There was a point in time--when I was in law school--when we were told that Roe meant abortion was completely unregulated in the first trimester. There were a lot of cases striking down parental notification laws, and the Supreme Court had not yet clearly stated whether parental notification laws were permissible at all. Partial birth abortion was something that was not even yet being argued in the courts, but of course, we were just talking about the first trimester at that point anyway. The simple way that Roe was described was as follows: "The government can't regulate abortion in the first trimester."
You might think that is an oversimplification. At the time, it was not much of one. And if anything, the right to abortion has expanded since then. Now we are talking about the second trimester and the third trimester. Even in the third trimester, during the birth process, there is now a right to abortion.
My original point is a very simple one: Polls show that a majority favors Roe. But polls also show a majority favors regulation of abortion. You really can't do both, though. Those are inconsistent positions. What it really shows is that people don't understand Roe, and thus the poll is meaningless.
24 hour waiting period, partial birth ban, parental notification does not = unregulated. You’re speaking out of both sides of your mouth. On the one hand you said CAN’T be regulated; then on the other, you admit it is, but downplay the significance and extent. None is not the same as a little.
“You really have to be a leftwing looney to be satisfied with the level of regulation....” Nonsense. This has nothing to do with what we’re talking about. This isn’t about what I’m satisfied with. It’s about you criticizing Americans for not knowing what the holding of Roe is while mischaracterizing the holding by claiming, despite it’s plain language, and the restrictions you subsequently acknowledge exist, that the case held abortion cannot be regulated. I haven’t expressed any personal views about sufficiency and you’re simply introducing something that’s not at issue. This thread between us has been about whether Roe held that states cannot regulate abortion. That is WRONG. They can, have, and will continue to, and your only response to this FACT is to minimize the regulations you first said couldn’t and didn’t exist.
“There was a point in time—when I was in law school—when we were told that Roe meant abortion was completely unregulated in the first trimester.” Well things have changed in the past 24 yrs because I know of no one taught that. Moreover, I don’t see how anyone can ignore the plain text of the holding to arrive at that conclusion.
“My original point is a very simple one: Polls show that a majority favors Roe. But polls also show a majority favors regulation of abortion. You really can’t do both, though. Those are inconsistent positions. What it really shows is that people don’t understand Roe, and thus the poll is meaningless.”
I disagree. You can favor legalized regulated abortion. We regulate lots of legalized things from alcohol to tobacco to pollution. We already do it with abortion. The 24 hour waiting period is the best example. Sure, you can have your abortion, but you have to wait 24 hrs before doing so. That’s legalized, but regulated. I think they’re trying to do the same thing with guns (implement a waiting period).
Your gripe is with the degree of regulation, not its absence. That’s a different matter and I agree with you, it is minimally regulated and extremely difficult to regulate. I’d also agree that there is a strong movement towards abortion on demand “anytime anywhere” (Obama); however, I have faith in technology which will advance the viablity side of the equation and provide stronger ground to advocate the life side of the balance. At the end of the day, you can and we do have legalized regulated abortion; however, it’s not nearly regulated as greatly as it perhaps should be (putting aside the obvious that some would argue it shouldn’t be legal in the first place). I don’t see us so far apart on this, so long as you appreciate that there is some, albeit minimial, regulation of abortion, which is in line with Roe, despite how the case may have been perceived 24 yrs ago when it’s impact was not yet fully understood.