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Against Clinton-Obama
Townhall.com ^ | August 18, 2007 | Robert D. Novak

Posted on 08/18/2007 4:06:09 AM PDT by Kaslin

WASHINGTON -- Anticipating that Sen. Hillary Clinton will clinch the Democratic presidential nomination, some supporters are beginning to argue against her principal rival -- Sen. Barack Obama -- for vice president.

They maintain that Obama provides no general election help for Clinton. As an African-American from Illinois, Obama represents an ethnic group and a state already solidly in the Democratic column.

This school of thought advocates a Southerner as Clinton's running mate. The last time Democrats won a national election without a Southerner on the ticket was 1944. Prominent Democrats from the South are in short supply today. The leading prospect: former Virginia Gov. Mark Warner.

FRED THOMPSON'S DEBUT

Key advisers in Fred Thompson's campaign for the Republican presidential candidacy believe he must begin with a superior performance in his first debate in order to generate funds.

Although the actor-politician ranks high in the polls, his platform performance as a non-candidate has been so-so. Consequently, advisers say it is essential that he come over as dynamic in his debate debut. That conceivably could be at the University of New Hampshire debate Sept. 5 but more likely will come at Morgan State University in Baltimore Sept. 27.

That performance may decide the course of major Republican contributors, including donors to Sen. John McCain's fading campaign. Many givers are inclined to Thompson but want to see how he performs under pressure in a debate.

CALIFORNIA SPLIT

The 19 Republicans on California's House delegation are split on the question of earmarks and accusations of ethical transgressions.

The bitter division has produced harsh words between 15-term Rep. Jerry Lewis, the ranking Republican on the House Appropriations Committee and a leading earmarks defender, and second-term Rep. John Campbell, an anti-earmarks reformer. Campbell no longer attends caucuses of the California House Republicans because they become pep rallies for Lewis, whose personal transactions are under Justice Department scrutiny.

In addition to Lewis, California Republicans whose ethics have been challenged include Reps. Gary Miller and Ken Calvert. Lewis and his colleagues have spread the word back in California that Campbell stands alone without support from colleagues. In fact, other reformers in the delegation include Reps. Kevin McCarthy, Devin Nunes and Darrell Issa, with others uneasy about ethical issues among their colleagues.

MITT'S APPEAL

"Why haven't you joined Team Mitt yet?" asked a July 31 mailing sent to contributors of Mitt Romney's successful 2002 campaign for governor of Massachusetts who have not yet given money to his presidential candidacy.

"Mr. Smith," said the personalized letter, "in the past you were one of my most loyal and generous supporters and I will be forever grateful for the unwavering support you gave me when I was Governor of Massachusetts. I would be honored if you would join my presidential campaign with a contribution of $500, $750, $1,000 or some other amount today."

A '02 Romney-for-governor backer who has not signed on to '08 is no Romney enthusiast. Any contributor falling in that category probably was a Washington insider urged to help Romney's state campaign by then White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card, a longtime Massachusetts Republican politician.

J.D.'S RETURN

Republican J.D. Hayworth, who lost a presumably safe congressional seat in Arizona last year after taking a hard line on immigration, has resurfaced with a fundraising appeal for a new organization called Citizens United for a Secure America (CUSA).

Republican contributors received a mailing containing "protect America" petitions demanding that the government "stop the 'politically correct' drive to give mass amnesty to lawbreaking aliens." Hayworth requests contributions of $35, $50 or $75 for CUSA. The organization is listed as "a project" of Citizens United, a longtime Washington-based conservative action organization.

For most of six terms representing the Tempe-Scottsdale district, Hayworth had a moderate position on immigration. He took a sharp turn to the right in the 2006 campaign and became one of the year's unexpected Republican casualties.


TOPICS: Editorial; Politics/Elections; US: District of Columbia
KEYWORDS: hillary; novak; obama; romney
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To: Jim Noble
Obama's main asset is not blacks - it's guilty whites ...

Mrs. Bill Clinton already would get this vote because she's a woman.

41 posted on 08/18/2007 8:23:28 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: Jim Noble

Of course he is.

No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice.

"no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States."

Bottom line: it would be constitutionally questioned and decided by the courts.

42 posted on 08/18/2007 8:38:28 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (The Democratic Party will not exist in a few years....we are watching history unfold before us.)
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To: pnh102
While they may whine loudly at the Democrat party for not cutting off funding for the war, they won't abandon Democrat party candidates at the polls.

Don't be so sure. There is an uprising building among the Dems.

Putting Obama on the ticket precludes a strong anti-war third-party candidate from siphoning votes away from Clinton.

43 posted on 08/18/2007 8:41:19 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (The Democratic Party will not exist in a few years....we are watching history unfold before us.)
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To: Erik Latranyi
Putting Obama on the ticket precludes a strong anti-war third-party candidate from siphoning votes away from Clinton.

I don't think a leftist 3rd party candidate will gain any momentum at all. Look at Ralph Nader in 2000 and 2004. There were many voters who voted for Nader in 2000 but not in 2004 because they believed that they gave the presidency to Bush.

44 posted on 08/18/2007 8:45:15 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: Kaslin

LOL, anybody who believes that Hillary would choose Obama as a running mate smoking something deadly. Hillary will choose the whitest, most attractive, moderate-to-conservative male Democrat she can find. It will be a candidate who is NOT especially hated by the right, and one who can help with the electoral college, ie. the “purple” states (probably somebody who is from the South or from the midwest “flyover” country).

It will NOT be Obama, not in a million years. Period. That speculation is the most naive I have ever heard.


45 posted on 08/18/2007 8:51:22 AM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: Erik Latranyi
Bottom line: it would be constitutionally questioned and decided by the courts.

A court which purported to annul the election of a Vice President on that basis would be on very, VERY shaky ground.

If I were a USSC justice, I wouldn't touch that with a ten-foot pole.

46 posted on 08/18/2007 8:53:05 AM PDT by Jim Noble (Trails of troubles, roads of battle, paths of victory we shall walk.)
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To: Past Your Eyes
It places him in direct succession to the presidency and that is not allowed.

If the time came when Hillary is incapacitated and has to be replaced, then if the VP is not qualified, we go to the next in line, right?

Let's look at the next in line after the VP, the Speaker of the House of Representatives. That person doesn't have to be a native born American to hold that office yet they are in direct line of succession.

In other words, does a person have to qualify to be elected president in order to hold an office that is in direct line of succession? I don't think so.

Therefore, I conclude that the succession reason is not in play for disqualifying Bill.

47 posted on 08/18/2007 8:55:18 AM PDT by varon (Allegiance to the constitution, always. Allegiance to a political party, never.)
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To: johnny7

I agree. It will be the Mexican for sure!


48 posted on 08/18/2007 10:10:29 AM PDT by Paulus Invictus
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To: Paulus Invictus

It’s ALWAYS been Richardson. She don’t need a black VP anyways... she’ll get the Jackson/Sharpton blacks... the ‘black-majority’ The Hispanic voter is now the MAJOR minority in the USA... and she knows it.


49 posted on 08/18/2007 10:37:04 AM PDT by johnny7 ("But that one on the far left... he had crazy eyes")
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To: ought-six

Perhaps Thompson should choose Obama as his running mate, in a gesure of solidarity with him in opposition to Hillary’s devisive campaign. Millions of Blacks suddenly vote R. Bye bye Miss. American Pie for the Witch.


50 posted on 08/18/2007 11:29:46 AM PDT by Jack Black
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To: kabar
I don't dis-agree with you that Hayworth and other GOP candidates faced other problems in their 2006 elections. But, faced with these other problems, some of them did turn to the immigration issue and try to use the hardline position to offset these other problems.

After the Senate passed 2611, the House GOP walked away from the issue. Instead, they went on tour, holding "hearings" at various locations as a way inflame the immigration issue. They held several in AZ.

Both Mitchell's and Hayworth's TV campaign ad on immigration were on You Tube, and are probably still there. My family members living in Scottsdale are also familiar with the campaign. Immigration was a loser for Hayworth and other GOPers.

By some accounts, some GOPers will rely on immigration in 2008. The GOP prez candidates are certainly trying to out-hard-line each other. As in 2006, it won't help, it will only hurt.

51 posted on 08/19/2007 3:05:56 AM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: Ben Ficklin
AMERICAN VOTERS DID not TURN AGAINST TOUGHER ENFORCEMENT OR LOWER IMMIGRATION

Immigration can be a winning issue for the GOP in 2008. Public Opinion Polls on Immigration

52 posted on 08/19/2007 5:35:07 AM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar
Anyone can pull out the polls that they want to believe.

For sure, consistantly, without a doubt, enforcement is a winner. The problem for the GOP is, as has been shown, they can't out-enforce the dems.

53 posted on 08/19/2007 6:02:31 AM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: Ben Ficklin
The problem for the GOP is, as has been shown, they can't out-enforce the dems.

We will agree to disagree. They can out-enforce the Dems and have the voting record in Congress to prove it. When Hillary gets the nomination, as she surely will, the GOP can play her meetings with illegal demonstrators who carried signs "Today we march, tomorrow we vote" and waved Mexican flags. Kennedy and Moran and other Dems were also out there in the streets with the illegals. That didn't play well with the American people.

54 posted on 08/19/2007 6:36:43 AM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar
"They can out-enforce the dems"

If you browse around FR and other right wing websites, you will see that no one believes that the GOP's enforcement efforts are sincere.

This makes it a sword that cuts in both directions.

On one hand, the GOP is using enforcement to attack one wing of the party, driving them to the democrats. On the other hand, the other wing of the GOP, doubting the sincerety of the GOP, is being driven to stay home and not vote.

55 posted on 08/19/2007 6:59:15 AM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: Ben Ficklin
If you browse around FR and other right wing websites

I prefer conservative to "right wing."

you will see that no one believes that the GOP's enforcement efforts are sincere.

No, they believe that the WH and current GOP Chairman, Mel Martinez, and DHS Secretary Chertoff are not sincere about securing our border and enforcing our current immigration laws, and with good reason. They are out of step with the vast majority of Republicans and the American public.

On one hand, the GOP is using enforcement to attack one wing of the party, driving them to the democrats. On the other hand, the other wing of the GOP, doubting the sincerety of the GOP, is being driven to stay home and not vote.

I just don't agree with your basic premise. The immigration issue cuts across partisan lines. The political and corporate elites are trying to foist something on the American people they don't want. It is why Lindsay Graham is being censured by the SC GOP and Chambliss was booed at the GA GOP convention.

56 posted on 08/19/2007 7:21:11 AM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar
You offer the two very good examples of Graham being censured by the GOP and Chambliss being booed by the GOP. Or, as some would say, the Dixiecrat wing of the GOP censured and booed.

It is a deadly issue within the GOP.

At one time the dems were trying to manuever the GOP into a strident/extreme position on immigration. They stopped when they figured out that all they have to do is atay out of the GOP's way as the GOP self-destructs.

"Old Ted Kennedy bent over backwards trying to work with the GOP on immigration this past year"--------"Senator Reid, even tho he knew the GOP was trying to waste his time, allowed the GOP two shots at trying to draft a bill"

As the article and comments above point out, the dems have many options and they are well funded. Sadly, all the GOP has to rely on is abortion, queers, Mexicans, and the NAU. That's a hell of a platform.

57 posted on 08/19/2007 9:25:04 AM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: Kaslin
I've always thought the VP slot was the "on-deck" circle for the party looking toward the future ('till Cheney).

Hillary side-stepped this method as no president would have been comfortable serving his term in full body armor.

58 posted on 08/19/2007 9:41:36 AM PDT by budwiesest (I survived crossing the Folsom Rainbow bridge (built in1917) today.)
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To: Ben Ficklin
At one time the dems were trying to manuever the GOP into a strident/extreme position on immigration. They stopped when they figured out that all they have to do is atay out of the GOP's way as the GOP self-destructs.

No, the Dems have been hiding behind the WH. They know that their position doesn't jibe with the general public's, including many of their own constituents. Why do you think so many of them [16 countinhg Sanders] voted against cloture for the 2007 bill? If the Dems really wanted an immigration bill this year, they could have had one. The only way the GOP destructs is to move away from their basic principles.

Sadly, all the GOP has to rely on is abortion, queers, Mexicans, and the NAU. That's a hell of a platform.

Sounds like the Liberal agenda/constituency. Pro-choice, pro-gay, pro-open borders and legalization of illegals, and protectionism. That is not a winning agenda.

59 posted on 08/19/2007 10:13:38 AM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar
You’re like many on the far right, ideologically pure. Or, more accurately, unrealistically pure. Or, unwilling to compromise.

When you point to those dems who didn't vote for cloture, you don't realize that they are holding out for something before they compromise. Or, why the United Farm Workers would support the bill, and the AFL-CIO would oppose it.

Very simply put, the dems are in the driver's seat. And the pivot point of the compromise shifts a little to the left every time the issue comes before the Senate.

This is because the GOP is split. And immigration is not the only issue on which the GOP is split.

If you followed the debate as it was broadcast on C-Span, what were Dorgan and Saunders saying? What else do they want before they allow immigration reform to go forward?

If Bill Gates were to sit down at the table with the Communications Workers of America and make a deal, would he get his 200,000 H1B visas?

60 posted on 08/20/2007 3:42:46 AM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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