Drone aircraft may prowl U.S. skies

CNET News.com ^ | March 29, 2006 | Declan McCullagh

[af_vet_rr]

Unmanned aerial vehicles have soared the skies of Afghanistan and Iraq for years, spotting enemy encampments, protecting military bases, and even launching missile attacks against suspected terrorists.

Now UAVs may be landing in the United States.

A House of Representatives panel on Wednesday heard testimony from police agencies that envision using UAVs for everything from border security to domestic surveillance high above American cities. Private companies also hope to use UAVs for tasks such as aerial photography and pipeline monitoring.

"We need additional technology to supplement manned aircraft surveillance and current ground assets to ensure more effective monitoring of United States territory," Michael Kostelnik, assistant commissioner at Homeland Security's Customs and Border Protection Bureau, told the House Transportation subcommittee.

Kostelnik was talking about patrolling U.S. borders and ports from altitudes around 12,000 feet, an automated operation that's currently underway in Arizona. But that's only the beginning of the potential of surveillance from the sky.

In a scene that could have been inspired by the movie "Minority Report," one North Carolina county is using a UAV equipped with low-light and infrared cameras to keep watch on its citizens. The aircraft has been dispatched to monitor gatherings of motorcycle riders at the Gaston County fairgrounds from just a few hundred feet in the air--close enough to identify faces--and many more uses, such as the aerial detection of marijuana fields, are planned.

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"It is quite easy to envision a future in which (UAVs), unaffected by pilot fatigue, provide 24-7 border and port surveillance to protect against terrorist intrusion," said Mike Heintz on behalf of the UNITE Alliance which represents Boeing, Lockheed Martin and Northrop Grumman. "Other examples are limited only by our imagination."

[af_vet_rr]

Considering how many law enforcement agencies are in love with acting the part of the military, don't be surprised to see more and more cities aquire these things.

[Sax]

2009: Highway Patrol Predator Drone Issues Thousands of Speeding Tickets Annually.

[stuartcr]

You will be protected, and you will appreciate it.

[GrandEagle]

Were from the government and were here to help you....

[SR 50]

A whole new arena of "spying on your neighbor".

[Sax]

The urge to save humanity is nearly always a cover for the urge to rule. - H.L. Mencken

[Sax]

Ooh, wait! Yet another chance to trot out this old line: "If you're not doing anything wrong, then you don't have anything to worry about."

Ah, there, it's been said.

[stuartcr]

This country just keeps getting scarier and scarier...I'm glad I'm not 40yr younger.

[af_vet_rr]

I'm sure that if you happened to have a target range setup where you liked to exercise your Second Amendment rights, that would get you a little note in a file somewhere.

[RayChuang88]

I've heard that the US Border Patrol wants to buy a fleet of Predator drones (without the armed capability, of course!) to monitor the entire US-Mexican border. At the cruising altitude of 10,000 feet those things are pretty quiet and very difficult to see.

[rattrap]

So who's going to patent the first DIY Surface to Air Missile kit?

[TrollBridge]

Careful with that ax, Eugene...

[pabianice]

US Goal to have 1/3 of military aircraft unmanned by 2011

[Savage Beast]

Some states are already monitoring the citizenry via air surveillance, to assure such things as compliance with environmental regulations and detection of marijuana farming.

This may seem innocent enough; however, when you think of the bullying and abuse inflicted upon average, law abiding citizens by draconian "environmental protection" laws and the bullies and morons who direct and enforce them, it becomes frightening and antithetical to freedom, the pursuit of happiness, and everything the United States stands for, and it renders the American people highly vulnerable to oppression, injustice, and abuse.

[gbaker]

I have no doubt the border patrol will buy them, but an issue will be discovered which prevents their use on the Mexican - US border.

[stuartcr]

They'll just keep repeating...'remember 9/11'...

[af_vet_rr]

Border patrol is a great use. Just flying around watching the citizens and making them feel like subjects...used to be you were innocent until proven guilty, now I guess we can all eventually become suspects.

[af_vet_rr]

Careful with that ax, Eugene...

I wasn't talking about shooting them down, I was talking about certain places that would love to know if their citizens are armed or not (Maryland, Chicago, California, etc.), and having the ability to cover large areas and see what people are doing outdoors would give them that ability.

[Savage Beast]

"Any excuse will serve a tyrant."
~Aesop~

[HarleyLady27]

Bill (clinton) and Barbra (baby babs) had better be carefull now....with that thing soaring above us, no telling what it will see......hahahahahaha

[Mike Darancette]

Wednesday heard testimony from police agencies that envision using UAVs for everything from border security to domestic surveillance high above American cities.

What will happen when the first couple of civilian aircraft are downed by these things?

[Boundless]

Has the FAA even issued domestic cert and ops rules for
large remote control or autonomous aircraft?

At what point does an R/C toy become something that
requires certification?

[stuartcr]

And don't forget the innocent NSA phone monitoring...

[Mike Darancette]

This country just keeps getting scarier and scarier...I'm glad I'm not 40yr younger.

The have the technology to survail the people now, the only difference is that it requires a human now.

[stuartcr]

I know, I can't imagine what it will be like in 50yrs.

[absolootezer0]

So who's going to patent the first DIY Surface to Air Missile kit?

who needs one? those nasty, horrible, evil, wicked, .50BMGs can very easily shoot down an aircraft doncha know? /sarc

[Oztrich Boy]

Great. They can't give me my flying car, but they have produced the Watchbird

[stuartcr]

You'll probably only get one shot before they lock onto your posit. Better not do it from your back porch.

[ottersnot]

A thread like this just screams "tin-foil hat"

I think its a good thing. The predator program has reportedly been very successful.

[samcgwire]

Big Brother be a drone. Watch for more and more Big Brother stuff in America as turns to the North American Union, more interested in monitoring people than stopping them from illegally get here to begin with.

[WestCoastGal]

Let's not forget these............

Ottawa man tried to arm model plane with bomb, court told Brother had a role in plot directed by senior al-Qaeda figure, informant testifies

[ottersnot]

If you against monitoring Terrorist communications then just say so.

[VRing]

"You'll probably only get one shot before they lock onto your posit"

Fine. Makes things easier.

[ottersnot]

I might add that they are already flying planes and have 'blimps' tethered along the border with cameras.

I think it's only fair to keep in mind the resolution of these cameras. We honestly don't know. Will they be able to read a license plate? Will they be able to discern a firearm from 10,000 feet?.

I don't know the answer to this question.

[stuartcr]

I am against monitoring US citizens communications in the hopes of possibly stumbling into a random terrorist communique.

[DannyTN]

I like the idea of using drones for the Border.

I'm less inclined to like them for domestic spying though. Tracking of suspected terrorists domestically would be ok. But speeding tickets should be off limits to drones.

Actually I think we should automate driving. It would eliminate the non-productive speeding ticket industry, wrecks, injuries, autobody repair, a multitude of lawyers. It would free elderly and youth to travel. Computerized systems would make travel more efficient, eliminate road blocks, etc.

[GrandEagle]

I am against monitoring US citizens communications in the hopes of possibly stumbling into a random terrorist communique.
But, it's for your own safety. Think of the children (/sarcasm)

[af_vet_rr]

All of these types of threads, this one, the ones about more and more cameras watching you everywhere, etc., they all scream tin foil.

The problem is, we are talking about reality. This isn't some kind of theoretical discussion.

Where do you say "okay, we are no longer talking about pie-in-the-sky tinfoil stuff, we are talking about me and my family minding our own business on our own property getting checked out by the local government, perhaps without even our knowledge, and certainly without a warrant, simply because they can"?

We shouldn't start acting like the countries that we just recently spent so many decades guarding against.

[Ancesthntr]

I'm sure that if you happened to have a target range setup where you liked to exercise your Second Amendment rights, that would get you a little note in a file somewhere.

I'll have to invest in a hat that gives the Predator the finger.

[JFC]

Every night/morning around 2:00 a.m. this week, I have heard many flyovers from a nearby air foce base 100 miles away. They practice all the time during the day, but these night flyovers have gone on for a couple hours each.

[Ancesthntr]

Stories like this just can't put the black helicopter people at ease.

[AFreeBird]

The infrastructure costs for automated highways would be enormous. What taxes do you want raised to fund it?

Then there's the vehicle costs. And I don't think it would be economically feasable to retrofit existing cars for it either. Don't get me wrong, its actually not a bad idea, but I don't see it coming to fruition in less than 50 years.

But hey, anything is possible if you have enough money to throw at the problem.

[LambSlave]

I know, I can't imagine what it will be like in 50yrs.

I can... just watch "Terminator"... What year is it that SkyNet becomes sentient?

[stuartcr]

We're doomed...well you maybe, I'll probably be dead by then.

[LambSlave]

I don't think it will take 50 years.

[af_vet_rr]

Stories like this just can't put the black helicopter people at ease.

The ironic thing - most of this stuff, the various forms of surveillance such as the cameras, UAVs (like the ones deployed in North Carolina - I used to think NC was fairly Conservative), it's all being done out in the open. Either it's arrogance on the part of the cities and law enforcement agencies, or they think that as long as they don't try to hide it, they can do whatever they want.