Posted on 12/21/2006 5:56:27 AM PST by A. Pole
In many countries, college takes three years, not four, because they don't have humanities core classes, being expected to learn that in high school. Is this article comparing foreign students with college degrees, perhaps from excellent universities, to American students without degrees, is my immediate question.
My office has close to fifty people working at engineering or software jobs. One of them is an H1B. One is a contact for an outsourcing firm that nobody is happy about having to use. All the rest are American.
Not sure who you are referring to, here. Neither I nor the person to which I responded is a troll.
The Computer Sciences major entry is kind of misleading. Many of those jobs are in very high cost of living areas. I make quite a bit less than $49k per year but am doing well because I don't live in a place like silicon valley, where 150,000 dollar house is a shack.
The article explicitly states that the foreigners are getting trained and mentions no degrees for them.
>>>I hope the free trade nazis are happy.
I don't understand how H1Bs are linked to free trade. Free trade is about no tariffs, H1Bs are about importing cheaper workers. Although both issues support businesses that compete globally and both benefit the consumer through lower prices, only free trade is about reducing the friction between countries, allowing each country to specialize in what they do best.
H1B's are about subsidizing technology companies. If these companies are so enamored by this labor, let them go offshore to hire them.
So? The training could include anything. Heck, I'd guess most jobs are going to include some training before the new employee gets up to speed. I want to know A. whether or not these aliens with "two or three years of college" have degrees and B. what the training consists of. Quite possibly knowing these two facts would make this article not nearly as scary.
Many companies hire student engineers from India and China with only 2 or 3 years of college and then train them in their own facilities.
"Student engineers" = no degree.
I'm so glad you asked. You likely are unaware of the full history...which appears to be at variance with your public grade-school understanding. It was about foreign interference. It was about independence therefrom.
Boston Teaparty
By Cassandra Jansen*** Quote ***
In 1773, Britain's East India Company was sitting on large stocks of tea that it could not sell in England. It was on the verge of bankruptcy. In an effort to save it, the government passed the Tea Act of 1773, which gave the company the right to export its merchandise directly to the colonies without paying any of the regular taxes that were imposed on the colonial merchants, who had traditionally served as the middlemen in such transactions. With these privileges, the company could undersell American merchants and monopolize the colonial tea trade. The act proved inflammatory for several reasons. First, it angered influential colonial merchants, who feared being replaced and bankrupted by a powerful monopoly. The East India Company's decision to grant franchises to certain American merchants for the sale of their tea created further resentments among those excluded from this lucrative trade. More important, however, the Tea Act revived American passions about the issue of taxation without representation. The law provided no new tax on tea. Lord North assumed that most colonists would welcome the new law because it would reduce the price of tea to consumers by removing the middlemen. But the colonists responded by boycotting tea. Unlike earlier protests, this boycott mobilized large segments of the population. It also helped link the colonies together in a common experience of mass popular protest. Particularly important to the movement were the activities of colonial women, who were one of the principal consumers of tea and now became the leaders of the effort to the boycott.
Various colonies made plans to prevent the East India Company from landing its cargoes in colonial ports. In ports other than Boston, agents of the company were "persuaded" to resign, and new shipments of tea were either returned to England or warehoused. In Boston, the agents refused to resign and, with the support of the royal governor, preparations were made to land incoming cargoes regardless of opposition. After failing to turn back the three ships in the harbor, local patriots led by Samuel Adams staged a spectacular drama. On the evening of December 16, 1773, three companies of fifty men each, masquerading as Mohawk Indians, passed through a tremendous crowd of spectators, went aboard the three ships, broke open the tea chests, and heaved them into the harbor.As the electrifying news of the Boston "tea party" spread, other seaports followed the example and staged similar acts of resistance of their own.'
When the Bostonians refused to pay for the property they had destroyed, George III and Lord North decided on a policy of coercion, to be applied only against Massachusetts, the socalled Coercive Acts. In these four acts of 1774, Parliament closed the port of Boston, drastically reduced the powers of selfgovernment in the colony, permitted royal officers to be tried in other colonies or in England when accused of crimes, and provided for the quartering of troops in the colonists' barns and empty houses. The acts sparked new resistance up and down the coast.
It was because government (British at that time) gave special free trade rights to the big corporation. This was to flood the market with cheaper tea and to ruin small local companies.
Actually, they will make the pitch for doing precisely that when they think they are out of the public eye and amongst fellow conspirators.
I am a legal immigrant working in the US on a H1B visa. H1B is a dual intent visa. Everyone who comes in on a H1B is supposed to have an intent to immigrate. The law provides fo r that.I know that many people on free republic do not have a high opinion of the H1B visa holders. However The US congress has promulgated this visa statute and I have played by the rules.I have payed federal and state income taxes. I have not availed any benefits from Social security/Medicare. I am not a burden on the American social services.I have no criminal convictions. I never even had a speeding ticket. I am pro life..
I consider myself a conservative..I am for small government. I believe that people should have a right to bear arms..
I am waiting for my green card for a number of years. I have enough available to put a down payment on a house but I would not dare to buy due to the uncertainties involved in the whole immigration processes. I have suffered a lot due to the complicated immigration procedures and delays in this country. After a certain time period I would not have any option but to pack up and go home. Please note that I am sure that my job would follow me to my country of origin. That would be a net loss to this country. Please support legal immigration. In the brouhaha of illegal immigration, I am noticing that no one is paying attention to the problems legal immigrants are facing....I understand that not many people would care about what I am saying but still have to try....
PLEASE SUPPORT LEGAL IMMIGRATION
It was to compete with the Dutch, nice try. The U.S. had no domestic tea production.
I hear about H1Bs being paid less..not in my experience...
In skill levels I have seen as much variation in Americans as in H1Bs..The argument of citizens having superior skills does not stand...
In IT industry any skills older that 5/6 years are effectively rendered obsolete... Arguments of more experience does not stand either...
I know plenty Americans who have great skills and at their skill level are employed in spite of H1Bs being around....
A lot of html, signifying nothing. If you wish to debate the Boston Tea Part, go right ahead. Not sure how much your post of somebody's school assignment should carry.
Thank you for your first hand account. If we could control illegal immigration we might be able to be more fair handed about good legal immigrants who want to be Americans. I'm sorry our bureaurcies are so inept that this goes on.
The free traders here deny that this is so. They call it all "win-win". And the fact (that you forthrightly admit) your job would "follow you" is not a negative ascribable to you. But to the employers and free trader accomplices.
Now consider if they suddenly did as they wished and tripled or quadrupled the number of H-1Bs to swamp your field. How would your wages hold up?
Many H-1Bs have been the beneficiary of unique circumstances in time...which in some sectors have now evaporated. I agree, many good people come in through H-1B's. But the wage standards requirements of those sectors I refer to...are not being enforced. Were they in your case? And honestly, would you have rocked the boat and complained if they weren't?
Outside of you, and a large number of others, I'm sure we also may have a very real loyalty problem with the H-1Bs. Illustrative of this are the large number of Chinese spies that have come in under these programs. Also there are those who have proven to be mercenary from other countries...such as the Indian expatriate Noshir Gowada who sold our B-2 Stealth secrets to China...
This has not proven to be isolated. You must admit we certainly need to be more cautious...not less.
Well...
We cannot label H1Bs as security risks..In fact most of them end up holding jobs nowhere concerned with national security..
Remember ... Aldrich Ames ...Robert Hansen... Rosenthal couple ...all these august persons did not come here on H1Bs....Of course you would find some H1Bs doing unsavory things just like any other group you can choose at random...
No one would agree to dumping population of Pakistan or Indonesia into USA...Neither is anyone ask for that
The country is not making babies at replacement level...A large part of the population is aging..Baby boomers would start retiring soon....They only way to keep this country running is to get more immigrants...more than ever before....That is going to cause social issues in USA but the lack of immigrants would cause another set of worse problems...This is the bitter pill this country would have to swallow...The situation would catch up with the country one way or the other...The choice is yours...
The only developed country that has a consistently growing economy is USA..The reason is immigration..Cut off immigration and you would get economic contraction...Just like Japan and Germany.....
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