North American Cooperative Security Act

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d109:s.00853 ^

[savedbygrace]

North American Cooperative Security Act, H.R.2672 and S. 853, seems to be a grand move toward effectively removing our borders with Canada and Mexico. It also forms security teams containing officers from both U. S. and Mexico, together.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d109:s.00853:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d109:HR02672:

Comments?

[mthom]

You could of course click on the links and read it for yourself. The reaction here comes in part because this bill reads like the CFR document calling for a North American Union. Almost exactly like it external tariff and expedited border language included. The only difference being that the CFR plan explicitly calls for a totally free flow of labor across our borders.

[Magnum44]

Thank you. As I read it, I see nothing in it that says open flow between the US and mexico. I see a lot of programs I am not familiar with (FAST, NEXUS, etc) that appear to be security programs being implemented, programs that again appear to be an attempt to bring border security and commerce control into the computer age. I dont see the problem with the bill.

[Magnum44]

I just browsed it, and I dont see anything jumping out at me that looks like a North American Union. I see the bill saying its smart to get different agencies from neighboring countries cooperating in looking out for our interests, both in the form of immigrant identification, and tracking and security of commerce. And I tend to agree.

[mthom]

Like I said. This bill does not contain that language. It does however read like the CFR document calling which calls for a common security perimeter, expedited border travel (trusted travelers), and external tariff. The DIFERENCE between the two being that the CFR calls for complete portability of labor. NAFTA, this bill, a large near future "guest worker" program, I dont understand why you people cant even accept that reasonable people could see a movement towards an EU style North America. A union that followed the exact same route we seem to be on now.

[DoNotDivide]

No thanks. I've had enough North American Union cr@pola.

In fact, it's time to start rolling back the CAFTA, NAFTA, FTAA and other such non-sense.

[DoNotDivide]

Well, you know that Jeb Bush has designs for FTAA-Miami HQ.

[DoNotDivide]

The sad truth is that all who say they are Conservatives, Constitutionists and Patriotic Americans - aren't. And I know I'm not alone in having been fooled to vote for them on not just one occasion. The New World Order is for the elites. Only, America as we know it doesn't exist in that order. Nor people like you or me.

[DoNotDivide]

In elementary school, it would be an excercise in connecting the decades long trail of dots along with all other relevant information. Here, the dots have amnesties, open borders, social programs, a blind eye to existing law, extra-Constitutional agreements like NAFTA, GATT, CAFTA, FTAA, etc. Afilliations of sponsors with organizations like the Council on Foreign Relations and their North American Community designs, leaders from Canada, Mexico and America meeting in TX, etc.

In another set of terms, you could say that being fed an elephant all at one sitting is too much to digest, but being fed an elephant a bite or two at a time is a better formula.

My grandfather told me the best way to cook a frog is not to throw it straight into boiling water, for it will resist, but rather to set it in a kettle of room temperature water on the stove and slowly turn the heat up until the frog is cooked.

[hedgetrimmer]

first Mexican customs facility in the United States

U.S., Mexico negotiating to set up customs port in Kansas City

Going for broke (smartports and mexican sovereign territory in the US interior)

SmartPort is identifying locations in the area for establishing a facility that would be designated as sovereign Mexican territory. Southbound freight would enter the facility, be inspected and cleared. All necessary processing that would normally be performed at the border would be handled in the center. Once freight is cleared and ready to go, the container — whether truck trailer or railcar — would be sealed.

On reaching the border, the only inspections needed would be to make sure it's still the same trailer and that it's still sealed with an electronic seal when it crosses the border. There are no more inspections or handling by Mexican Customs after that.

[Magnum44]

I dont understand why you people cant even accept that reasonable people could see a movement towards an EU style North America

I am discussing this on the merits of its place in national security in the face of the war on terror. Sounds like you are discussing a separate issue.

[Magnum44]

I dont want to assume your point and start an uneccesary argument, so please tell me your point. It looks to me as though you underlined "soverign mexican territory" to object to a program that gets US goods through mexican customs both safer and faster than it is done today. So your point is?

[DoNotDivide]

Do you believe America would be safer if we integrated Mexico and Canada inside a common perimeter that America jointly operated with Mexico and Canada?

[Magnum44]

If your applying your grandfathers analogy here, the fact that anyone even bothered to put this bill together would argue against it. We would not need this bill to have the porous border security we have today.

[DoughtyOne]

Tell you what bud. You sucker for this punch. I'm not going to. I do not want to be tied intimately to Mexico in any way shape or form. The Mexican government is as corrupt a government as there is. The Mexican police system is corrupt. The military is corrupt.

We've seen how our own leadership has become corrupted in realation to our border sanctity. Now you want to see our military and police agencies infiltrated by their Mexican counterparts.

Not just no, hell no!

[hedgetrimmer]

FYI

Governments of the hemisphere should work standardizing impact assessment and other sustainable development methodologies, including those for collection of data, joint training of border officials, and other efforts. These tools could also be used to monitor trade-induced or trade-related impacts on the environment. Based on results, cooperation should be developed in managing transportation corridors , including impact monitoring and designing mitigation tools and policies.

The FTAA and Hemispheric Integration
Building a Triple-Win Strategy for Trade
and Sustainability in the Hemisphere

[Magnum44]

I believe in layered defense. That does not mean elimination of the border layer, which I wish we would do more about. But I wont object to a layer beyond that border, which recognizes that what comes through our borders also passes the border check points of peripheral nations.

[Magnum44]

Now you want to see our military and police agencies infiltrated by their Mexican counterparts.

please, where did I say that?

[DoughtyOne]

Okay, then what's your logical conclusion to what is taking place? Our border patrol is being fired on from Mexico. Is that who you want our agencies to deal with? I don't.

[Magnum44]

Your addressing a different issue than what the bill addresses. Your issue is valid, but I dont think it diminishes the value or intent of this bill.

[DoughtyOne]

Please take note of the problem we have with our border now. Mexico not only will not cooperate to lessen the problems of illegal immigration, they have prepared materials for those intent on crossing our borders. If this wasn't bad enough, the Mexican government has shown it's willingness to escalate the issue to a full blown international incident if we try to get our borders under control.

Okay. What makes you think it will be different with our "combined security"? Mexico will do what it wants to do. If we want to play, we'll have to compromise. Is compromise something you want to contemplate when it comes to terrorism?

Once we have a combined security agreement, both Mexico and the US will be determining security policy. The supervisors of the people who are shooting at our border patrol agents, and not stoping them, will be those sitting down to make border policy with our leaders. Fifty percent of those who don't even live in the US will be involved in making decisions that affect us directly.

This is a plan that has disaster written all over it.