Posted on 03/06/2008 11:29:17 PM PST by EternalVigilance
NEW ORLEANS — Sen. John McCain, in his post-victory debut before the conservative movement's top donors and leaders, will address the Council for National Policy's annual winter meeting here today.
*snip*
"Many conservative leaders did not support him, but he is a proud conservative Republican who thinks he can earn their support in the general election," Mr. [Charlie] Black added.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
So I went outside and walked around a bit, did some thinking.
My first response of “bullshit” was a bit abrupt as I considered. While your post seemed sincere.
So I come back to address your thoughtful commentary.
First, this will surprise you...I think you’re right!
Oh not right on everything but I think your discourse about conservatives not being a mighty political force as they might believe as well as Reagan being an anomoly especially in this day and age, well while I’ll not outright concede the thought, I think you have a mighty point and yes, I have given that concept much thought.
Hey, conservatism is but an idealology, very succinct in fact involving a notion of limited government, a governing base that there is a force greater than us, and strict adherence to our already established constitution which can be ammended for God’s sake.
but it’s just an idealology and conservatives across these fruited plains, those that listen to Rush and many on this forum, hey, maybe they think they are an almighty majority when the facts obviously prove them wrong.
Well I’ll allow that this may be the truth. I’ll allow that conservatives are but a minority nowadays. Perhaps a significant minority but not the majority. If conservatives were the majority, I’ll go so far as to buttress your argument, the last two elections wouldn’t have been so close even with two obvious losers like Gore and Kerry dug out of the sewer.
Now I ask my question....so?
If a conservative believes fervently in his or her idealology and does, as most of us have come on be fair here, compromise on some issues...isn’t there a line somewhere? Don’t we all have a point where we’ve just had enough, that it’s time to turn away from what’s going on and try to construct something more in keeping with our passions and beliefs?
So the Republican party, wisely or unwisely you may decide on your own, decides to incorporate some moderate views in the party platform via the candidates they select and support. The Republican party sees abortion, for example, as too volatile an issue so there are seldom candidates rancorously vowing to eliminate abortion. The Republican party, via the elected Lords in the House of Lords agrees to McCain’s ridiculous campaign finance reform, they agree to the big money spending, they agree to this and they agree to that.
Finally the nominee of the Republican party turns out to be the veritable ICON of everything disgruntled conservatives have been railing against for as long as McCain’s been reaching across that aisle as he so loves to do.
So I say...this country promotes the gathering and organizing of the like-minded. Liberals, women’s rights groups, the black caucaus...on and on and this is a fine thing. None of these groups are any majorly impressive majority in this country yet they lobby and debate and discuss their issues and try to get laws or social mores that help their cause.
Thus even if conservatives are a minority, another point I’d argue is wrong but we’ll save it till later, so why can’t they form an organization to promote their beliefs?
Many conservatives don’t think the Republican party serves that purpose at all any more and the nomination of McCain is that last damn straw.
So why can’t disenchanted conservatives just poof, resign from the Republican party, register as an independent and hey, they STILL can vote for McCain if their difficult decision so dictates. Independents can STILL send in money to Republican candidates. Independents can often vote in primary elections as a Republican for God’s sake. I see no reason why disenchanted and shat upon conservatives should remain part of the Republican party.
As for keeping the Dems out of power, well I’d agree with you on that except, go with me here, it isn’t as if McCain hasn’t reached across that aisle, slapping conservatives silly each and every time.
Why should we all of a sudden believe that McCain’s going to walk the straight and narrow, that he’s going to stop giving the Dems what they want, that he’s going to snap to attention and go conservative or even moderate for that matter?
I say resign from the Republican party, register as an Independent, vote for McCain as is your wont...or not. Hey, the Republicans will pick up moderates or disenchanted Dems; it’s McCain’s electoral strategy so I’m not convinced the pubbies will suffer. If Mccain is right, which I don’t think he is.
Then, as is often the case in this great country, perhaps conservatives will slowly start to band together. Maybe there will be meetings at the grass roots across the fruited plains. Maybe conservatives, licking their wounds, will listen to a faint bell in the distance, a waft of fresh air. Maybe another politcal party, perhaps another grand political FORCE, will arise from the rubbish of the conservative disgruntled.
And maybe they WON’T be in the majority. Again, maybe you’re right. But they’ll be a political force nonetheless and if nothing else, this conservative force will stop being so damn angry and for sure they won’t be constantly betrayed.
I was talking about the vicious hatred emanating from the anti-McCains which is so rampant and rife on every presidential race thread that one would have to be blind not to see it.
Maybe there's a "McCaniac" or two that's playing your "saturate FR with anti-McCain attacks" game. But I see no evidence of a saturation campaign by them as there's hardly anyone here that he appeals to all that much.
I read almost every candidates' thread posted on FR and I don't see any onslaught of nasty comments by those who are voting for McCain by default. This is because hardly anyone here is FOR the man, but will vote for him. So this position hardly raises the vituperative hate/bitterness emotions we're seeing from the McCain haters.
Your "get a spine" comment is trite, and your feigned lumbar superiority is of no interest to me at all.
In the ten years I've been here, I've been worked over by your betters, so your snide remarks don't effect me one bit.
Put me on a ping list and every time you see a thread by the "McCaniacs" that oozes the hatred evinced by some of the anti-McCains I'd appreciate it. It won't keep you busy at all.
Leni
>>The principles espoused are meaningful and worthwhile, but not in the presidential primaries in 2008. That race is decided
On the other hand, they apply in spades to the Senate and House. Efforts should be redoubled to insure the election of conservatives such as our own John armour aka Congressman Billly Bob.<<
I agree. I voted in the Texas primary for my own conservative US Representative, voted for John Cornyn (even though he has disappointed me sometimes), and Duncan Hunter. In the Republican precinct convention we passed unanimously some border enforcement and related resolutions that we hope will eventually influence the national platform. I am a delegate to the county convention.
Even those who don’t vote for McCain should vote for and help the best people they can find in November.
I believe you are the one that is displaying a snarky attitude.
I wasn’t being snide. If you can’t take the heat, get out of the kitchen. Isn’t that what Gramps used to say?
Here....take a valium... and call me in the morning.
G’day to ye.
Big deal. Cindy Sheehan’s son died for this country.
That doesn’t make her any less of a traitorous sleaze bag.
Please quote from my post where I stated "all should be banned for not jumping on the McCain Bandwagon".
If you want to spin I suggest you go to Disney and ride the Mad Hatter's Tea Cups ride.
Leni
Wow.....864 very well chosen words.
My objective is not to solve the problems, but to cast them in a different light.
I don’t want to over emphacize the concept of conservative minority because here on Free Republic there exist a broad variety of conservative points of view. If you take the current FR voting poll as a guide, roughly 25% form the conservative minority that has strong problems with the nominee.That is presently having strong enough views to remove themselves from the contest.
You mentioned a line and crossing the line. I can and do understand that concept. My purpose is to develop and to understand the line.
My primary thought is that there is plenty of time, lots can happen, and the possibility is likely that the 25% will be reduced considerably bu November.
I think the freepers who supported other candidates such as FRed and Huck and who are now scalded as "McCainiacs" just because they will vote for McCain due to no other intelligent choice better start speaking up or else FR will become another hate site.....and it's well on its way already if you're reading all the presidential threads here.
From what I've picked up from a couple McCainophobes in this thread your 1998 membership date means only that your sleeper cell was planted much earlier than my sleeper cell. And, we're both probably being paid.
Hard to read these things and keep a straight face or believe their is a rational mind behind them.
What are you suggesting? Third Party? You know that’s a loser.
Keyes will be announcing before long he’s moving to some obscure 3rd party as their nominee for the Presidency. Talk about a loser. Unfortunately for some intellegience doesn’t equate with the capability to make rational decisions.
Stick to your guns, farmer! The dittoheads that voted for Hillary on 3/4/08, they are the traitors. They are responsible for Hillary's resurrection.
And they dare castigate me for saying I won't vote for McCain???
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You are the one complaining, what do you want done?
Please provide us malcontents with what you consider appropriate guidelines for our posting.
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Not a bad idea, except that I can't make myself do it. I'm not sure it would mean anything if at this point he did make promises to us. Imho, it's best to look at his record to see what he is likely to do in the future.
>>It’s very simple.<<
On the contrary, it is very complex.
>>Make no mistake, we do have the power to control this situation to keep the Hildebeat and Barry out of the office as well as contain McCain.<<
I really hope that your prediction holds, but did you ever hear the expression, “Don’t underestimate your enemy?” Did you notice that many Republicans are retiring?
The founder of this forum himself has posted a lengthy and quite passionate commentary on HIS dislike of McCain.
It’s not like we’re all alone here.
I think the freepers who supported other candidates such as FRed and Huck and who are now scalded as "McCainiacs" just because they will vote for McCain due to no other intelligent choice better start speaking up or else FR will become another hate site.....and it's well on its way already if you're reading all the presidential threads here.
*******************
Good points.
I'm a Fred supporter, yet I have reached the point where, barring some future gaffe or unacceptable VP choice, I plan to cast a vote for McCain, a candidate I loathe. The thought of Hillary or Obama in the White House is my motivation. Still, I cannot make a firm promise as I don't know how I will feel when standing in front of my ballot on election day.
I would remind you that we're talking McCain here. If he's not joining the Gang of 14 he's lambasting a talk radio host for using the opposition's middle name. If it were any other moderate type of candidate I'd think you might have a point. But John McCain is known far and wide as a fine, even-tempered fellow. And he has an obsession for reaching across the aisle.
As for that poll...and your assertion...I guess we shall see.
Heh. None of us "McCainaphobes" did such a childish thing.
Look, there is no need to apologize or feel bad about it. The GOP knew with its swing leftward that this was going to happen. Some will follow the leftward move and some of us won't. That is just the way it is.
All we hear lately is about the fact that the new GOP is going to be moderates, independents and Hispanics. Supposedly conservatives are being told to shape up or take a hike.
I happen to enjoy hiking, this new relegated to irrelevant status, has offered me a wonderful opportunity to enjoy the feeling of the freedom you can have when you are a maverick!
Since this is a conservative site, not a GOP site, I don't feel bad.
If people want to vote for McCain, fine, but I am not going to shut up to appease their delicate sensitivities.:-)
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