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'RPG penetrated IDF tank in Gaza Strip'_(merkave 3 not 4 w reac armor/shield)
j post ^ | December 13, 2007 | jpost staff

Posted on 12/12/2007 4:22:48 PM PST by Flavius

Palestinians in the Gaza Strip have managed to penetrate an IDF Merkava tank using a missile and the army is now checking if double headed anti-tank missiles have made their way to Gaza, Channel 10 reported Wednesday.

IDF tanks in northern Gaza on Wednesday. Photo: AP According to the report, the missile was fired at an IDF tank on Tuesday and its jet stream passed between the tank's soldiers, who subsequently suffered from smoke inhalation.

Details released by the IDF about the incident on Tuesday said that four soldiers had inhaled smoke and suffered minor bruises, but had not stated that the RPG had actually managed to penetrate the tank.

(Excerpt) Read more at jpost.com ...


TOPICS: Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: antitank; aps; idf; israel; merkava; rpg

1 posted on 12/12/2007 4:22:49 PM PST by Flavius
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To: Flavius

Isn’t the proper tactical solution in this scenario lots of artillery to suppress the enemy missile teams?


2 posted on 12/12/2007 4:29:48 PM PST by gura
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To: gura

If you can get past the border chartists, well wishers, good doers, dreamers and politicians.

Good luck with all that...


3 posted on 12/12/2007 4:30:59 PM PST by Flavius (24/7)
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To: Flavius
Image hosted by Photobucket.com ummm... as far as i know, ya don't get smoke or injuries inside without first you breach the hull.
4 posted on 12/12/2007 4:38:09 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist)
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To: Chode

Ummmmmm, I think that’s why the word ‘penetrated’ was used in the title...


5 posted on 12/12/2007 4:42:21 PM PST by null and void (things that are really questions are touted as answers.)
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To: Flavius

So was it a rocket or a RPG?


6 posted on 12/12/2007 4:44:37 PM PST by mountainlyons (Hard core conservative)
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To: gura
"Isn’t the proper tactical solution in this scenario lots of artillery to suppress the enemy missile teams?" The old SA-3 Sagger was the Eastern Bloc's ATGM of choice for decades...roughly analogous to our TOW, it was wire guided and needed to be flown to the target. Main gun, automatic weapon, and indirect fire, coupled with evasive maneuvering were found to be reasonably effective countermeasures by the Israelis in '73. At that time, AFAIK, no RPG warhead had been developed that could defeat the armor of most heavy MBTs (although they could certainly blow a track and achieve a mobility kill).

As I understand it, the shaped charge, chemical energy penetrators for the RPGs are a relatively recent development. Since they are essentially a "point and shoot" weapon used at much more limited ranges than a TOW or other ATGM, the traditional countermeasures are generally ineffective.

In heavily urbanized areas, tanks are also highly vulnerable to attacks on the top armor, which is generally a lot thinner than front slope or flank armor...

7 posted on 12/12/2007 4:47:23 PM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: null and void
Image hosted by Photobucket.com Details released by the IDF about the incident on Tuesday said that four soldiers had inhaled smoke and suffered minor bruises, but had not stated that the RPG had actually managed to penetrate the tank.
8 posted on 12/12/2007 4:51:35 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist)
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To: mountainlyons
everything is pointing to the RPG most likely this

A conventional RPG-7 is incapable of knocking out the Merkava tank. Parchin Missile Industries in Iran however manufactures a tandem heat warhead version of the RPG-7 which is able to stop a Merkava.

9 posted on 12/12/2007 4:53:07 PM PST by Flavius (24/7)
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To: Chode

Ah. Silly me.


10 posted on 12/12/2007 4:55:34 PM PST by null and void (things that are really questions are touted as answers.)
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To: Flavius
US intelligence is trying to identify the source of these rockets and other weapons used by Hamas.

.


11 posted on 12/12/2007 5:08:01 PM PST by Iron Munro ( (Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself.))
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To: Flavius
four soldiers had inhaled smoke and suffered minor bruises,

So, when the Palis "succeed", it is still a failure? Sounds about right.

Show the Israeli troops you care!


12 posted on 12/12/2007 5:08:42 PM PST by ApplegateRanch (If God didn't want a Liberal hanging from every tree, He wouldn't have created so much rope!)
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To: null and void
Image hosted by Photobucket.comNoProb... i had to read it a couple times as it's worded weird.
13 posted on 12/12/2007 5:08:43 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist)
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To: null and void

I hate it when that happens........:o)


14 posted on 12/12/2007 5:10:26 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: Squantos

RPG 29


15 posted on 12/12/2007 5:11:27 PM PST by IGOTMINE (1911s FOREVER!)
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To: Flavius

A regular RPG of Viet Nam era can make your ears ring for months. I would hate to be in a confined space when it went off.


16 posted on 12/12/2007 5:26:26 PM PST by mountainlyons (Hard core conservative)
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To: Flavius

Parchin sounds like a good target to me - one Cruise Missle down the stack and one through the front door.


17 posted on 12/12/2007 5:30:05 PM PST by caisson71
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To: mountainlyons

My ears are ringing from 1982(Lebanon).25 years.


18 posted on 12/12/2007 5:43:14 PM PST by QQQQ
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To: Squantos; Chode

Fortunately, I have plenty of practice...


19 posted on 12/12/2007 7:57:32 PM PST by null and void (things that are really questions are touted as answers.)
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To: null and void

LOL.....Me as well.......:o)

Stay safe !!


20 posted on 12/12/2007 8:24:08 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: mountainlyons
A regular RPG of Viet Nam era can make your ears ring for months

And get you a nice set of hearing aids from VA. I like mine.

21 posted on 12/12/2007 8:27:26 PM PST by chesty_puller (70-73 USMC VietNam 75-79 US Army Wash DC....VietNam was safer.)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

High Volume. Articles on Israel can also be found by clicking on the Topic or Keyword Israel. or WOT [War on Terror]

----------------------------

22 posted on 12/13/2007 5:31:42 AM PST by SJackson (we're gonna change the rules and have voting only on the Internet, then we're gonna win!, Ron Paul)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Somewhere I hear the saying, “the only more dangerous place to be than inside a tank, is outside the tank”.


23 posted on 12/13/2007 5:56:05 AM PST by Sender (You are the weapon. What you hold in your hand is just a tool.)
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To: Sender
"Somewhere I hear the saying, “the only more dangerous place to be than inside a tank, is outside the tank”."

One of Bill Mauldin's "Up Front" cartoons from WWII has Willie and Joe talking to a tanker and telling him they feel safer as infantrymen because, "a moving foxhole attracts too much attention."

24 posted on 12/13/2007 6:08:02 AM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Flavius
Possibly something from Iran like the SPG-9?
25 posted on 12/13/2007 6:30:34 AM PST by Eye of Unk
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To: chesty_puller
I ran over an anti-tank mine also. My hearing is ok except for he things that are not really there. At least not the kids get hearing protection for rifle practice.
26 posted on 12/13/2007 6:34:25 AM PST by mountainlyons (Hard core conservative)
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To: Chode
as far as i know, ya don't get smoke or injuries inside without first you breach the hull.
concussion damage to the diesel engine could cause smoke. Of course so could a tungsten/copper jet penetrating to the engine. Given that the Merkavas have the engine the front of the tank, where the armour is thickest, this is troubling. On the other hand, the engine is designed to be compartmentalized up front to futher protect the crew.
27 posted on 12/13/2007 12:27:14 PM PST by rmlew (Build a wall, attrit the illegals, end the anchor babies, Americanize Immigrants)
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To: Joe 6-pack

No. RPGs have been using shaped charges since the Panzershrek/Panzerfaust and Bazookas of WW2. The Soviet RPG has a number of warheads, the most common is a shaped charge in the RPG-7.


28 posted on 12/13/2007 12:29:57 PM PST by rmlew (Build a wall, attrit the illegals, end the anchor babies, Americanize Immigrants)
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To: Flavius

Penetration from the rear is the sure sign of a fagot missle.


29 posted on 12/13/2007 12:36:59 PM PST by fso301
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To: Flavius
I would suspect it was a Kornet, not the old RPG 7 that is so common in the Middle East. Syria smuggled Kornets to Hezbollah, which used them in their last war with Israel. I don’t know why they wouldn’t do the same for their Hamas buddies.
30 posted on 12/13/2007 12:37:52 PM PST by colorado tanker
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