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To: tantiboh; colorcountry
How can Christians “deplore” statements that end up making us into better people? Wouldn’t you prefer a neighbor who doesn’t drink, doesn’t smoke, and is generous with his means?

I think it is unnecessary to explain to you my statement meant that Jesus did not command us to wear special undergarments, refrain from drinking wine, coffee, or tea, perform rituals in an exclusive temple, etc. etc. What you say he has asked you to do is not what he has asked me to do, and my objection is to your implying that.

If you go out and murder someone, breaking the commandment that “Thou shalt not kill,” are you going to get to heaven just because you professed your faith in Jesus? Do you not, as a Christian, have to refrain from adultery if you are to keep the faith? Theft? Lying? Isn’t obeying these laws “works?”

That's a pretty good stretch there...obedience to the commandments doesn't qualify in my definition of "works". That's where you run into the idea of having to "work" to obtain salvation when it was a gift made to us by Jesus on the cross.

Color, would you agree to this?

As to my neighbors, I prefer them to live their own lives in their own way and allow me the same freedom.

842 posted on 05/06/2007 1:04:39 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Fred sez "I'm not interested in being the tallest midget in the room.." RUN FRED RUN!)
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To: greyfoxx39; tantiboh

Yep I agree.

One problem I had with Mormonism is the level you are judged by your performance (by your leaders) to obtain the “right” to certain blessings.

Only God is the judge, and only he knows someones intent and their heart.

Tanti, you asked about murder. Mankind may judge you of murder, but only God truly understands the nature of the “why” behind the act. Christ died to set us free of not only mankinds unrighteous judgement, but even the righteous judgement of God.

In God’s eyes we all sin - - every single one of us. Each single sin regardless of how small, makes us a sinner and God HATES ALL sin (even the little ones). But because of the atonement we are seen by God as perfect because the blood of Christ covers our sin....but only when we admit we sin, and put our faith only in the salvation He has offered.

When you place your rewards in your own hands because of your own works, you are effectively telling God that Christ’s atonement wasn’t good enough to save you. You slap away the gift and say, “I can do it myself.” Mormonism teaches that you cannot do it ALL yourself, but that Christ needed to die to help you out a little bit. (after all you can do)

Do you see why that is so extremely offensive to those of us who absolutely place our adoration in Him alone and see our works as dirty rags if we do them toward our own glory.

Christians are commanded to do two things only....Love God and Love our neighbor...in these two commands all the others commands are contained. When we love God and Love our neighbor, good deeds to our fellowman are a result of the Love.

You cannot do works to earn your glory and expect that God will view that the same as loving Him and doing kind deeds for HIS glory. There is a difference - - no matter how one spins it.


848 posted on 05/06/2007 1:20:01 PM PDT by colorcountry (“It is wrong to criticize the leaders of the church even if the criticism is true” ~Dallin H. Oaks)
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