Posted on 12/16/2007 1:01:26 PM PST by greyfoxx39
Nor did the christian curse upon the Blacks. :-)
But old Joe Smith decided it had to be a part of the Book of Mormon which is definitely not biblical. We blacks can thank Joseph Smith for making this ridiculous belief the foundation of a wannabe respectable organized religion. The Bronx cheer to lyin' Joe.
Given your limited definition of racism, that is quite likely true! :-)
You continue to make excuses for the Mormon founders' racism, blaming it on all protestants. Well that is a lie. Only the racist protestants held on to that idea. Remember that war that nearly tore our country apart almost one hundred and fifty years ago? Not all the protestants were on the same side.
I hope nothing I have said would be considered an excuse, as there is none. Pointing out the WASP's racism was merely pointing certain historical reasons by way of explanation, not excuse. WASP's racism was around long before Mormon racism. Understanding historical context points to the source, but does not justify the acceptance of such false ideas. It does also point out the inequity of singling out the Mormons.
Lamanites, Jews, and Gentiles, that pretty much covers everyone in the world. So let me rewrite your statement to show you how weak your point is. 'So you see, the Book of Mormon is written for the Lamanites, the Jews and the Gentiles everyone. So much for it being a racist book of scripture. Anyone who has read the BofM would know better.
Your rewrite shows that you understand the BofM is not racist in that is written to convince everyone that Jesus is the Christ and the Savior of the world.
If you want to argue that the Bible punished entire races and nationalities for sin, I would agree with you. These are punishments for sinful behavior that everyone who sins against God deserves.
Well, at least there is something we can agree on! :-)
Good luck with that! Don't hold your breath waiting... :-)
I thought you might like to read this considering your comments about Joseph Smith:
Elijah Abel (July 25, 1810 - December 25, 1884) was the first black elder and seventy in the Latter Day Saint movement, and one of the few black members in the early history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to receive the priesthood.
Abel was born in Maryland as a slave, and is believed to have escaped slavery on the Underground Railroad into Canada. He was baptized into the Latter Day Saint Church of Christ in September 1832 by Ezekiel Roberts, and he married Mary Ann Adams, another African American.
Abel was ordained an elder on March 3, 1836 in Kirtland, Ohio by Joseph Smith, Jr.. In December 1836, he was ordained a seventy by Zebedee Coltrin and became a “duly licensed minister of the Gospel” for missionary work in Ohio. In 1839, Abel was made a member of the Nauvoo Seventies Quorum. In Nauvoo, he worked as a mortician at the request of Joseph Smith. He was a carpenter by profession and assisted in the construction of temples in Kirtland, Nauvoo, and Salt Lake City.
In 1841, when Smith was arrested in Quincy, Illinois, Abel was among a group of seven elders who set out from Nauvoo to try and rescue him, although by the time they reached Quincy, Smith had been taken back to Nauvoo (History of the Church, 4:365).
In 1843, Abel served a mission in New York.
In 1847, he accompanied Brigham Young to Utah, where he managed a hotel. As a carpenter, he assisted in constructing the Salt Lake Temple; however, in 1853 he was barred by Young from receiving his own Endowment because he was one-eight black.
In Utah, Abel remained a seventy, and in 1884 he served a final mission in Canada, during which he became ill. He died upon his return home to Utah.
At least two of Abel’s descendants were ordained to the priesthood, his grandson being ordained an elder on September 29, 1935.
In 2002, a monument was erected in Salt Lake City over Abel’s grave site to memorialize him and his wife. The monument was dedicated by M. Russell Ballard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elijah_Abel
Ahh, so a man who has sex slaves isn't a racist? How quaint :)
Next you'll tell us that Americans fighting against the Japanese in WWII was an act of "racism" because often when the Americans cleared an island, every Japanese man, woman & child was dead at the end of those campaigns.
Don't know your history very well do you? I think I will let you wallow in ignorance : )
We believe it just that Moses desire to free the nations of the earth, and warn the righteous to save themselves from the corruption of the world; but we do not believe it right for Moses to interfere with Hebrew bond-servants, neither preach a proclamation of freedom to, nor circumcize them contrary to the will and wish of their masters, nor to meddle with or influence them in the least to cause them to be dissatisfied with their situations in this life, thereby jeopardizing the lives of men; such interference we believe to be unlawful and unjust, and dangerous to the peace of the Egyptian government allowing human beings to be held in servitude.
Are you advocating that we attack and conquer all the moslems? That is what it sounds like.
Do you know what started this thread? If you do than answer the question. If you don't then figure it out : )
Show me the reference where a revelation says that blacks are barred from the priesthood.
What, you can’t? Why am I not surprised at the depths you will stoop to.
Tenuous suppositions do not provide a reference. Unless you are proposing that Noah was Black?
Yes I enjoy putting down intolerant bigots : ) Unlike you I don't lie about things I know little about. You have a posting history as well : )
LG - What would you say about women holding the priesthood?
Elsie - Nothing; it’s not my organization.
LG - Now you are starting to get the idea :)
________________________________________________________
Elsie - I have no idea, for I’m not privy to inside information.
LG - Finally someone who agrees that they don’t know what they are talking about : )
Would you consider someone to be racist who thinks that they are Chosen by God over everyone else? Both say that.
It was David O. McKay that used this scripture as justification for racial discrimination.
20 Behold, Potiphar’s Hill was in the land of Ur, of Chaldea. And the Lord broke down the altar of Elkenah, and of the gods of the land, and utterly destroyed them, and smote the priest that he died; and there was great mourning in Chaldea, and also in the court of Pharaoh; which Pharaoh signifies king by royal blood.
21 Now this king of Egypt was a descendant from the loins of Ham, and was a partaker of the blood of the Canaanites by birth.
22 From this descent sprang all the Egyptians, and thus the blood of the Canaanites was preserved in the land.
23 The land of Egypt being first discovered by a woman, who was the daughter of Ham, and the daughter of Egyptus, which in the Chaldean signifies Egypt, which signifies that which is forbidden;
24 When this woman discovered the land it was under water, who afterward settled her sons in it; and thus, from Ham, sprang that race which preserved the curse in the land.
25 Now the first government of Egypt was established by Pharaoh, the eldest son of Egyptus, the daughter of Ham, and it was after the manner of the government of Ham, which was patriarchal.
26 Pharaoh, being a righteous man, established his kingdom and judged his people wisely and justly all his days, seeking earnestly to imitate that order established by the fathers in the first generations, in the days of the first patriarchal reign, even in the reign of Adam, and also of Noah, his father, who blessed him with the bblessings of the earth, and with the blessings of wisdom, but cursed him as pertaining to the Priesthood.
27 Now, Pharaoh being of that lineage by which he could not have the right of Priesthood, notwithstanding the Pharaohs would fain claim it from Noah, through Ham, therefore my father was led away by their idolatry;
Studying, where else?
Can anyone ELSE get this KNOWLEDGE?
Certainly, but you aren't really going to learn about Mormons from Baptist tracts are you? Or do you think the Nazi's would be a good source for learning about Jews?
Hmm, and how many Jews have been given the priesthood? Is there a revelation against the Jews having the priesthood? Your logic (an embarrassment to the term) is incredibly bad.
Is there anything that I could say that is wrong by your standard?
No.
Remember: Words mean things.
But where is your example of racism?
Or else you'd give a solid answer like you usually do, instead of relying on the Mormon approach of "You go find it; who made me your servant?"
yes
The same David O. McKay that ended racial discrimination in the Church?
Joseph Smith himself gave the priesthood to two black men and made one of them a member of the Seventy. It was Brigham Young who instituted the policy of denying Blacks the priesthood.
Were the Momorns Racist? Sure. Are some Mormon racist today? Sure. Can you name a group of people today who aren't?
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