Where ‘the handsome ones go to the leaders'

GlobeandMail.com ^ | 5/3/08 | Robert Matas

[Politicalmom]

ELDORADO, TEX. — The Yearning For Zion ranch a few miles west of nowhere was built to keep the secrets of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints hidden from prying eyes.

But the church's days of splendid isolation and impenetrable secrecy – only the top fringe of the temple's white limestone walls visible from a distant rural road at the edge of the 1,700-acre spread – are rapidly ending.

The Texas Rangers raid of the secluded ranch in early April led to sensational allegations of grooming underage girls for marriage and sexual abuse. And the discovery of a 17-year-old girl at the ranch from an FLDS community in British Columbia could expose a part of the church's life that governments on both sides of the border have long ignored.

Her parents say she had been visiting her grandmother who was living at the Texas ranch. But a weeklong Globe and Mail investigation indicates the trip may have been a ride on a little-known underground railway that takes young girls across the Canada-U.S. border – in both directions – for one purpose: to be assigned as a so-called celestial bride to FLDS men.

Flora Jessop, a former FLDS member who fled at age 16 after she was forced to marry a cousin, said the practice of “trading” young women across the border was akin to international trafficking of young women for sexual purposes.

“It happens all the time,” she said in an interview. “They are not concerned about citizenship… They just walk across on a dirt road,” she said, adding that no one ever tries to stop the border crossings.

Brenda Jensen, who was born into a polygamist FLDS family in B.C., said the insular communities require new blood “so they will not be so badly inbred.” The FLDS communities have problems from too many children marrying their close relatives, including vulnerability to a rare genetic disorder called fumarase deficiency, which causes mental retardation and possibly early death.

The girls are taken across the border quietly at night and never return, Ms. Jensen said, adding, “The handsome ones go to the leaders.”

Ms. Jensen broke away from the church at age 17. Her family had moved to an FLDS community in the U.S. three years earlier and she had been assigned to an American husband she did not want to marry. She said she does not regard the FLDS as a religion.

“This is an abusive cult.”

The religious practices of the FLDS, a breakaway sect of the Mormon church, have been in the media spotlight since the sheriff of Eldorado, accompanied by the Texas Rangers, went to the Yearning For Zion compound on April 3.

A woman, who identified herself as Sarah, had telephoned a crisis-centre hotline, saying she was a 16-year-old at the compound with an eight-month-old baby who had been forced into a marriage with an older man and had been sexually assaulted. She appealed to be rescued.

Within hours, the cry for help had morphed into possibly the biggest child-abuse case in U.S. history. The government alleges it found what appears to be a pervasive pattern of underage girls being forced to marry older men, and of sexual abuse that created an unsafe environment for children. Authorities took 463 boys and girls into custody. The court placed the children in foster care for up to 60 days while the investigation continues.

The alarming allegations reverberated through FLDS communities in several U.S. states and in Bountiful in the southeast corner of British Columbia. They were amplified by former FLDS women from those communities who said they had been sexually abused and that underage girls were often assigned to marry older men.

Rod Parker, the lawyer and spokesman for the FLDS, has told the media that the government is misrepresenting what it found at the ranch in order to justify the raid.

But Texas authorities announced that more than half of 53 girls believed to be from 14 to 17 years old were pregnant or had children. Two girls younger than 18 had three children; six had two children. Mr. Parker disputed the ages of the girls and the number who were pregnant. He pressed the government to show evidence to back up their statements.

Child-protection authorities acknowledged that they had difficulty finding information about those they apprehended. The women who left the ranch with the children gave multiple names and ages for themselves and the youngsters. Many children told child-protection workers they did not know how old they were or who their parents were.

One girl looked at her husband when an investigator asked her how old she was. “You're 18,” he said. She then answered that she was 18.

For their eyes only

The Yearning For Zion ranch sits on desolate scrubland about 10 kilometres west of Eldorado, a service town of 2,000 that caters to the county's cattle, sheep and goat ranchers and to the oil and gas industry. The compound is about 400 kilometres west of Austin.

The FLDS came to Texas in 2003 after a member of the FLDS community in Colorado City, Ariz., was convicted of bigamy and unlawful sexual conduct with a 16-year-old girl. The case was the first time in 50 years that authorities had gone after FLDS polygamists. Anticipating a crackdown on their faith, their leader, prophet Warren Jeffs, decided to move the religion's headquarters from Arizona.

The Texas compound was intended for only the most fervent adherents to the faith, handpicked by Mr. Jeffs. They were reluctant to let anyone else know what was happening at the ranch. They did not hire local people to work on construction and kept contact with residents of nearby Eldorado to a minimum.

Texans respect the right of property owners to do whatever they like on their own land, Kathy Mankin, co-publisher of the weekly Eldorado Success, said in an interview.

Nevertheless, many locals watched with increasing alarm as the sect built up the compound. Residents resorted to tracking the mammoth project from the sky, taking photos while flying over the property. The photos show several three-storey barrack-like homes, a huge glistening white temple and several other buildings on a grid-like street system. There is also a cement plant and rock quarry.

Much of it, including the massive homes and eating halls for multiple wives and countless children, is hidden behind a slope in the land, completely blocked from public view.

An attempt to walk onto the compound this week was stopped by a young man at the green metal ranch gate who said the sect's lawyer, Mr. Parker, should be contacted. Mr. Parker said neither he nor anyone else from the sect was available this week to speak in detail about the church.

The Canadian girl who was found at the Yearning For Zion compound arrived from Canada a few weeks before the raid, her parents say. The Globe is not publishing the girl's name in order to protect the privacy of a minor in foster care.

She was among the 463 boys and girls 17 years and younger apprehended by the state's Department of Family and Protective Services. She was treated by U.S. authorities as if she were an American and did not receive any special consideration because she had a Canadian birth certificate.

The social service agency obtained a court order requiring all the boys and girls, including the Canadian teen, to have DNA testing to determine their parents.

The government made DNA testing available to parents who wanted to participate.

The court also required all the minors to be placed in temporary foster care until their identity and circumstances could be clarified. Under Texas law, the court has 60 days to decide what to do with children in foster care.

Authorities have not yet looked at how the Canadian girl arrived in Texas and whether she was legally in the country. She is now at a facility on a ranch in west Texas that specializes in “healing abused children,” according to its website. Its staff is trained in shaping new behaviour.

The girl's mother said in a brief interview this week from her home in Bountiful that she has not spoken to her daughter since she was placed in foster care. But the girl's mother was optimistic.

“She is doing okay, as far as I know,” her mother said before politely refusing to answer any more questions. She anticipated she would be in contact with her daughter soon. “We're working it out,” she said.

The 17-year-old may not be the only Canadian who was apprehended at the ranch. Some people involved with the court proceedings say they heard of others but could not remember details. Mr. Parker, the lawyer for the FLDS, said in a brief interview he did not have “any real information” about Canadians at the ranch.

A source for young girls

The FLDS is well known as the religion that promotes polygamy as the path to heaven. FLDS men marry their first wife legally; they are united with additional wives only through a “celestial” marriage.

Joseph Raymond Blackmore, the father of Winston Blackmore who served as the bishop for the FLDS in B.C. from 1984 to 2002, had 34 wives. Winston Blackmore, 51, has been reported to have 26.

The religion's perspective on plural marriages has evolved over the past 50 years. Initially, men and women chose who they married. A theological shift led to a belief that the sect's leader could identify a person's eternal soulmate, and the prophet began assigning women to their husbands.

The current prophet, Warren Jeffs, introduced another twist. Based on revelations, Mr. Jeffs reassigned married women and their children, ordering them to leave their husbands – who were deemed unworthy – for other men.

Only a few men from the Yearning For Zion compound were designated to have contact with outsiders, said a mechanic in Eldorado, who spoke on condition of anonymity. “It was the same couple of guys every time,” he said, “and they always paid with cash, never wrote a cheque, always cash.”

He had heard they had bought a large John Deere tractor, also with cash. “They came with a suitcase of money,” he said.

Although he had never been in the compound, he had seen aerial photos and was impressed with the work that was done. They had large earth-moving machines and a stone quarry for limestone for their temple. They put in roadways just like the town. “I wish they would come here and fix up our roads,” he said.

In B.C., despite pressure to crack down on polygamy, a succession of provincial governments over the past 20 years have been afflicted with Hamlet-like indecision on whether to initiate legal action. As a result, the B.C. community at Bountiful continues to serve as a source for young girls for FLDS men in the U.S.

Mary Mackert, a former sixth wife in a celestial marriage, said she heard about an FLDS bishop in the U.S. who took a young Canadian girl as his second wife. In order to arrange for her U.S. immigration, the FLDS bishop divorced his first wife – whom he had legally married – and married the Canadian. She could then apply to stay in the U.S.

People travel between the FLDS communities in Canada and the U.S. all the time, she said. They get away with it, she said, because “they do not look like they are trafficking.”

[Politicalmom]

Lots of new information, including international sex trafficking.

PING!!

FReepmail to be added to the FLDS Eldorado Legal Case Ping List

[hosepipe]

Vampires feeding on women and children..
Probably Worldwide in various forms..

[Travis McGee]

Sick stuff. The perversion apologists will be along shortly to defend this child rape cult.

[epow]

Whatever happened to the legal term “statutory rape”? If those old FLDS lechers aren’t charged with statutory rape of those underage girls, then the law is worthless for protecting innocent young girls from dirty old predatory men.

[Saundra Duffy]

“A woman, who identified herself as Sarah, had telephoned a crisis-centre hotline, saying she was a 16-year-old at the compound with an eight-month-old baby who had been forced into a marriage with an older man and had been sexually assaulted. She appealed to be rescued.”

This is a lie. This woman does not exist. It was a 33-year-old nut job. Since this is a lie, maybe all the rest of this is a lie, too. I prefer not to trust the government, especially when it comes to “child protection” authorities.

I don’t know why some FReepers are obsessed with trying to justify the raid and kidnapping of helpless innocent children, terrorizing them and whisking them away from their mothers and dumping them in foster homes.

The PR machine keeps pumping out all these articles and some FReepers are falling for it hook, line and stinker.

[Doe Eyes]

You cannot be charged under Texas statutory rape laws if you are married to your underage partner.

[MrEdd]

I don’t know why some FReepers are obsessed with trying to justify the raid and kidnapping of helpless innocent children, terrorizing them and whisking them away from their mothers and dumping them in foster homes.

Because pregnant teenagers have indeed been found, and that is a fact. Because that fact exactly matches allegations cult escapees and cast offs have been making for years The government couldn't retroactively generate those allegations by insiders for PR.. Because some people here on Free Republic were abused as children, and nobody ever came to rescue them.

[Nucluside]

Knowing about some law enforcement agencies, as I do, I am prepared to accept that some of the “pre-allegations” could be hype. Waco taught us that some feds will lie about anything. What is different here is that the cult has some high powered lawyers; so charges better be pretty air tight, or the Rangers will get their asses sued off.

I’m of the opinion, albeit it humble, that a lot of the charges will stick and result in felony convictions. Rangers aren’t feds and kids shouldn’t be victimized by perverts.

[Saundra Duffy]

We seem to agree that the men at the ranch are perverted creeps. Where we part company is the rounding up of innocent children, subjecting them to God knows what terrors, dumping them in notoriously horrible foster homes, and separating them from their mothers. I think the mothers need rehabilitating but the way this was done, they are probably more scared and devastated than ever and will never be able to trust the authorities. Unfortunately, it’s a done deal. The kids are destroyed.

[GOP_Raider]

Wow, polygamy really is like communism...compelling theory, dangerous actuality.

[MrEdd]

You cannot be charged under Texas statutory rape laws if you are legally married to your underage partner.

Fixed it. Legal marriage for underage partners requires government paperwork, as well as parental consent. There is no common law marriage for under age partners in Texas.

[Oztrich Boy]

Now the CPS has saif these kids won’t be going to the notoriously horrible foster homes. (that may mean other kids will be)

[snarks_when_bored]

The male leadership of the FLDS cult appears to consist almost entirely of child-rapists and sadistic taskmasters who feel no empathy for their mostly female victims. Up until now, they must’ve thought they’d found Heaven on Earth. If there’s justice in the world, their little bit of Heaven will henceforward become a whole lot of Hell for them...

[CindyDawg]

Many of the men may have been victims themselves at one point. Can they be rehabilitated too? Remember if what has been reported is true then women were also committing crimes.

[Colofornian]

I notice that many of the U.S. mainstream media articles aren’t this thorough of an expose’. (The international media arrives & cleans their clocks!)

[Colofornian]

Wow, polygamy really is like communism...compelling theory, dangerous actuality.

Yes. Communal polygamy is socialistic communism, dictator & all. (The fLDS has been practicing what they call "placement polygamy" since 1950--where partners are strictly controlled by LDS leaders...but it actually was started by Joseph Smith, who even once demanded that all his apostles give up their wives...and people like LDS apostle Heber C. Kimball gave up his 14 yo daughter, Helen Mar Kimball, proxy-like, instead...Smith married 9 to 11 women who were already married to other men).

[Colofornian]

I think the mothers need rehabilitating but the way this was done, they are probably more scared and devastated than ever and will never be able to trust the authorities.

You are absolutely hilarious, showing absolutely no knowledge of how these kids and wives are already trained to be highly suspicious & phobic of the government by male leaders & husbands.

It's already a well-drilled propagandistic training that keeps folks on their side of the "Berlin wall" so that the other side of the wall is presented as a treacherous environment. If you really knew this daily ingrained attitude, you wouldn't be scurrying about worrying about what some months in a Texas foster home might produce where many of these foster families are indeed Christians...(especially in heavily Baptist-populated Texas).

[Colofornian]

Mary Mackert, a former sixth wife in a celestial marriage, said she heard about an FLDS bishop in the U.S. who took a young Canadian girl as his second wife. In order to arrange for her U.S. immigration, the FLDS bishop divorced his first wife – whom he had legally married – and married the Canadian. She could then apply to stay in the U.S.

Yeah, in the "golden"-olden days of mainstream Mormonist polygamy...like the 1870s thru about 1910...when Lds "couples" headed off to Canada to make it wife #2,3,4,5, etc. they didn't even bother with trying to make it "look legal." No, the Mormons of a century-plus ago wouldn't care about breaking Canadian law or U.S. law other than the risk factor. (They had a "principle" of "celestial marriage" to uphold, ya know).

[PeterFinn]

Sick stuff. The perversion apologists will be along shortly to defend this child rape cult.

Defending due process is not the same as defending criminals.

[Pebcak]

“This is an abusive cult.”

Preach it, Ms Jensen, preach it, and when the time comes, come to Texas and testify.

[Wil H]

Sick stuff. The perversion apologists will be along shortly to defend this child rape cult.

Stop complaining!

Michael Savage says it's all good..

[Paleo Conservative]

Doe Eyes:
You cannot be charged under Texas statutory rape laws if you are married to your underage partner.

MrEdd
Fixed it. Legal marriage for underage partners requires government paperwork, as well as parental consent. There is no common law marriage for under age partners in Texas.

Plus polygamy is illegal under the laws of Texas, every state in the union, and the federal government. Parents can't consent to their daughters marrying a man who is already married to another woman. Therefore all parents who gave concent to allow their daughters to "marry" a much older married "man" in the FLDS cult, actually consented to their daughters being raped. Being an accessory to statutory rape is another felony that should be prosecuted.

[Politicalmom]

Gee. Learn to read.

This is the EXACT truth:

“A woman, who identified herself as Sarah, had telephoned a crisis-centre hotline, saying she was a 16-year-old at the compound with an eight-month-old baby who had been forced into a marriage with an older man and had been sexually assaulted. She appealed to be rescued.”

It doesn’t say anything about the veracity of the claim.

[livius]

Sorry, but these people were subjected to abuse, fearful, brainwashed, in captivity, and had basically been kept enslaved. They could not freely leave the “community;” people who have tried on their own to leave these hard-line Mormon sects have been tracked down and killed by the other members.

And that’s the adults I’m talking about...the children, of course, had no chance at all to get away or even know that a world outside of their slave camp existed. There was no other way of releasing them. Now that they are freed, the legal work can begin, as it has.

[Graybeard58]

An attempt to walk onto the compound this week was stopped by a young man at the green metal ranch gate who said the sect's lawyer, Mr. Parker, should be contacted.

About the only part of what they have done that I agree with. Keeping nosy reporters off private property.

[Graybeard58]

I don’t know why some FReepers are obsessed with trying to justify the raid and kidnapping of helpless innocent children, terrorizing them and whisking them away from their mothers and dumping them in foster homes.

At least you seemed to have dropped the part about "tanks and taking children at the point of a gun".

[semantic]

Plus polygamy is illegal under the laws of Texas, every state in the union, and the federal government.

The polygamy angle is a diversion from the true horror of this story. Since none of the 1+ "wives" were legally married, the "relationships" with other women girls where no different than what takes place in any inner-city in the US (or elsewhere).

The difference, of course, are the victims' ages, which is why the focus of legal charges will be statutory rape. As you say, this extends to both conspiracy, aiding & abetting, etc, etc -> all felonies that could well bring life terms.

Who wants to bet that none of the fathers volunteer for DNA testing? They'll have to get samples based on other charges, then roll them over to the meat of the case.

[commonguymd]

It is sad, but I think the resentment is deeper. Some are still fighting against Romney for whatever reasons and of course some are fighting to force their ideology and religion on others as theirs is the only approved religion. There are some serious problems with these groups that appear to thwart the law according to reports however, and there is a history of underage marriages, statutory rape and polygamy. The wholesale taking of the children has some people concerned about individual rights and religious persecution. Apparently from other reports, they have had an informant on the inside of this group for four years and it took a Colorado woman with a history of crank calls to get action. I find that interesting and possibly damaging to the legalities of the wholesale rounding up of all the children into government social services protection.

I am watching for facts and kind of laughing at the hysterics going on here and lifting a brow to the accusations flying from a small group bent on standing as the holier then thou judge jury and executioners.

[Congressman Billybob]

Yes, the original caller has been identified as a hoax, and arrested. However, the Texas Rangers got a subsequent search warrant for the "raid." There is enough information out there to conclude that sexual and other abuse of young girls and boys was endemic, not merely episodic, at this compound.

No, this is not a lie. This is very real. This is child abuse on a massive and international scale. Why you feel a need to write it off, is puzzling.

Congressman Billybob

Latest article, "Lesley Stahl vs. Antonin Scalia in the Court of Public Opinion"

Help a Freeper into Congress.

[mouser]

She was among the 463 boys and girls 17 years and younger apprehended by the state's Department of Family and Protective Services. She was treated by U.S. authorities as if she were an American and did not receive any special consideration because she had a Canadian birth certificate.

The social service agency obtained a court order requiring all the boys and girls, including the Canadian teen, to have DNA testing to determine their parents.

So the story of no birth certificates is not true.

And the story of DNA must be done because no birth certificates to prove parents is also looking a bit less than true.

[commonguymd]

In many respects with regards to discussion purposes, this has moved from FLDS to attacks on Mormons and the LDS. There are Mormons on this site that take offense to people jumping from the letter A to the letter Z. Anyone questioning tactics or having concerns on legalities is labeled and I think that is where some defensiveness is coming. There are many concerned about big brother, due process, procedure and the scope, but they are vilified in doing so.

Innocent until proven guilty is a baseline in this country, some adhere to it. Guilt by association is a precedent in this operation that should bring pause to everyone, but that seems inconsequential and unimportant as long as it is for the children. The foster care system in Texas has a suspect history as has been documented here in these numerous threads and that brings additional concern.

Some are waiting and watching threads for facts to come out. The hysterics and rumors are being posted as facts. One example was the number of boys taken (among all the children being taken out) in the operation being none, then 25. We find now that was wrong, but anyone questioning it was endorsing bad behavior. Another on the other side is tanks rolling in and guns being drawn - there is no evidence of that beyond an armored personnel carrier being on the scene.

[epow]

Thanks for the explanation of TX Law. It seems to me that TX can prosecute the men who have in effect raped their teenage “brides” if it decides to. If girl was under the age of consent at the time she was “married” and the man was already married to another wife under the laws of TX or another state, then the so-called marriage can’t be legal even if the girl’s parent(s) gave consent. If the girl was too young to consent to a sexual relationship and the couple are not legally married, it seems logical to me that those circumstances would amount to the crime of statutory rape.

[commonguymd]

Therein lies a problem the sect has. They can allow parental consent marriages under current law within guidelines, but they have to be legal marriages. Just assuming marriage in the church isn’t legal. This will be one way, if the findings aren’t thrown out, to prosecute any offending individuals.

[greyfoxx39]

some are fighting to force their ideology and religion on others as theirs is the only approved religion.

The Church’s missionary program is one of its most recognized characteristics. Mormon missionaries can be seen on the streets of hundreds of major cities in the world as well as in thousands of smaller communities.

The missionary effort is based on the New Testament pattern of missionaries serving in pairs, teaching the gospel and baptizing believers in the name of Jesus Christ (see, for example, the work of Peter and John in the book of Acts). More than 50,000 missionaries are serving missions for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints at any one time. Most are young people under the age of 25, serving in nearly 350 missions throughout the world.

Link

[greyfoxx39]

And the story of DNA must be done because no birth certificates to prove parents is also looking a bit less than true.

Source? Link?

[greyfoxx39]

Flying Inman Ping

Don't forget, for all kinds of source links and info, check out the FLDS Daily Thread.

HERE

[mouser]

The social service agency obtained a court order requiring all the boys and girls, including the Canadian teen, to have DNA testing to determine their parents.

This line is from the story you could also go to the court order for DNA to be taken and read it not sure exactly what you want.

[greyfoxx39]

You stated: "And the story of DNA must be done because no birth certificates to prove parents is also looking a bit less than true.

I'm interested in what source gives you the idea that the story of checking the DNA because of no recorded, legal birth certificates to prove parentage so that children are not released to non-parents, is "looking less than true."

That would be quite a development and should be sourced.

[narses]

Since this is a lie, maybe all the rest of this is a lie, too.

Logic wan't your best class, was it? Your LDS apologia for child rape gets old Saundra. Pregnant teens are fact. Polygamy is an undisputed factual part of FLDS practice (and LDS history).

[commonguymd]

I was talking about here. I have no problem with missionary work. The churches I have belonged to have done a lot of missionary work. I know some would prefer that only their religion do work like this.

[mouser]

I'm interested in what source gives you the idea that the story of checking the DNA because of no recorded, legal birth certificates to prove parentage so that children are not released to non-parents, is “looking less than true.”

all through this the story is there are no documents the main one always mentioned is the birth certificates now we have one Canadian girl with a birth certificate and they still want her DNA

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2010672/posts

The FLDS are “being told that the birth certificates and Utah driver licenses are ‘faked documents’ and they are lying about their legal name, age and residency,” Jessop’s letter states.
post 4 of the above link this makes it appear the Texas officials are not accepting the birth certificates and drivers license from another state.
granted this is not in a court record but a heck of a lot of the stuff here is not either.
time will tell but it looks more and more like their reason for wanting DNA is not as stated.

[Virginia Ridgerunner]

The kids are destroyed.

Yep, they look destroyed to me:

And for your daily Joe Smith reading:

"Come on! ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell, boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! for I will come out on top at last. I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet...When they can get rid of me, the devil will also go."Joseph Smith (History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 408, 409)

And for your daily scripture:

"Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph... if any man espouse a virgin, and desire to espouse another, and the first give her consent, and if he espouse the second, and they are virgins, and have vowed to no other man, then is he justified; he cannot commit adultery... And if he have ten virgins given unto him by this law, he cannot commit adultery... therefore is he justified." (Doctrine and Covenants, Section 132, verses 1, 61-62)

[Virginia Ridgerunner]

The problem with ‘Due Process’ in this case is that Jeffs and his minions have quite cleverly created an elaborate shell game to defeat it based on deceit and a long-time FLDS tradition of shuffling individual women and children around, not only on his compounds, but those in Canada and Mexico as well. The women don’t even know whose children are whose.

[greyfoxx39]

You stated:some are fighting to force their ideology and religion on others as theirs is the only approved religion.

IIRC, I have never seen any claims of having the "true religion" on FR from anyone except mormons, and no one has tried to "force" their ideology on anyone. Providing factual information and pointing out fallacies is not "forcing".

BTW, if you care to see an example of "forced ideology" used in a religion, consider the mormon practice of denying the presence of a parent at a child's wedding unless certain "worthiness requirements" including paying a full tithe are met.

So, do you feel that "missionary work" should be allowed on FR from only the sources you approve? There have been many attempts to censor opposition to mormonism on FR. They haven't succeeded. Are you part of the "free speech for me but not for thee" crowd?

[greyfoxx39]

The FLDS are “being told that the birth certificates and Utah driver licenses are ‘faked documents’ and they are lying about their legal name, age and residency,” Jessop’s letter states. post 4 of the above link this makes it appear the Texas officials are not accepting the birth certificates and drivers license from another state. granted this is not in a court record but a heck of a lot of the stuff here is not either. time will tell but it looks more and more like their reason for wanting DNA is not as stated.

The FLDS are “being told that the birth certificates and Utah driver licenses are ‘faked documents’ and they are lying about their legal name, age and residency,” Jessop’s letter states.

If that is your source, a statement made by the FLDS, OK.

How you come to the conclusion that any of this is evidence that "this is not in a court record but a heck of a lot of the stuff here is not either. time will tell but it looks more and more like their reason for wanting DNA is not as stated." is beyond me, and I imagine beyond many.

[commonguymd]

Well, I believe in freedom of religion period. I don’t mind people preaching at me, but I usually glaze over when someone tries to tell me another religion is this that and the other thing. I already belong to a church. I don’t think missionary work is necessary on FR, and certainly adverse missionary work by denigrating other religions.

[foreshadowed at waco]

Since only the 1st wife is legal, all the other celestial wives are technically unwed mothers who get welfare and food stamps from the taxpayers...not our business?...surely you jest...can you say ‘welfare fraud’

[commonguymd]

I have not seen any proof that they were getting welfare. I know it is alleged and has been in other cases similar, but in this particular sect I have yet to see anything on that.

[greyfoxx39]

I don’t think missionary work is necessary on FR, and certainly adverse missionary work by denigrating other religions.

There is missionary work going on every day by the mormons on FR..check the religion forum. And this is what the founder of mormonism said:

 19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all ^awrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those ^bprofessors were all ^ccorrupt; that: “they ^ddraw near to me with their lips, but their ^ehearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the ^fcommandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the ^gpower thereof.”

  20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself ^alying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, ^bmother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother, “I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.” 

  Joseph Smith

So, when you make a generalized statement like "Some are still fighting against Romney for whatever reasons and of course some are fighting to force their ideology and religion on others as theirs is the only approved religion.", in sympathy with a mormon proselytizer, be prepared to be informed.