Posted on 04/27/2007 1:24:55 AM PDT by Cardhu
“Patton (who who because he had a good movie made about him and people don’t actually read a lot of military history, is a TAD overrated on FR)...”
Overrated? Patton’s 3rd Army out performed every other European Theater army in WWII. His approach to combat is sorely needed today - “Audacity, audacity, always audacity.”
I believe the officer in question in this thread is saying that unlike Patton, today’s flag rank generals are not willing to take calculated risks necessary to adapt to the skills, tactics, and strategies of the enemy. After this much time in Iraq we know that our soldiers have the heart and the desire to do what is necessary, the senior leadersip needs to catch up and help them get the job done.
And an astonishingly low 0.002% hold advanced degrees in Ballet and Interpretative dance. I think we can live with that.
No. He’ll be protected. This has been long in coming. Too much conventional thinking went into the Iraq Occupation, not enough McMaster and Petraueus.
Perhaps Rumsfeld did not remove enough Colonel Blimps, but rather, enabled them.
Be Seeing You,
Chris
Propaganda per se is neither good nor bad - no more than breathing or crapping. And to an extent it is a science [applied mass psychology] or a skill, the successful practitioners become not the role models but instructors.
Every attempt at Patriotism is met with labels of "Nationalism" and equations of this to 'National Socialism - read Nazism.'
This is sad excuse of 'moral relevancy' is engrained in the media reports and at every level of discussion. The academics have worked overtime to instill this deviation from reality.
The article, “General Failure,” is to be published today in Armed Forces Journal and is posted at http://www.armedforcesjournal.com. Its appearance signals the public emergence of a split inside the military between younger, mid-career officers and the top brass.
Surge strategist Frederick Kagan on how events are unfolding in Iraq.
Hugh Hewitt show ^ | 4/25/07 | Frederick Kagan / Hugh Hewitt
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1823696/posts
(snip)
HH: Can you give us a little circumstances on how you got there? Did you guys ask General Petraeus? Or did he invite a bunch of you to come as one of the architects of the surge? I was fascinated that you would go over.
FK: No, we…I asked to come visit and see what’s going on, try to get an understanding of the situation on the ground, and help me to form my evaluation of how things are going, and where we need to head.
HH: And where did it take you? What did you see?
FK: We went, I went into Baghdad, went into joint security, two joint security stations in the Hurriya area of the Khadimiya neighborhood, went up to Baqubah, to the FOB out there, and then rode in strikers to the joint commander center, listened to the Iraqi division commander out there brief, got up to see our bases at Taji and Balad, and had the opportunity to meet with some former cadets that I’d taught who were also over there, and get their impressions from the lower levels.
HH: Now if you can give us the summary before I get to the specifics, has there in the 100 days since President Bush announced the plan, which is not yet even fully staffed, or even half staffed with the five brigades, et cetera, is there a change in the wind?
FK: There sure is. There are a lot of changes underway. One of the most remarkable things is that sectarian violence in Baghdad dropped almost immediately after the President announced the surge, and has stayed down. And in fact, the command in Iraq has recently announced that the daily murder rate in Baghdad is the lowest it’s been in six months, and it’s down 65% since November. And that’s a really dramatic accomplishment this early into the surge. Probably even more important than that, and this is something that goes back even before the surge, is that the Sunni population in Iraq is really beginning to turn on al Qaeda, and Anbar, which had been their base and stronghold, it’s becoming inhospitable to them, and the Sunnis are joining the police forces and the army, and are starting to attack and kill the terrorists. And that’s an incredibly important development.
(snip)
There is no fact I am aware of that says Abu Ghraib was more than abuse by a very small section of enlisted folks at the prison. Like it or not, that actually does happen.
Present facts that show the complicity of generals in that foolishness in which no one was injured, and someone might be inclined to pursue any generals.
We don’t just convict people on the basis of emotion.
It's impossible to claim someone is overratedm without people misinterpreting that into you saying they're terrible.
There's an element on FR that seem to blindly worship Patton as an infallible military genius who was the greatest general of all time, seemingly, because their only knowledge of either Patton, or military history in general, is the film.
I’m hoping to one day see his neck in a noose.
LLS
40 years of enemy IO preparation of the battlefield through cultural Marxism is the primary reason our side does strategic communications so poorly. Tens of millions of our fellow citizens are hard-wired to disbelieve.
He’s not going to be getting any “Stars” now. I suspect he is headed for a quiet retirement and after that, I smell a book deal.
“The views of subordinates and peers play no role in an officer’s advancement; to move up he must only please his superiors.”
It’s the Army. The military has always had a command and control structure. Command and control applied to society is socialism/fascism/communism. While it is wrong for society, it seems to be right for the military. In some ways, this sounds like a familiar complaint.
Even outside the military, there often comes a time when one gripes about the boss, or “management,” or about ‘those in control,” etc. Only a few are rewarded for doing so. He may get his 15 minutes of fame. Then in a new administration, who knows?
I disagree here. The general in charge of Abu Ghraib prison was removed and forced to retire. Higher up the chain than that it gets murky real fast. Figuring out that a rogue unit is operating inside a prison would be almost impossible for someone higher than the prison commander to determine unless there was a whistleblower.
Career killer bump!
calling them slow to grasp the realities of the war and overly optimistic in their assessments.
I know what he means.
We are still only left with the task of getting the Iraq security Forces trained so they can handle the security. There's nothing else we are prepared to do at this point. At the end of the day, we need the area secure.
On a side note, what's going on in Congress isn't helping.
8 Star General John Murtha will probably have a slot open for him.
“Surely he’s asking for court martial”
Yep. He knows his comments undermine our efforts and he needs to be punished. I hope it was worth it.
Rumsfeld set the tone early for what happened to those in uniform who talked out of school. I believe it was just prior to 9-11 when General Kernan (Joint Forces Command) and a Navy flag officer told some House committee that ground forces were too small. Within a day or two, during one of the Rumsfeld/Meyers Pentagon briefs, they were publicly dressed down for what they had said to the committee. A short time later Kernan retired. That, and the way Shinseki was treated by Rumsfelt, left no doubt about how to stay in line.
I doubt it. He didn't shoot his mouth off to a reporter. He published his criticism in a US Army publication -- this is essentially "official criticism".
He'll get his own stars one day. You don't get to be the XO of an ACR without being well regarded.
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