Posted on 05/14/2007 9:02:12 AM PDT by oblomov
Sure, let us buy the drugs from the socialists. The drug companies will raise the prices to the socialist until they reach parody with the non-socialist countries, like ours. If the socialists pay more it should be possible for us to pay less. Socialism, which you apparently lean towards, is when the government tells the citizens what they have to do, such as where and for what price they must buy a product. That is what the US government is doing with it's own citizens. You obviously are against free markets, i.e. markets that are open for anyone to find the best deal, wherever that might be.
Personally, I'm for freedom. It's not my, or my governments, responsibility to assist the pharmaceutical companies by restricting free trade. It is also not my, or my governments, responsibility to force socialist countries to do anything. Their system only works because they are aided and abetted by the dupes in this Country.
And now I'm supposed to feel bad about benefiting from the policies of other countries. I suppose you're against trade with China and Walmart too and that we are all supposed to wring our hands over the low prices brought about by "slave labor".
I don't know if you're a Democrat or not but you are certainly no conservative.
I could recommend several cures, but one is illegal in 49 states, and the other specifically proscribed by the Roman Catholic Church.
Otherwise, I’d guess you’re SOL, friend.
Cheers!
Google "Canadian pharmacy".
Just go to Google and type in Canadian prescription drugs, or any other wording having to do with prescription drugs and you will get a number of websites, some not Canadian. You will have to sift thru a lot to determine the best deal but even if you do not order, it is fascinating to see the range of discounts for various drugs. When it comes to paying for prescription drugs out of pocket, I see it as every man/woman for themselves. Thirty dollars instead of $130 is not to be sneezed at. How much of the higher price goes for freebies to everybody in the country except me? Bottom line-—Who is looking out for me but me?
Except that the state won't allow them to raise the prices. That's how this whole problem got started in the first place. That's what a price control is.
Socialism, which you apparently lean towards, is when the government tells the citizens what they have to do, such as where and for what price they must buy a product
Socialism tells manufacturers what they can charge for a product. You keep forgetting it's the other countries who are demanding this of American businesses. There are many reasons for not allowing the re-importation of drugs. Price controls is just one of many.
Personally, I'm for freedom. It's not my, or my governments, responsibility to assist the pharmaceutical companies by restricting free trade
Free trade? There is no free trade with pharmaceuticals in Canada. The only entity that can negotiate drug prices is the Canadian government. How do you get free trade from a false economy?
You obviously are against free markets, i.e. markets that are open for anyone to find the best deal, wherever that might be.
A free market would exist where the supplier can charge what the market will bear for his product. Tell me how that exists in a price controlled market.
Their system only works because they are aided and abetted by the dupes in this Country.
So what would you do about it? What's your solution for getting these freeloaders to begin paying their fair share? Is it to allow the re-importation of their drugs, at the government mandated price, so that we can also be a party to removing the profit motive from an essential industry? What will you tell your children when therd are no promising new drugs to treat their afflictions? What will you tell them as you say goodbye because that new class of antibiotics never made it to market to treat the resistant bugs?
Without the profit motive there is no innovation. Is it their duty to the state to produce life saving therapies? Eh, comrade?
I suppose you're against trade with China and Walmart too and that we are all supposed to wring our hands over the low prices brought about by "slave labor".
I never knew slaves earned wages. What government is telling Wal-Mart what they can charge for their products?
I don't know if you're a Democrat or not but you are certainly no conservative
You don't know much so that's not surprising. Do you have a bumper sticker on your car that says "Drugs for people not for profit"? That's how I usually tell who is conservative and who is not.
Is that why it only takes 12 years and $800 million to bring a new drug to market? LOL!
If you want me to buy my scripts in the US, then you can pay me the 2/3rds difference.
There are not enough drugs in Cananda to supply the US. The deficit will be made up by Chinese imports. If the Melamine thing didn’t worry you this surely should.
So now you're telling me that Canada is forcing the pharmaceutical companies to sell to them at a low price? No. The Canadian government is negotiating prices with the companies. If the companies don't like the price they won't sell the drugs to them. The Canadian government has no power to deny the companies from raising their prices, they can only decline to purchase the product at a given price. The reason the companies agree to sell at a lower price to Canada is because they know US citizens are forced to subsidize them by not being allowed to buy the product at the lower price.
Free trade? There is no free trade with pharmaceuticals in Canada
I don't care whether the trade is free in Canada or not, I only wan't to be allowed to trade freely as a US citizen.
A free market would exist where the supplier can charge what the market will bear for his product. Tell me how that exists in a price controlled market.
The pharmaceutical companies are not under the control of the Canadian government. If they don't want to sell Canada drugs, at any price, they don't have to. The companies are free to charge whatever they want and the Canadians are free to buy the drugs or not.
So what would you do about it? What's your solution for getting these freeloaders to begin paying their fair share? Is it to allow the re-importation of their drugs, at the government mandated price, so that we can also be a party to removing the profit motive from an essential industry?
What kind of logic is that? If we could buy the drugs at the Canadian price the companies would have to raise this price. The Canadians would pay the higher price because they need the drugs. We would be paying a lower price than we do now albeit higher than the Canadians do now. The companies know how to make a profit with one country paying a higher price than others or with all countries paying the same price.
The crux of this matter is that some, like you, think it perfectly alright for the US government to enforce policies that require it's citizens to pay more for needed drugs because we must insure profits for pharmaceutical companies and research funds for pharmaceutical companies. Profits and research are great but they should come from our citizens freely trading not from government controls. When we can freely trade, drug prices for our citizens will be competitive with drug prices for citizens of other countries. It's incredible to me that you are claiming we can't compete on drug prices because of the advantages that socialist countries have. They have no advantages. Their drug prices are cheaper not because their governments control the prices but because US policies insure that the companies do not have to compete for US drug sales and therefore can gouge the US customers.
This entire scheme is anti-capitalist and anti-American.
Apparenlty price controls are good, as long as they guarantee the highest possible price.
You are woefully ignorant on this topic, that much is clear.
As long as you get yours, screw everyone else. Ain't socialism grand?
Thanks for the intelligent and enlightening post.
In the mean time other folks from overseas will rush to profit on this gap by supplying counterfeits. This already happens RIGHT NOW. Truth is when you buy something over the internet you have no idea where it comes from. Many “Canadian” websites are nothing more than store fronts for third world scams ala the Nigerian banker, et al.
The melamine debacle is a prime example of the kind of fraud that can happen here. I am for more stringent requirements for the things we put in our body, not less.
You think governments negotiate? LOL! Good grief, if you're going to debate a topic you should at least have a basic understanding of the issue. The government doesn't negotiate. It's a take it or leave it proposition.
If the companies don't like the price they won't sell the drugs to them.
There's no generic industry in Canada that the government could allow patent infringement? You think that doesn't happen? Brazil bypasses patent on U.S. Aids drug.
The reason the companies agree to sell at a lower price to Canada is because they know US citizens are forced to subsidize them by not being allowed to buy the product at the lower price.
That's not so. The reason they sell there is because they use the sales volume to help offset their considerable overhead. If you knew anything about the pharma industry you'd understand that their manufacturing overhead is very high and, even though the margins are low, the revenue helps them achieve economies of scale. This, in turn, lowers the overall price for drugs.
I don't care whether the trade is free in Canada or not, I only wan't to be allowed to trade freely as a US citizen.
Especially when anti-capitalist behavior benefits you at the expense of others now and in the future. Nice. Do you have your AARP membership yet?
If we could buy the drugs at the Canadian price the companies would have to raise this price
Repeating yourself doesn't make an argument logical. If the companies could raise their prices they would. Why is that so difficult for you to grasp? If the gov't says no to the price increase they have the last word. De facto price controls here will not increase prices in price controlled countries. It will, however, kill all R&D spending.
The crux of this matter is that some, like you, think it perfectly alright for the US government to enforce policies that require it's citizens to pay more for needed drugs because we must insure profits for pharmaceutical companies and research funds for pharmaceutical companies
Instead, should they allow closet socialists to leech off the anti-capitalist behavior of others? Fortyunately, there are some people in the country who can see beyond their nose and realize that without the profit motive the drug pipeline dries up. Your simpleton solution of having the industry charge more for their products in controlled markets is a clear indication that you don't have any idea what you're talking about.
Profits and research are great but they should come from our citizens freely trading not from government controls.
Except when you can take advantage of other countries imposing price controls on products. Got it.
It's incredible to me that you are claiming we can't compete on drug prices because of the advantages that socialist countries have.
Do you even read what you write? Our prices are set by the free market and you want to buy from a price controlled market. You want all the advantages of socialism, but believe in the free market. Okay.
They have no advantages
Except for the fact that the government tells industry what they can charge for their products and dictates their profitability you're exactly right. LOL.
Their drug prices are cheaper not because their governments control the prices but because US policies insure that the companies do not have to compete for US drug sales and therefore can gouge the US customers.
The more you post the more obvious your politics, and economic illiteracy, become. The pharmaceutical companies are profiteers who gouge their customers and there is no competition in the American drug market. If the drug companies are making such an unreasonable profit I suppose you can prove it? More importantly, do you think the government should do something about it, like dictate what their profits should be in the U.S.? After all, these companies are run by greedy SOB's. Don't you think we need to teach them a lesson? Kill the greedy Kulaks?
This entire scheme is anti-capitalist and anti-American.
Profit motive = Bad
Government determining prices = Good.
Man, are you one confused person.
Yet companies are doing it all the time. VC capital flows heavily to new drug technologies and many of them are start ups. There is still plenty of competition.
Or do you think that, on average, having just five years to recoup your $800 million investment, before it goes generic, is just another way the government helps big bad pharma?
Alternately, one could say that the US consumer is a sucker, paying full pop for drugs when practically every other country in the world has some system of price controls. The drug companies don’t mind - they make back all their R&D dollars with exorbitant prices in the US, and then make decent money selling them in the rest of the world. My natural inclination is to say that price controls like we have in Canada are not a good idea (although they seem to pay off for us), but to not have them when practically everyone else does, yeah, I’d have to say that makes you a bunch of suckers on this deal.
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