has been accumulated since Darwin.

127 posted on 01/03/2006 3:05:17 PM PST by narby (Hillary! The Wicked Witch of the Left)
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To: Echo Talon

" You know what Yogi Berra says about predictions...
It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future."

Yogi new that it was a joke. Do you?


128 posted on 01/03/2006 3:06:20 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: Shalom Israel

Your question is actually very insightful and interesting. There is a great "smear" of things that are probably closely related including ERVs, Insertional Sequences, Transposons, Integrons. Then there is replicative transposition, which gets closer, lysogenic viruses and lytic viruses.

And then Phase variation. There's a lot of new stuff in these areas and the picture is becoming clearer. There are even transposable viruses. Just about every combination of viral, protoviral, degenerate viral, etc. cn be found somewhere.


129 posted on 01/03/2006 3:07:22 PM PST by furball4paws (The new elixir of life - dehydrated toad urine.)
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To: Dimensio

I think the illustration speaks for itself. What part of the illustration is difficult to understand? The argument that you ask for is simple. Random events are not like those of intelligent design. Pounding on the keyboard at random (for some reason) is not the same as intelligently producing a real report.

(And this needed to be explained)...


130 posted on 01/03/2006 3:07:29 PM PST by ThomasNast (2350)
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To: ThomasNast
v,eo-0awer]kpqw4'mlsdgmo'slp[ awt4];awf'srthsesethapaf].;sergr[pgpapkoawfpkq ,wp[.,caoqer

Ironically, that contains more true information than your prior posts.

131 posted on 01/03/2006 3:07:36 PM PST by tortoise (All these moments lost in time, like tears in the rain.)
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To: ThomasNast

Natural selection isn't random.


132 posted on 01/03/2006 3:08:53 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: thomaswest

How long have you been stuck on stupid?


133 posted on 01/03/2006 3:09:13 PM PST by shuckmaster (An oak tree is an acorns way of making more acorns)
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To: CarolinaGuitarman
I don't trust people that make predictions...
Assumption is the mother of all ****UPS
134 posted on 01/03/2006 3:09:41 PM PST by Echo Talon
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To: Echo Talon

"I don't trust people that make predictions..."

Testable predictions are the bedrock of science.


135 posted on 01/03/2006 3:10:20 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: tortoise

And what information did you draw from it?


136 posted on 01/03/2006 3:10:37 PM PST by ThomasNast (2350)
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To: thomaswest
Nevermind, I realize you were just being funny! I apologize!
137 posted on 01/03/2006 3:10:41 PM PST by shuckmaster (An oak tree is an acorns way of making more acorns)
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To: CarolinaGuitarman
Testable predictions are the bedrock of science.

Soon as they can timelapse the creation of life from nothing, into a viable living creature I will stick with my beliefs.

138 posted on 01/03/2006 3:13:33 PM PST by Echo Talon
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To: Echo Talon
Soon as they can timelapse the creation of life from nothing, into a viable living creature I will stick with my beliefs.

I think you really ought to read a book - the Theory of Evolution has no more to do with the "creation of life" than Gravitational Theory has to do with the creation of matter.

139 posted on 01/03/2006 3:14:56 PM PST by highball ("I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson)
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To: MineralMan
I had a friend in high school who was born with 6 fingers on one hand. The sixth finger was removed when he was an infant.

I had a similar friend with a sixth finger removed from each hand. I told him he should search the world and marry a six fingered girl and he didn't think that was funny one bit.

140 posted on 01/03/2006 3:15:17 PM PST by shuckmaster (An oak tree is an acorns way of making more acorns)
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