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Senate backs 'urban legend'
The Press-Register ^ | May 6, 2008 | Brian Lyman

Posted on 05/07/2008 5:44:43 AM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks

MONTGOMERY The state Senate may have been locked down for most of the year, but it did find time to endorse a widely discredited urban legend spread by the John Birch Society.

The upper chamber passed a joint resolution April 10 sponsored by state Sen. Rusty Glover, R-Semmes, claiming that Canada, Mexico and the United States are moving toward a "North American Union" and working on construction of a "NAFTA Superhighway" to link the countries and report edly destroy their sovereignty.

"It's about retaining independence," said John McManus, the president of the John Birch Society, in a phone interview Mon day. "If we merge with Canada and Mexico, we are no longer an independent nation."

The John Birch Society is a far-right-wing organization established in 1958 as a hardline anti-communist group. Its founder, Robert Welch, once called President Dwight Eisenhower "a dedicated agent of the Communist conspiracy." The group has often warned of alleged threats to U.S. liberty and sovereignty, and has historically opposed the United Nations as a sign of a world government.

In the case of the purported North American Union, the society has circulated model resolutions for introduction in state legislatures and assemblies. Glover's resolution incorporates one paragraph from the John Birch Society resolution verbatim.

Experts from the White House to snopes.com, a popular urban legend Web site, say no such union is in the offing. The 2005 Security and Prosperity Partnership, often cited by conspiracists as proof of the plans afoot, is an agreement between the three countries to cooperate on issues of common concern, from energy security to health-related issues.

(Excerpt) Read more at al.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Canada; Government; Mexico; News/Current Events; US: Alabama; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: al; alabama; alhouse; alsenate; canada; icecreammandrake; johnbirchsociety; markcross; mexico; naftasuperhighway; nationalsovereignty; nau; northamericanunion; preciousbodilyfluids; purityofessence; resolutions; rickperry; robertwelch; ronpaul; rustyglover; sapandimpurify; snopes; spp; texas; transtexascorridor; ttc; tx; txdot; unitedstates; urbanlegend; us; usa; virgilgoode; votenader2008
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1 posted on 05/07/2008 5:44:43 AM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
The conservative movement will never get back on track if the conspiracy-mongering lunatic fringe captures the party the way it did in 1964.

We need another Reagan, not another Goldwater.

2 posted on 05/07/2008 5:46:32 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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To: wideawake

In before the link to CFR!


3 posted on 05/07/2008 5:47:24 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

In before the Masonic Conspiracy theorists!


4 posted on 05/07/2008 5:49:10 AM PDT by CholeraJoe (I follow the Last Time Lord)
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To: wideawake

In the new, improved, updated “Chinese Zodiac”, this is The Year of the Loon.


5 posted on 05/07/2008 5:51:09 AM PDT by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: CholeraJoe

Don’t forget the link to the Illuminati!


6 posted on 05/07/2008 5:51:13 AM PDT by Ken522
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
I wish posters would put the state in the title.
There are many Montgomerys.

That to the side, who cares if they do this?
If it is, as most here believe, all an urban myth, then no harm to affirm that we don't want America to be part of an American/Mexican union, unlike McCain's hispanic outreach director.

7 posted on 05/07/2008 5:52:31 AM PDT by bill1952 (I will vote for McCain if he resigns his Senate seat before this election.)
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To: wideawake
We need another Reagan, not another Goldwater.

"Extremism in the pursuit of liberty -- hell, lifting a finger in the pursuit of liberty -- is a vice." --the motto of modern "conservatism"

8 posted on 05/07/2008 5:54:18 AM PDT by steve-b (The "intelligent design" hoax is not merely anti-science; it is anti-civilization. --John Derbyshire)
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To: 1rudeboy; CholeraJoe; ArrogantBustard; Ken522

You’re all wrong!!!

It’s the Shapeshifting Reptilian Aliens, come to drink our blood!

(Enter David Ickes, stage faaaar left.)


9 posted on 05/07/2008 5:55:25 AM PDT by shibumi (".....panta en pasin....." - Origen)
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To: All

There is no such thing as the North American Super Corridor;

http://www.nascocorridor.com/default.asp


10 posted on 05/07/2008 5:58:18 AM PDT by RDasher
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

The JBS did accurately nail Fidel before anyone else did and that’s their claim to fame. Also John Stormer’s None Dare Call It Treason came across as pretty reasonable not some wild-eyed fanaticism; I found it very infuential.


11 posted on 05/07/2008 6:01:16 AM PDT by Chi-townChief
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To: wideawake
Do you really doubt that there is an effort under way to increase trade and travel between Mexico, the US, and Canada, in part to offset the economic damage done to us by the EU?

While there may not be a bunch of top-hatted executives and politicians in smoky back rooms planning a new nation of the three, open borders are tantamount to an EU.

Allowing Mexican truckers into the US without having to abide by US rules and regulations is one step in that direction. Amnesty is another. Loosening of “guest worker” regulations is another.

This isn't a conspiracy theory. It isn't even a theory. This is happening.

12 posted on 05/07/2008 6:02:24 AM PDT by Ghost of Philip Marlowe (If Hillary is elected, her legacy will be telling the American people: Better put some ice on that.)
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To: steve-b
"Extremism in the pursuit of liberty -- hell, lifting a finger in the pursuit of liberty -- is a vice." --the motto of modern "conservatism"

Inventing conspiracy theories contributes absolutely nothing to the defense of liberty.

I would also argue that endorsing Gerald Ford over Ronald Reagan in 1976 - as Goldwater did - contributed absolutely nothing to the defense of liberty either.

Goldwater, McManus, Paul and the rest of their ilk = big talkers, small doers.

13 posted on 05/07/2008 6:02:50 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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To: RDasher
I've always been amused by that line-of-thinking: imagine someone who says there's no NASC, then point to NASCO's own website to disprove it.

As far as being the stuff of which conspiracy theories are made, it's not even that creative.

14 posted on 05/07/2008 6:04:59 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Ghost of Philip Marlowe
Allowing Mexican truckers into the US without having to abide by US rules and regulations is one step in that direction.

Are you the guy who told us Mexican trucks have no brakes?

15 posted on 05/07/2008 6:06:02 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

Don’t forget the Trilateral Commission ...they are behind everything. (satire)


16 posted on 05/07/2008 6:07:22 AM PDT by The Great RJ ("Mir we bleiwen wat mir sin" or "We want to remain what we are." ..Luxembourg motto)
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To: Ken522
Don’t forget the link to the Illuminati!

Got it covered!

17 posted on 05/07/2008 6:11:20 AM PDT by Tribune7 (How is inflicting pain and death on an innocent, helpless human being for profit, moral?)
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To: The Great RJ
Don’t forget the Trilateral Commission ...they are behind everything. (satire)

Nope, that's the Bildeberger's... if you are going to have an all powerful, global conspiracy, at least get it right! :-)

18 posted on 05/07/2008 6:12:32 AM PDT by Turbo Pig (...to close with and destroy the enemy...)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
"It's a just-in-case-type of thing," Glover said. "If (Congress) had any thoughts, we're urging them not to."

Someone (s) went to a lot of trouble with maps etc. for a non-event.

19 posted on 05/07/2008 6:13:29 AM PDT by yoe ( Socialism with Obama or Clinton - Democracy with McCain)
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To: Chi-townChief
Also John Stormer’s None Dare Call It Treason

Gary Allen's "None Dare Call It Conspiracy" was on the money when I read it circa 1980, and was a great counterbalance to the what I was being fed in my education and through the media.

20 posted on 05/07/2008 6:14:36 AM PDT by Tribune7 (How is inflicting pain and death on an innocent, helpless human being for profit, moral?)
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To: wideawake
The conservative movement will never get back on track if the conspiracy-mongering lunatic fringe captures the party the way it did in 1964.

Check out the EU history. It was a long slog to where they are today. A North American union is in the cards but will take decades. GW Bush open borders with Mexico is just the first stage. Clinton pushes NAFTA was baby steps. We now run a 40 billion dollar trade deficit with Mexico. Before NAFTA we ran a surplus

You want a North American Union?---
Allow in millions upon millions of Mexicans and anchor babies to invade.
The Mexican American hacks who are at the top in bankrupt California are in Mexico for a few days of meetings with the top Mexican government officials

Not to mention all the Central American invaders (plus anchor babies) we have allowed to stay here

21 posted on 05/07/2008 6:15:31 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: Ghost of Philip Marlowe
Do you really doubt that there is an effort under way to increase trade and travel between Mexico, the US, and Canada, in part to offset the economic damage done to us by the EU?

The whole point of economic freedom is to encourage commerce in goods and services.

While there may not be a bunch of top-hatted executives and politicians in smoky back rooms planning a new nation of the three, open borders are tantamount to an EU.

(1) Our border with Canada is now tighter than it has been in generations.

(2) Our border with Mexico has been effectively unenforced for 20 years.

Allowing Mexican truckers into the US without having to abide by US rules and regulations is one step in that direction.

Except that isn't happening.

Amnesty is another.

That hasn't happened either. And we already had an amnesty, yet we are not governed by a council in Brussels.

Loosening of “guest worker” regulations is another.

EU residents aren't guest workers in any EU country they are in.

This isn't a conspiracy theory. It isn't even a theory. This is happening.

Except, of course, that it isn't.

22 posted on 05/07/2008 6:16:18 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
Well, the John Birchers also believe that we breathe air and eat food. Does their belief discredit that notion that we all have physical needs?

This story is slander by spurious association. False lights.

23 posted on 05/07/2008 6:17:23 AM PDT by bvw
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

I’m going to have to go with Jerome Corsi on this one. The NAU is not fiction but fact.


24 posted on 05/07/2008 6:18:17 AM PDT by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: dennisw
OK, dennisw, I get it. You don't like brown people but you do like mercantilism.
25 posted on 05/07/2008 6:19:37 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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To: dennisw
We now run a 40 billion dollar trade deficit with Mexico

Honest question. Mexico is our #2 supplier of oil. How much of that $40 billion is directly attributable to the importation of Mexican oil?

26 posted on 05/07/2008 6:19:49 AM PDT by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: wideawake

We saw that fringe on display at the OK State Convention.

There are members of OK Women’s Groups that have gone to picket the NAFTA Superhighway when Texas is talking about the Trans Corridor. What Texas does with their highway system has no bearing on Oklahomans except if you are in Austin and want to get to Houston, a new highway would be my recommendation.

Conspiracy theories abound in OK by the fringe of the religious right who have thrown in with the Ron Paul types. They don’t mind breaking Rules if it suits their agenda. What other State had a Vice Chair of their State recruiting delegates that would vote against the nominee on the first ballot if certain nominees were selected even though we are a winner take all state? You should have seen the crap that is our Platform passed with no chance for comment or some of the handouts. These fringe people make the rest of us look bad if we let them.


27 posted on 05/07/2008 6:20:22 AM PDT by PhiKapMom ( Broken Glass Republican -- http://democratsforsale.blogspot.com/ -- JUST SAY NO to OBAMA)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/PhyllisSchlafly/2008/04/14/north_american_union_conspiracy_or_cover-up


28 posted on 05/07/2008 6:24:02 AM PDT by School of Rational Thought (Truthism Watch)
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To: 1rudeboy

Is this the story to which you refer? I experienced this personally, so it’s NOT just another anecdote.

I was on jury duty the week of 12/11/06 and one of my fellow jurors told me that her nephew was killed a year earlier by two illegals DRIVING their truck with FAULTY BRAKES to the BRAKE SHOP to be repaired when – surprise, surprise — the BRAKES FAILED AND THEY KILLED HER NEPHEW. I guess these MORONS thought they were back in Mexico where – in addition to driving DRUNK — they and their idiot friends do crap like that all the time. Can you say “Tijuana Taxi?” Can you say “TOW TRUCK?”

The driver got 4 years in prison and will be deported when he gets out.

Gotta wonder how long it will take him to sneak back in and kill someone else?
Estimates indicate they are killing around 25 American citizens each day, either with vehicles or via other criminal activity.

I can’t wait until the interstates start filling up with Mexican truckers on tight deadlines – and I do mean DEADlines – hurtling at carloads of unsuspecting native-born American citizens – all 387 of us.

Do you suppose this crap might stop if one of Bush’s daughters became a victim?

Of course, unlike the rest of us, they are driven to their endless round of parties by an armed SS detail, which eliminates the risk that they will be tempted to drive drunk themselves or be mugged or raped.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_zCpQZ-H94


29 posted on 05/07/2008 6:25:18 AM PDT by Dick Bachert (INCENT)
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To: Phantom Lord
Our 2007 trade deficit with Mexico was $74 billion. Oil and oil product imports were about $34 billion.
30 posted on 05/07/2008 6:27:56 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Why are doom and gloomers, union members and liberals so bad at math?)
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To: Dick Bachert
Yes, it is an anecdote and frankly irrelevant, unless you are suggesting that a Mexican trucking company (or an American-owned Mexican firm) is willing to jump through all the hoops to get USDOT certification, and is willing to throw it all away by operating a "Tijuana Taxi."

The "illegal alien" driver should be a tip-off.

31 posted on 05/07/2008 6:29:23 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: dennisw
And now we must add the ELITES – and elite wannabes -- in the Senate de Estados Unitos to the list of those who have sold out our formerly sacred birthright.

As early as 12 years ago, when he was my representative, I was a regular at Newt’s Town Hall Meetings where I spoke in support of the FairTax. 70% or more of the others who took the mike were visibly ANGRY ABOUT THE FAILURE TO STOP THE GROWING FLOW OF ILLEGALS! (While he DID and probably still DOES support the illegal invasion, at several sessions – clearly pandering to the crowd -- Newt suggested the 100,000 IRS agents be given weapons and sent down to the border with Mexico.) That certainly works for me.

Under Bush, that flow became a TORRENT!

He CLEARLY doesn’t care WHAT we think!

DO TRY TO GET THAT MEMORY OVER THE TRADITIONAL 20 NANOSECOND LEVEL AND HOLD THE THOUGHT THROUGH NOVEMBER ’08!

In ABSTRACT terms, this is the conspiratorial view of what’s going on vis-à-vis the INVASION of the illegals here:

The current alien invasion from the south serves BOTH the elites who run Mexico – and many of the OTHER states of Central and South America -- and the political ruling class who increasingly run the United States:

· It takes pressure off the 60 or so families who control approximately 80% of the wealth in Mexico. Without the northern “safety valve” (the United States) for their poor, those poor MIGHT be inclined to do what America’s early colonists found it necessary to do: Revolt! Parenthetically, that would be MY suggestion for them: Instead of fleeing here – and converting “here” to a larger, more poverty infested version of “there,” they ought to stay there and make “there” into their version of “here,” whatever that would be. Revolutions ARE messy and there are no guarantees that they will produce the desired result. But – according to one T. Jefferson – they are often necessary. Never forget that THIS country was born in revolution!

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson ·

· For the NAFTA/CAFTA coveting US national ruling class – especially those who, in varying degrees, quest after some sort of One-World utopia run by guess who? – it provides yet another level of insecurity and tension among the indigenous populace which can be used to justify new and more draconian limits to freedom here. Instead of securing the borders, allow millions of illegals to come in and when the natives become alarmed, require a national ID card. “Your papers, please!” will soon become a phrase familiar to all. It’s Mr. Franklin’s trade of freedom for (false) security. It’s also the time-tested Hegelian Dialectic the One-Worlders have successfully worked like a rented mule.

While they occasionally squabble among themselves, the elites of history have ALL had one thing in common: They will do ANYTHING to remain in charge. And throughout that history, except for the 230 year-old experiment in freedom called “America,” most of the men who have walked the earth have lived as slaves to these elites whether they call themselves kings, emperors, potentates, sultans, czars – or presidents.

Get ready, folks. Unless some SERIOUS changes are made and the handful of Americans who CARE about liberty get involved, that history will almost certainly repeat here.

Now for the SPECIFICS of the matter:

My take on Bush's role in all of this is:

1. His long and apparently positive experience with the large hispanic population in Texas is largely responsible for his inaction on this alien invasion. And why wouldn't HIS experience with them be positive as he traveled in the highest, best-educated circles among them, not the Hispanic gangbangers and pine-straw spreaders...

2. Boy Jorge Bush was cared for by a Hispanic nanny for many years while his daddy was running Zapata Oil (into the ground).

3. His brother Jeb is married to a native of Mexico (the daughter of a migrant worker) and his nieces and nephews are mixed blood. And before you scream "ethnocentric bigot" at me, there's nothing inherently wrong with that. But that fact -- and items 1 and 2 – DO predispose him to a warm and fuzzy feeling for folks from south of the Rio Grande.

And if -- in some strange and metastasizing American desire for a new royal family dynasty -- Jeb or his son should win the White House in some future presidential beauty contest designed to divert the American electorate every four years, I'd bet that HIS activities toward this alien invasion will make W's behavior look like a warm-up exercise.

Any vestige of Western European culture -- the culture MY great-grandparents and probably yours brought here after standing in line at places like Ellis Island, being interrogated, deloused and recorded -- will be a distant memory – IF it’s remembered at all.

32 posted on 05/07/2008 6:29:47 AM PDT by Dick Bachert (INCENT)
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To: wideawake

You don’t like white people-— see how easy that was?


33 posted on 05/07/2008 6:30:21 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Thanks.


34 posted on 05/07/2008 6:32:17 AM PDT by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: 1rudeboy

Please turn on your sarcasm detector.


35 posted on 05/07/2008 6:32:41 AM PDT by RDasher
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To: 1rudeboy

I sincerely hope one of YOUR loved ones is not some day among the 25 or so being killed each day by illegals/illegal activities.

Here’s ANOTHER story for you.

My wife and I recently watched “Waitress,” a clever and sweet little film written and directed by Adrienne Shelly. Shelly was A VERY talented lady who also played a supporting role.

She was senselessly MURDERED in her NY apartment on November 1, 2006. Her body was found hanging by a sheet from a shower rod – by her husband. She was 40 and left behind a 3 year-old daughter who will never know her real mother.

A 19 YEAR OLD ECUADORIAN — AN ILLEGAL WHO SHOULD NEVER HAVE EVEN BEEN IN THE COUNTRY IN THE FIRST PLACE (THANK YOU CLINTON AND BUSH) — CONFESSED TO HER MURDER.

They are killing 25 of us every day.

IT WILL STOP WHEN THE MORONS IN WASHINGTON GET AS SERIOUS ABOUT THE ILLEGAL INVASION AS THEY ARE ABOUT HARASSING NATIVE BORN CITIZENS AT THE AIRPORTS.

(AND, YES, I INTENDED TO SHOUT BECAUSE I’M MAD AS HELL AND NOT GONNA TAKE ANY MORE THIS CRAP!)

How about you???

Do you suppose this madness might have ended years ago if one of Bush’s daughters had been a victim of one of the millions of illegals he’s allowed in here to kill the rest of us?

Of course, any illegal attempting to do so would most likely be taken out by her SS detail.

I’ve been a regular at local congressional town hall meetings for a few dozen years and noted that starting around 10 years ago, the majority of those there were angry that nothing was being done about the illegal invasion.

Why are we still waiting for the clowns in Malfunction Junction – who can produce convoluted legislative proposals to line their pockets or deliver pork back home and ram it through in the dark of night – to secure our national borders?

Perhaps YOU should get on over to those pre-election public meetings and raise some serious hell – before YOU die at the hands of someone who ought not even BE HERE!

We have enough indigenous criminals. WE SURE AS HELL DON’T NEED TO IMPORT MORE.


36 posted on 05/07/2008 6:34:17 AM PDT by Dick Bachert (INCENT)
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To: Phantom Lord

Honest question. Mexico is our #2 supplier of oil. How much of that $40 billion is directly attributable to the importation of Mexican oil?
_____________________

You have a point there. Probably lots of it is an oil trade deficit.

Mexico is so screwed up their oil output is declining because they do very lousy exploration and will not allow any American company to explore there. PEMEX is Mexico’s government run oil monopoly


37 posted on 05/07/2008 6:36:44 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: Toddsterpatriot

I know that formal FR econ-thread rules prohibit us from talking about services (because they don’t create wealth or some such nonsense) when taking about the trade deficit, but we should still distinguish between goods and services, lest people think we have a deficit there as well. :)


38 posted on 05/07/2008 6:37:07 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Dick Bachert

I’m not for the importation of criminals, either. Nor am I particularly susceptible to appeals to emotions. That would make me a lib.


39 posted on 05/07/2008 6:39:16 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Dick Bachert

All true!! Of course!


40 posted on 05/07/2008 6:40:10 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

As if it matters what the population wants.


41 posted on 05/07/2008 6:41:34 AM PDT by The Toll
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To: wideawake
The NAU is one of those things that will evolve via fait accompli. Once amnesty is passed and much of the country is full of Spanish speaking people who have as much, if not more, loyalty to Mexico than to America, we'll be told it's a fait accompli. "Hey, a large part of the country regards America and Mexico as being one nation already, why not make it official?"

This is how we got into this immigration mess in the first place. We were assured in 1965 that the new immigration law wouldn't change America's demographics, and that only extremists and conspiracy mongers like the Birchers thought that would happen. Then, a couple of decades later, we were suddenly told that America's demography had changed. It was a fait accompli. There's nothing we can do about it, we were told, so let's celebrate it and say it's a great thing that we're becoming more "diverse".

About the same time we were promised that we would never, ever, ever, allow tens of millions of illegal aliens to sneak into our nation. We were encouraged to pass a law to give three million existing illegals citizenship, in return for a vague pledge to seal the borders later. Only conspiracy-mongers suggested that this bill was a dangerous precedent. Everyone else smirked that America would never leave its borders unprotected. But we did, and now we're told it's a fait accompli. There are 12 million or 20 million illegals here, and, golly gee, we can't deport that many, so I guess we'll just have to give them a "pathway to citizenship". Oh, and we can't break up families, either, so I'll guess we'll have to let them bring their loved ones here as well.

So sometime in two or three decades, when entire large chunks of our nation are dominated by Spanish-speakers and represented in Congress by La Raza types, and pandered to by national politicians, we'll be told that the merger of the U.S. and Mexico is already a done deal. We're already merged de facto, so what's the big deal about making it de jure?

This is a common liberal tactic and it works all the time in many variations. For example, they sexualize teens and then want to give them condoms and secret abortions because, hey, they're gonna do it anyway. They demand same-sex "marriage", settle for "civil unions" as a supposed compromise, and then tell us that there's no real difference between the two, so we may as well elevate the unions to "marriages". It works like a charm.

42 posted on 05/07/2008 6:48:19 AM PDT by puroresu (Enjoy ASIAN CINEMA? See my Freeper page for recommendations (updated!).)
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To: wideawake
Yeah, jeez. It isn't like they were responding to some great "scientific consensus" like global warming.

I guess it is all in what 'myths' you want to embrace.

So tell me again, where's the fence?

43 posted on 05/07/2008 7:12:45 AM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly.)
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To: wideawake
Inventing conspiracy theories contributes absolutely nothing to the defense of liberty.

The list of conspiracy theories invented by Senator Goldwater seems to have been truncated from your post. I'm sure you'll be back forthwith to correct that omission.

44 posted on 05/07/2008 7:28:01 AM PDT by steve-b (The "intelligent design" hoax is not merely anti-science; it is anti-civilization. --John Derbyshire)
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To: 1rudeboy
Mr. Spock wrote:

"Nor am I particularly susceptible to appeals to emotions. That would make me a lib."

No, that would make you HUMAN!

My profound sympathy to your loved ones and/or your dog.

45 posted on 05/07/2008 7:28:03 AM PDT by Dick Bachert (INCENT)
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To: RDasher
There is no such thing as the North American Super Corridor;

I guess that's why local Chambers of Commerce and economic development types up here were creaming their jeans over the prospect of being next to the branch of it heading to Regina and Calgary.

I heard about it from the government first!

It is patently stupid to ignore the effects of actual happenings because the one who pointed them out may have a theory as to their origin which seems crackpot.

The effects/events/stated plans are the reason the theory exists in the first place.

Regardless of origin, those effects/events/plans exist.

Besides, ridicule of the whistleblowers would be the most effective defense of anyone with an outrageous agenda.

46 posted on 05/07/2008 7:30:03 AM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly.)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

• No Illegal Immigration! No Amnesty! No Guest Workers!
• NO North American Union!
• Repeal NAFTA!
The phrase “North American Union” conjures the image of the European Union, truly the prototype for what our elites have planned. One of the first orders of business will be a borderless North America. According to “Building a North American Community” (a Council on Foreign Relations task force report available here), the playbook for the construction of the North American Union, “Canada and the United States should consider eliminating restrictions on labor mobility altogether and work toward solutions that, in the long run, could enable the extension of full labor mobility to Mexico as well.” Full labor mobility throughout North America would mean no borders between the United States, Mexico, and Canada, spelling the end of our nation’s independence.

Why the term “civilian disarmament” instead of “gun control”?
In principle, every group that promotes what is called “gun control” is promoting the disarmament of civilians, which not only gives private criminals a tactical advantage over law-abiding innocent citizens, but is historically a necessary precursor to various forms of “democide” (the murder of civilians by the governments that rule them).
Get US out! of the United Nations
World government through the United Nations is a serious threat to the freedom of all Americans. Imagine being held prisoner in a foreign land and tried in an international court with judges from such countries as Afghanistan, China, or Iraq.
The United Nations (financed by American taxpayers!) has long been a safe harbor for terrorist and oppressive regimes which target America as the enemy.
Even more alarming, the United Nations is beginning to take aim at the God-given rights enjoyed by Americans since our great nation was founded. The right to self defense, use your own property, or even the right to have children may all be trampled if the United Nations is allowed to have the power it seeks.
Help Get US out! of the United Nations

Update for the JBS STOP the FTAA! Campaign
The JBS STOP the FTAA! Campaign has been put on hold due to the virtual disappearance of the Bush administration’s Free Trade Area of the Americas (FTAA) initiative since sometime in 2005. If the American public and Congress permit the current Security and Prosperity Partnership/North American Union process to proceed, then we can expect a resuscitation of the FTAA project somewhere down the road.

JBS 50th Anniversary
What purpose has education served in American history and society?
Noah Webster (October 16, 1758 – April 28, 1843), an American lexicographer, textbook author, spelling reformer, political writer, and editor, saw clearly the link between political and intellectual freedom and educational freedom
The family is the basic social unit in society. And nations are only as strong as are the individual families that comprise them.
Parents in all societies want their children to have the same values as themselves. The values of America and its Judeo-Christian-style civilization reflect a rich and unique history of liberty and productivity. These values should be maintained and passed on to future generations by appreciative American parents.
This philosophy is best encapsulated in Proverbs 22:6 of the King James Version of the Bible, which states: “Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not depart from it.” Parents are solely responsible and accountable for their children’s education.
The John Birch Society believes that education is the domain of parents, and adult students who seek further education, and that free societies are impossible to perpetuate without freedom in education.

These are excerpts from The John Birch Society website.

They sound a whole lot like typical Freepers, don’t they?


47 posted on 05/07/2008 7:30:42 AM PDT by Califreak (Hangin' with Hunter-under the bus "Dread and Circuses")
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To: 1rudeboy

Lopez Trucking is a hell of a lot easier to deal with than Singh Dhaliwal Trucking, IMO. The latter being the new wave of “American truckers”.


48 posted on 05/07/2008 7:42:14 AM PDT by RGSpincich
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To: puroresu
The NAU is one of those things that will evolve via fait accompli.

Not legally possible.

Once amnesty is passed and much of the country is full of Spanish speaking people who have as much, if not more, loyalty to Mexico than to America, we'll be told it's a fait accompli.

I think you are confusing ethnic pride with political commitment to the PAN or the PRI.

"Hey, a large part of the country regards America and Mexico as being one nation already, why not make it official?"

Even if every illegal alien in America were handed full citizenship tomorrow, they would not have enough votes to force a merger.

This is how we got into this immigration mess in the first place. We were assured in 1965 that the new immigration law wouldn't change America's demographics, and that only extremists and conspiracy mongers like the Birchers thought that would happen.

False on two counts: (1) The 1965 immigration law has almost nothing to do with demographic shifts in the USA; (2) plenty of reputable conservatives recognized it as bad law - like Bill Buckley who was rightly contemptuous of the JBS. Cranks like the JBS were mostly concerned over whether or not there were enough controls to ensure that the new immigrants were not communists.

Then, a couple of decades later, we were suddenly told that America's demography had changed. It was a fait accompli. There's nothing we can do about it, we were told, so let's celebrate it and say it's a great thing that we're becoming more "diverse".

Demographic shifts in America between 1965-1985 were due to two causes:

(1) The legalization of abortion and the widespread use of oral contraception from 1965 on. During 1973-1985 approximately 12 million putative native-born Americans never got the chance to be born and who knows how many Americans were never even conceived. In the 1970 census 28% of the US population was 14 and under. In the 1990 census, 18% of the US population was 14 and under. That is proportionally one-third less children in 20 years. Contraception and abortion ravaged the demographics of Americans - particularly white Americans during the 1975-1985 period.

(2) Illegal immigration. Illegal immigration swamped legal immigration in numbers during the Reagan economic recovery.

Demographic shifts occurred because white Americans chose not to reproduce.

There was zero discussion in the 1965 debates over immigration about even the possibility of tens of millions of illegal immigrants. One of the signal failures of the 1965 bill was to not even bother to consider US demographic trends nor to project what long-term incentives the bill was creating. Both the bill's proponents and opponents, in retrospect, were absolutely clueless about the real issues involved.

Only conspiracy-mongers suggested that this bill was a dangerous precedent. Everyone else smirked that America would never leave its borders unprotected. But we did, and now we're told it's a fait accompli.

No one at the time, not even cranks, predicted massive illegal immigration or massive failure of border enforcement. You are reading our current situation back into an historical period that did not anticipate it.

There are 12 million or 20 million illegals here, and, golly gee, we can't deport that many, so I guess we'll just have to give them a "pathway to citizenship". Oh, and we can't break up families, either, so I'll guess we'll have to let them bring their loved ones here as well.

What's amusing about your argument is this:

(1) You proceed on the (correct) assumption that the 1965 immigration bill was terrible law. So far so good.

(2) You then make the (completely incorrect) assumption that our current immigration situation was contemplated and designed by the 1965 bill. It wasn't at all.

(3) Your solution is, apparently, to solve our existing immigration crisis by . . . enforcing that terrible 1965 bill!

The 1965 bill was a terrible bill because it based immigration on market-ignorant artificial quotas and negatively-incentivizing family reunification.

A rational bill would have been based on encouraging immigration based on favoring young, healthy, well-behaved individuals with sponsored employment. It wasn't. The reason why we have 6,8,10,20 or however million illegals now is because the existing immigration laws from 1965 are badly designed and because Americans have refused to have enough children.

So, the correct policy is to treat the well-behaved, productive Mexicans in the US as a suspect class that can never be loyal and never have citizenship?

There does not exist in this country the political will to deport 6 or more million people.

What does exist is the political will to deport a million or so convicted criminal aliens and to erect a system of border enforcement that keeps violent criminals out.

Murdering unborn children and sodomizing people are not morally equivalent to trespassing. Sorry.

49 posted on 05/07/2008 7:43:37 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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To: Dick Bachert
My profound sympathy to your loved ones and/or your dog.

My profound sympathy to your cognitive abilities, if you think I just killed my dog because I do not object to Mexican trucks operating legally in the United States.

50 posted on 05/07/2008 7:44:15 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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