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Is Israel in America’s Interest?
FrontPage Magazine ^ | 13OCT06 | Martin Kramer

Posted on 10/13/2006 4:13:35 AM PDT by familyop

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1 posted on 10/13/2006 4:13:37 AM PDT by familyop
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To: familyop

When Jews start flying planes into our buildings we should stop supporting them.


2 posted on 10/13/2006 4:15:24 AM PDT by Always Right
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To: familyop

I'd say it is because it is simply the right thing to do.


3 posted on 10/13/2006 4:18:55 AM PDT by DB (©)
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To: SJackson; Alouette

Ping.

Hmmm...an exercise in the art of writing many words. Kramer must have also studied at an academy of the Empire.


4 posted on 10/13/2006 4:19:25 AM PDT by familyop
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To: familyop
and so they deliberately take a contrary position on issues around which there is broad agreement.

He cites this as a criticism. I wonder if we asked him about climate change if that sharp tongue might become forked.

5 posted on 10/13/2006 4:27:06 AM PDT by Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit (War is Peace__Freedom is Slavery__Ignorance is Strength)
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To: DB

I would, too. The article is remarkable, though. The author is in favor of Israel, yet he writes like a Greek or Roman. ...a man of many [snore] words. I also dislike the phrase, "pax Americana" and wonder if he had to hold his nose while writing it.


6 posted on 10/13/2006 4:27:36 AM PDT by familyop
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To: familyop

Why not question of South Korea is in our best interests...


7 posted on 10/13/2006 4:29:47 AM PDT by trashcanbred (Anti-social and anti-socialist)
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To: familyop

"But everywhere in the West, there is a sliver of elite opinion that is not satisfied with these rationales."

That's because that "elite" (?) doesn't know God or even respect Him. Israel is God's and as you treat Israel so God will be inclined to treat you.

Ever wonder why this country is so prosperous and blessed? Did you think it was because we were so Godly? Think again.

God will bless those who bless israel, the only nation He ever founded, and curse those who curse Israel. That goes for all nations.


8 posted on 10/13/2006 4:31:03 AM PDT by RoadTest (The heart of the wise is in the house of mourning; but the heart of fools is in the house of mirth.)
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To: familyop
If we only had friends who were specifically valuable to us England, Australia, and perhaps Japan would be it. We shouldn't choose friends based on need.

We have a cultural link to Israel. We have a large part of Israels population who have close ties to American citizens and Israel genuinely loves us. There is only one Arab nation who genuinely loves us and thats Kuwait.

I would also bet that we get a huge amount of our intelligence from Israeli intelligence. People who would like the U.S. to abandon Israel to avoid conflict with Muslims would I guess suggest we abandon Japan, S.Korea and Taiwan to avoid confrontation with China and N.Korea.

Lets not forget Truman recognized Israel first. We have to be responsible for that act. How about we have some character.

9 posted on 10/13/2006 4:32:03 AM PDT by nativist (Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting, but never hit soft.)
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To: familyop

Excellent read.


10 posted on 10/13/2006 4:39:27 AM PDT by Robert DeLong
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To: familyop
a liability -- a burden to be borne.

I felt like that while reading this incredibly turgid and verbose article.

11 posted on 10/13/2006 4:39:53 AM PDT by Alouette (Psalms of the Day: 104-105)
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To: RhoTheta

Excellent.


12 posted on 10/13/2006 4:42:11 AM PDT by Egon (I stand beside you as your partner, in front as your defender, behind as... hey! nice butt!)
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To: trashcanbred
"Why not question of South Korea is in our best interests..."

That's a good question, IMO. Most people in that part of the world don't even like us.
13 posted on 10/13/2006 4:42:19 AM PDT by familyop ("he died for rodeo horse on Jul 25, 1987." - - skanamaru)
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To: familyop

Anther reason to support Israel is because God commands it. Good enough for me!


14 posted on 10/13/2006 4:44:10 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: Alouette

...me, too! Maybe it will win over some Trifkovic or Sobran zombies. LOL!


15 posted on 10/13/2006 4:49:13 AM PDT by familyop ("he died for rodeo horse on Jul 25, 1987." - - skanamaru)
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To: familyop

[Since no one in the Gulf is sure that the United States has the staying power to maintain such a presence over time, the Gulf keeps producing defiers of America, from Khomeini to Saddam to Bin Laden to Ahmadinejad. The United States has to counter them, not in the interests of Israel, but to keep the world’s great reserves of oil out of the grip of the West’s sworn enemies.]

Unfortunate truth, but America's enemy within has stopped America from drilling for oil and using nuclear energy and therefore made us dependent of middle eastern Arab nations, a symbiotic relationship that could disappear in a minute unless we begin to drill for our own oil and use our own nuclear energy and get rid of the communists and fools whom we elected and who hate America (most with a degree, none so blind as those who will not see) who are American leftists with a one world dictator view which they will get when they abandon all truth.


16 posted on 10/13/2006 4:51:09 AM PDT by kindred (Dems are communists, Pubs are fools, where are brave conservative politicians?)
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To: familyop
whether Israel is or is not an asset to the United States

The US shouldn't have 'friends' - it should have 'interests'. On the negative side, our oil suppliers hate the Js; on the plus side, Israel has a disportionate share of high-tech companies relative to its population than any other country.

In the long-term, as oil runs out, muzzies will revert to the sand jocks that they are, while J scientists in the US/Israel will continue to push the envelope.

Also, we generally support countries under threat from their neighbors who pretty much mind their own business & want to live in peace on their own tiny strip of land.

17 posted on 10/13/2006 4:51:58 AM PDT by Chuck Dent
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To: familyop

Not to mention that while we have been protecting them they have been undercutting our businesses here at home.

But it isn't very "politically correct" to bring up such things.


18 posted on 10/13/2006 4:52:43 AM PDT by trashcanbred (Anti-social and anti-socialist)
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To: familyop; All

Separating my belief in the Bible from the issue... I support Israel for its contribution to mankind. I detest its Islamo-fascist enemies for their pure, ignorant wickedness and their detrement to mankind.


19 posted on 10/13/2006 4:58:25 AM PDT by johnny7 (“And what's Fonzie like? Come on Yolanda... what's Fonzie like?!”)
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen
Anther reason to support Israel is because God commands it. Good enough for me!

Where did he tell you this? I don't think God cares about nation-states - only people.

20 posted on 10/13/2006 4:59:18 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Jack2006

God very much demands it and says so in the bible. I am on my favorite site to search these answers now but will be outta time shortly. Any help would be appreciated. wwww.christiananswer.net


21 posted on 10/13/2006 5:07:39 AM PDT by liberty or death
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To: Jack2006

Perhaps you should read Ezekiel or is it Daniel. There is a passage the describe what happens to thost that abandon Israel. A woe be or woe unto in somewhere. Anytime God say "woe", bad things happen.


22 posted on 10/13/2006 5:08:01 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen; liberty or death

If you believe in the Bible literally then anyone who has an affair should be killed. This is God's command so why aren't you out doing it?


23 posted on 10/13/2006 5:13:35 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Jack2006
If you believe in the Bible literally then anyone who has an affair should be killed. This is God's command so why aren't you out doing it?

Are you familiar with the New Testament? :-)

24 posted on 10/13/2006 5:17:20 AM PDT by alnick
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To: Jack2006
Where did he tell you this? I don't think God cares about nation-states - only people.

To believe this you have to be either ignorant of the Old Testament or believe that it doesn’t apply to the topic at hand anymore. It doesn’t apply to salvation, but I wouldn’t be so sure about “God not taking an interest in nation states”. Heck just the recreation of Israel in 48 should convince you otherwise.

25 posted on 10/13/2006 5:18:53 AM PDT by gbaker
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To: Jack2006

God has not commanded me to judge, the new testament covers that. Through Christ, the sinner is forgiven - no need to stone people for their sins.


26 posted on 10/13/2006 5:19:23 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: alnick

Doesn't apply if you are Jewish.


27 posted on 10/13/2006 5:19:42 AM PDT by djf (There is no such thing as "moderate muslims". They are all "silent supporters!!")
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen
God has not commanded me to judge, the new testament covers that. Through Christ, the sinner is forgiven - no need to stone people for their sins.

So parts of the Old Testament are not true for today then?

28 posted on 10/13/2006 5:20:39 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Jack2006
That is a false conclusion/assumtion to make. The Old Testament holds true. The law is still the law, a sin is still a sin.
Christ was a practicing Jew and observed to the law of the Old testament.
29 posted on 10/13/2006 5:25:08 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen
That is a false conclusion/assumtion to make. The Old Testament holds true. The law is still the law, a sin is still a sin. Christ was a practicing Jew and observed to the law of the Old testament.

So when the Old Testament says we should kill homosexuals, those who commit adultery, we should still do so?

30 posted on 10/13/2006 5:26:30 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Jack2006
second timothy 2'15 rightly dividing the word of truth.

All of the old testament laws were not given to the entire world. They were given to Israel. As someone else pointed out we are "all" now under the new testament but even it has divisions in certain areas and this is why second timothy is so important in that learning how to read the bible is critical. Many leaders throughout history have used it to kill billions. And many still use it to say God hates Jews. History shows us that Jews do reject God for the most part and he has used evil nations to punish them. But what has happened to those nations? I am no expert but I believe every word of that book and trust He who had it written. What I do know is not everything pertains to the here and now nor to my nation or me. I am under the umbrella of the salvation gift of Jesus Christ and thank God every day for the nation i live in and this time in history.
31 posted on 10/13/2006 5:28:38 AM PDT by liberty or death
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To: Jack2006
OK - enough of you. You argue in circles without a point. You seem to arguing for arguments sake.
32 posted on 10/13/2006 5:32:08 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen
OK - enough of you. You argue in circles without a point. You seem to arguing for arguments sake.

I have been very specific here. Is the Old Testament literally true or not?

It cannot be both. If you believe it is then take it all. If you don't then it is all up for debate, including the passages on Israel.

No-one will answer yes or no here because it frightens them.

33 posted on 10/13/2006 5:36:06 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Always Right

What about bombing our warships - they did that once ya know?


34 posted on 10/13/2006 5:36:34 AM PDT by Little Ray (If you want to be a martyr, we want to martyr you.)
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To: Always Right
>>> When Jews start flying planes into our buildings we should stop supporting them. <<<<


35 posted on 10/13/2006 5:41:01 AM PDT by quietolong
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To: Little Ray; quietolong

All the investigations into the USS Liberty concluded that it was a mistake, that the Isrealis thought it was a Egyptian ship. In the 40 years since, Isreali has given us no reason to doubt that story. But alternative theories will always exist. There were many failures of communications and much confusion surrounding the incident. I give Isreali the benefit of the doubt.


36 posted on 10/13/2006 5:54:41 AM PDT by Always Right
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen

Genesis 12:2-4 (New King James Version)
New King James Version (NKJV)


2 I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.

3 I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you;
And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

4 So Abram departed as the LORD had spoken to him, and Lot went with him. And Abram was seventy-five years old when he departed from Haran.


37 posted on 10/13/2006 6:00:41 AM PDT by No Blue States
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To: Jack2006

It's in our owners manual.


38 posted on 10/13/2006 6:09:43 AM PDT by servantboy777
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To: Jack2006
"No-one will answer yes or no here because it frightens them."
I believed you are frightened. You do not believe and wish to invalidate the old/New testaments for your own comfort. It could be I'm wrong - it just seems like it to me.
39 posted on 10/13/2006 6:10:58 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

High Volume. Articles on Israel can also be found by clicking on the Topic or Keyword Israel.

also Keywords 2006israelwar or WOT [War on Terror]

----------------------------

40 posted on 10/13/2006 6:12:10 AM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: No Blue States

Thank you.


41 posted on 10/13/2006 6:12:16 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: familyop

For later read.


42 posted on 10/13/2006 6:12:28 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: Always Right

So do I; Israel's existance is so precarious, you have to cut 'em some slack.


43 posted on 10/13/2006 6:12:54 AM PDT by Little Ray (If you want to be a martyr, we want to martyr you.)
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen

Why can't you answer a simple question?

Is the Old Testament literally true for us today? Yes or No?


44 posted on 10/13/2006 6:13:03 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Jack2006

The answers have been provided.


45 posted on 10/13/2006 6:18:07 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Religion of peace my arse - We need a maintenance Crusade)
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To: WorkerbeeCitizen
The answers have been provided.

The fact you cannot answer Yes or No, to a simple question of whether the Old Testament is literally true for the modern world answers my question.

46 posted on 10/13/2006 6:21:19 AM PDT by Jack2006
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To: Jack2006

I don't think God cares about nation-states - only people.



You, sir, are mistaken.

Genesis 12:1-3
"Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:
And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:
And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed."


And BTW, the fulfillment of the law by the Redeemer does not buy the redeemed any right to ignore being obedient out of love.

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:" (2 Tim 3:16)

There is no exclusion of the Old Testament.


47 posted on 10/13/2006 6:29:44 AM PDT by azhenfud (The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)
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To: Jack2006; WorkerbeeCitizen

Is the Old Testament literally true for us today? Yes or No?



What problems in our society exist today that would not if teachings of the OT were adhered to?


48 posted on 10/13/2006 6:35:24 AM PDT by azhenfud (The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)
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The Bible, can we trust it?

http://www.raptureready.com/rr-bible.html

An interesting read for those who have doubts.


49 posted on 10/13/2006 6:39:53 AM PDT by No Blue States
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An online Bible, searchable by any word, topic or passage:

http://www.biblegateway.com/

:)


50 posted on 10/13/2006 6:46:45 AM PDT by No Blue States
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