"They have no understanding of freedom, so they see no difference between a wall of protection and a wall meant to enslave or hold a population captive."
I see, the way to keep people free is to place a wall around them, much the same way the feudal barons did, and to make sure no one gets in to steal, rob or plunder from their castle? I do see your point. I now realize that for me to be free, I must erect a wall to keep out those who are not free. This will in deed protect my freedoms.
Free people, in order to keep their freedom, must not allow themselves to become polluted by those they do not want in. This pollution will ruin the pure things I have learned to treasure and keep me free.
Baloney!! IMHO, if I were really free, my fear of pollution would not exist. I would welcome those who may pollute, because they can not harm me.
My friend, it is our fear that you mistake for freedom. We don't need to imprison ourselves within a wall to be free. Yes we can come in or go out of our castle, but someday we must face those who do not dwell within. If we can not, then we are truly not free, but in a prison worse than you and I can ever imagine.
I guess you feel like you’ve been dog-piled here. Just understand that if you’ve just signed up, and immediately take the opposite side of a heated topic of debate, you’re going to look like a troll. That will attract some “ad-hominem” attacks. Mostly, you will find freepers willing to honestly debate and hash out a topic.
Plus, you’ve made a few ugly assumptions yourself:
#278 “If I suggest shooting them on sight, will that get me a better tag here?” #278 “I have a different opinion of their worth” #278 “Guess that makes me a liberal cause I have compassion for them” #273 “…must not allow themselves to become polluted by those they do not want in.
Just because we believe that a border fence is part of the solution, doesn’t mean we aren’t compassionate, or think that immigrants are worthless human beings, or want to start shooting innocent people, or think that a lesser race is “polluting” our “pure” American society.
We get that smear all the time from liberals and DU’ers, and nothing could be further from the truth.
I was addressing the assumption by liberals and ILLEGAL immigration proponents that a border fence or wall is the equivalent to the Berlin wall and that all walls are automatically eeeeeevil. This point often comes from those so blinded by an overall “America is the problem, blame America first” attitude that they can’t see the difference between a wall built by Communists and a border fence built by freedom loving Americans.
I don’t think you are a liberal or pro-ILLEGAL immigration, and my comment was not directed to those who simply believe that a border fence is not the answer to the problem. You’ve stated your opinion as:
#233 IMHO, I am a bit concerned about the construction of the U.S. wall resulting in misuse or presenting a bad image for the U.S. We have long been known for freedom and erecting walls does not have a freedom tag associated with it. #278 National security is truly needed, but a wall isn't the answer.
Sounds like you saw first hand the ugliness of the Berlin wall and you don’t want the U.S. to be associated with that in any way. I tend to agree. Walls are ugly and it’s a shame we even have to talk about a fence as an option for securing the border.
But a border fence is needed and the countries that will accuse us a building “Berlin Wall II” are the same countries that hate us already. A similar argument was made to oppose the Iraq war. We can’t determine our policy based on what other countries will think of us.
You seem to be defending the idea that a border fence and the Berlin wall are equivalent, just to bolster your opinion that a border wall isn’t the answer.
#267 Come on my friend, do you really think people weren't kept out by the Berlin Wall as well. Oh... oops I forgot... the reds didn't mind anyone coming into East Germany... just so long as they didn't take anyone out...I guess when I was there in the 60s, my sight deceived me when I saw the border guards and their RIFLES TRAINED ON ME when I came to the wire...sure didn't look like they wanted me to come on in...:-)
#278 Russia's claim to fame during the Cold War was the same. For anyone who thinks they closed the borders to just keep people in, need to think why we couldn't just walk in and chat with our long lost relatives.
Of course that wall was meant to keep people from getting IN and OUT. It was meant to completely control and oppress a population. Sure they claimed it was for defense, but they are a bunch of lying communists, what else are they going to say…the truth? An American border fence would not be an equivalent just because it will prevent illegals from getting IN.
Are you contradicting your own comments? #233 “You are correct about the nature of the walls...There is a big difference in the purpose
[Sarcasm assumed] I see, the way to keep people free is to place a wall around them, much the same way the feudal barons did, and to make sure no one gets in to steal, rob or plunder from their castle? I do see your point. I now realize that for me to be free, I must erect a wall to keep out those who are not free. This will in deed protect my freedoms.
Fuedal barons did not erect a wall around the people to contain them, they erected a wall that the people could run to for protection from invaders and marauders. A gated community does not create a prison. Locks on my door does not create a prison cell.
[Dripping with Sarcasm] Free people, in order to keep their freedom, must not allow themselves to become polluted by those they do not want in. This pollution will ruin the pure things I have learned to treasure and keep me free.
OK…this kind of pissed me off. I’m not sure if you meant it this way, but this is how it sounds to me…”you want a fence because you can’t stand the idea of all these dirty Hispanics polluting our pure American society.” That’s pretty close to calling me a racist, friend.
I would like to expand and encourage LEGAL immigration of all races (properly monitored, controlled, and documented), and stop all ILLEGAL immigration. All humans are Gods children, but they’re not all Americans. It IS possible to kill the goose that laid the golden egg.
Baloney!! IMHO, if I were really free, my fear of pollution would not exist. I would welcome those who may pollute, because they can not harm me.
Uh…this sounds similar to sticking your head in the sand.
My friend, it is our fear that you mistake for freedom. We don't need to imprison ourselves within a wall to be free. Yes we can come in or go out of our castle, but someday we must face those who do not dwell within. If we can not, then we are truly not free, but in a prison worse than you and I can ever imagine.
A border fence would no more imprison us than locking our doors at night would imprison us in our homes. A border fence does not make us isolationists. Facing the outside world involves fixing the illegal immigration problem, not ignoring it.