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Ketamine and Depression
The American Spectator ^ | 8/15/2006 | Michael Fumento

Posted on 08/15/2006 9:48:26 AM PDT by neverdem

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To: Mr Ramsbotham

"I would comment, but what's the use?"

You may have clinical depression...hopelessness and lack of initiative are symptoms and with treatment you may feel a sense of belonging and usefulness in this forum.


81 posted on 08/15/2006 12:49:52 PM PDT by michgirl
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To: RedRightReturn
I missed most of first grade (6-7 years old) for chronic ear infections and tonsillitis. In fact, I still have predictable difficulty with my left ear (drain tube installed at same time as T&A)and I'll be 41 in a couple months. No vertigo though, not anything remarkable anyway. Tube was removed about 8 weeks post-op, so that's not there anymore either.

If there's a cause/effect with this, the impact could be staggering. Think of all those day-care kids that suffered ear infections, ultimately leading to tubes. It's almost a rite of passage (my own daughter included).

And finally for the record....slight GAD and OCD here!!!

With your medical history I seriously and highly recommend you reading Phobia Free by Harold Levinson MD. Don't let the name fool you. Many phobia's such as fear of heights to ones like me and you have scientific cause and as such are not phobia's but rather the brain saying hey you have poor balance stay off the ladder or step away from the edge please :>}

I'll show you something as a parent you might need to know. With these problems can come a very similar to ADD ADHD problem called Central Auditory Processing Disorders or C.A.P.D.

It involves hearing and sounds but not being able to process them in a timely manner.

The first one is a long read but a great article.

COGNITIVE ASPECTS OF VESTIBULAR DISORDERS

Click here to get to the link

Click here to get to the link

Click here to get to the link

Click here to get to the link

If you get to a point where noises and certain visual stimulation or situations start to bother you then this can be the cause. My onset felt like I was having a stroke. I had clues before it happened such as trying to sign my name and my hand not wanting to sign a paper. I could see the paper but not make my mind engage to do the task if that makes sense. The scariest was being on an interstate one day and my brain taking a leave of absence. I didn't know where I was or what I was doing, how long I'd been driving etc. This happened several times and except for the onset episode that lasted for a few days generally goes away in minutes.

82 posted on 08/15/2006 12:51:45 PM PDT by cva66snipe (If it was wrong for Clinton why do some support it for Bush? Party over nation destroys the nation.)
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To: RedRightReturn
This place has some valueable info also Vestibular Disorders Association
83 posted on 08/15/2006 12:55:07 PM PDT by cva66snipe (If it was wrong for Clinton why do some support it for Bush? Party over nation destroys the nation.)
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When I'm depressed, I sell apples...

84 posted on 08/15/2006 12:57:19 PM PDT by evets (08-22-06)
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To: neverdem

It's effects sound like the same achieved with moderate doses of cocaine, alcohol, heroin, quaaludes and Xanax.

No news here.


85 posted on 08/15/2006 12:58:34 PM PDT by 308MBR ( "She pulled up her petticoat, and I pulled out for Tulsa!" Abstinence training from Bob Wills.)
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To: Tokra
Not at all. In fact one of my problems is that I don't worry about things I really SHOULD be worrying about. Many people I know who take anti-depressants say that they no longer worry about things - they just don't care about things that used to drive them crazy. All the more reason for me not to take them. I don't worry enough now - God knows what shape I'd be in if I was worrying even LESS!

LOL for some antidepressants are a blessing. For ones like myself they would send me over the edge. I tried them. Paxil got me a Foley cathater and I was well on my way to Dysreflexia by the time I got to the Emergency room. Dysreflexia is basically shock but can be fatal. It's common to persons with spinal cord injury but can happen to anyone. Basically in this case the bladder said no go. The others made me so uneasy I couldn't stand it. Even Buspar made me sick at my stomach. That was a sign saying possible Serotonin migration in progress..

86 posted on 08/15/2006 1:08:51 PM PDT by cva66snipe (If it was wrong for Clinton why do some support it for Bush? Party over nation destroys the nation.)
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To: najida; hosepipe
Walking away from trying to fit into the perfect religious mold was the first step in fixing what was broken.

Makes good sense to me. Any such thing as a "perfect religious mold" sounds to me more like a human construct (or maybe even a satanic construct) rather than a divine one. Besides, I know (and know of) certain people who fit that description to a tee, and they're some of the worst, most uncharitable people I know (or know of -- President Amadinejad, please call your office.)

In any case, just because you revile "religion" does not mean that God reviles you, or that His concern for you would cease. I think it's best to keep an open mind and, above all, an open spirit.... I mean, God knows we humans are not just not perfect, but hopelessly recidivist sinners. That's why He sent His Son....

87 posted on 08/15/2006 1:12:35 PM PDT by betty boop (The universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose. -J.B.S. Haldane)
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To: cva66snipe
LOL for some antidepressants are a blessing. For ones like myself they would send me over the edge. I tried them.

I did take one anti-depressant pill a few weeks after my heart attack. I felt like I was at the bottom of a deep well - sounds were all echoing and if someone asked me a question it would take forever for me to process the question and answer them. It was an extremely uncomfortable feeling. My psychologist friend told me that the particular drug I took couldn't possibly have those effects. I told her that I did LSD a few times back in hippie days and this stuff was stronger than that! I told my doctor I'd rather feel depressed than feel like that again. I'm scared to try another one.

88 posted on 08/15/2006 1:19:58 PM PDT by Tokra (I think I'll retire to Bedlam.)
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To: Tokra
I did take one anti-depressant pill a few weeks after my heart attack. I felt like I was at the bottom of a deep well - sounds were all echoing and if someone asked me a question it would take forever for me to process the question and answer them. It was an extremely uncomfortable feeling. My psychologist friend told me that the particular drug I took couldn't possibly have those effects. I told her that I did LSD a few times back in hippie days and this stuff was stronger than that! I told my doctor I'd rather feel depressed than feel like that again. I'm scared to try another one.

A severe adverse antidepressant reaction is like taking LSD. Patients should be monitored closely. Here is something your friend didn't know. It's called Serotonin Syndrome and mention it even to many shrinks will draw a blank stare from them. Serotonin is a natural chemical used to promote digestion. 98% of which belongs in the stomach. If this balance is disrupted and it migrates to the brain it can cause a patient to trip.

Here's a clinical description Serotonin Syndrome I saw it happen to someone very near and dear to me. It happened due to a combination of Zoloft and Trazodone the first time and Trazodone only the second time. 2 shrinks, 2 ER doctors, and two house doctors missed it. The shrinks despite the onset of psychotic episodes INSISTED on raising the dosages without so much as blood work. Some of the more educated nurses in here may have seen it but can any nurse tell me if they have seen a psychotic patient loose consciousness from their disorder? To the point of a COMA? Antidepressants are a Godsend to many but in many cases as well doctors fail to first eliminate other causes where the patient may have this type of reaction to them.

Giving these type of meds to a kid with sensory damage could create a Columbine type situation. It can be that serious as their tripping during the time is very real to them. The person I know this happened to is a devout Christian and she was seeing Satan when it began. The doctors failed to diagnose it. Prayer was said. In desperation I also did a search engine looked up of Zoloft +Trazodone +adverse reactions and got some answers which even with it being the hospital college's professor they called it rubbish.

Me and that person have neurological issues related to the Inner Ear in common. I want to say this though. For ones who have taken antidepressants with good results don't go off of them. The danger in this is not knowing the danger exist and it isn't that common. It seems to be more prone to happen in persons for example with Vestibular Disorders who really didn't need the drug to begin with.

89 posted on 08/15/2006 1:46:12 PM PDT by cva66snipe (If it was wrong for Clinton why do some support it for Bush? Party over nation destroys the nation.)
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To: Gator113

You're more than welcome.


90 posted on 08/15/2006 1:50:36 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife ("Death is better, a milder fate than tyranny. "--Aeschylus)
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To: Tokra

One other good possibility. You could have left the hospital with a mild Inner Ear infection. But yes the drug could produce that reaction and likely some head aches and a burning stomach to go with it.


91 posted on 08/15/2006 1:51:06 PM PDT by cva66snipe (If it was wrong for Clinton why do some support it for Bush? Party over nation destroys the nation.)
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To: neverdem

ketamine was used in Vietnam-it's hardly new-it also can cause serious respiratory depression-and yes,it's a disassociative anesthetic,sort of like versed,which you've probably had if you underwent a colonoscopy-spaces you right out-i wouldn't celebrate this report too early


92 posted on 08/15/2006 2:48:21 PM PDT by steamroller
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To: najida; betty boop
Actually what would a real God even need with a religion, any religion..
Religion seems to be for the benefit of clergy.. and their groupies..

Jesus came to make ALL religion obsolete, and did...
Thank God.. He said "you must be born again", NOT joined up and a dues paying member..

93 posted on 08/15/2006 4:36:59 PM PDT by hosepipe (not joined up and dues paying members..)
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To: neverdem
Thanks for the posting. Mental issues continue to be stigmatized. Depression is difficult to understand. I work at a university where there is a lot of research going on and much to learn about this disorder. I have heard about using ketermine and am open to the possibility it may be helpful to some individuals who suffer depression.
94 posted on 08/15/2006 5:50:20 PM PDT by michgirl
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To: betty boop
Odd that you would post Cartesian Dualism and then use JBS Haldane for your tagline. :-)

Cheers!

95 posted on 08/15/2006 7:01:18 PM PDT by grey_whiskers
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To: betty boop
Not true there is much discussion now about the mind as well as the brain and it is very interesting stuff.
You said which came first the physical disorder or the depression---well read up on heart disease and untreated depression.
there is quite a bit of information available on attachment--primary relationships and the development of the brain. seems the physical development is dependent on the quality of primary connections. Ongoing stress does effect body chemistry and very likely contributes to physical and mental disorders.
96 posted on 08/15/2006 8:22:56 PM PDT by michgirl
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To: grey_whiskers
just in addition to your comment
Haldane was himself a very idealistic man, and in his youth was a devoted Communist (wikipedia)
97 posted on 08/15/2006 8:31:30 PM PDT by michgirl
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To: grey_whiskers; hosepipe; marron; Alamo-Girl
Odd that you would post Cartesian Dualism and then use JBS Haldane for your tagline. :-)

But I am not a Cartesian dualist, grey_whiskers! I'm a Niels Bohr-style complementarian: There is a difference. Descartes was under the spell of Aristotle's law of the excluded middle. Bohr was not: He just loved the way two apparently mutually-exclusive descriptions of an object were needed in order to give "the complete description of the given system under study."

If I were to be any kind of "dualist" at all, I'd have to say my mentor would be the pre-Socratic philosopher Heraclitus. [And Heraclitus was, I think, completely aware that the dualism of which he spoke was in a certain sense more apparent than real.] Not Rene Descartes. [Though I revere the latter as a world-class mathematician and philosopher, and esteem him as co-founder, with Liebniz, of the Calculus.]

I gather as two different observers seeing things from different points of view, you and I are not looking at the same thing, or at least in the same way, on this question.

But I'm glad to stand corrected in any way shape or form, if you can show me something I haven't seen or properly appreciated till now. This is just to let you know that I am ever primed to receive new information.

Thanks so much for writing, grey_whiskers!

98 posted on 08/15/2006 8:52:58 PM PDT by betty boop (The universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose. -J.B.S. Haldane)
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To: msnimje
Is it that it really cures depression or is it that you no longer care that you are depressed?

If you don't care, then you aren't depressed. Depression is the stark realization that your life sucks. Happiness is the illusion that your life does not suck.

99 posted on 08/15/2006 8:56:05 PM PDT by P-Marlowe (((172 * 3.141592653589793238462) / 180) * 10 = 30.0196631)
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To: betty boop
[ The universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose. -J.B.S. Haldane ]

On the otherhand queer may just mean wonderful.. too wonderful than we can suppose..
I have faith that it is..

100 posted on 08/15/2006 9:03:50 PM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole.)
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