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US Veteran Removes His Kosovo Medal
Republican Riot ^ | May 6, 2008 | Julia Gorin

Posted on 05/07/2008 10:22:37 AM PDT by Bokababe

Perhaps some insiders (or those unwillingly part) of the Clintonistas’ administration realized that what we (the USA) were doing was just not right - and so the award/medal could not be called/designated in more accurate terms as the “Re-establishment of the Islamic Caliphate” Medal… So better to have sent in the Girl Scouts - as things would have ended up basically the same as they have, except perhaps with less loss of innocent life. Anyway, it’s is also off of my uniform forever.

My only desire is that in some very small way it may help people to become aware - especially Serbians - that not all Americans are clueless - and that more can/must be done to alert the (civilized/free world) to this horrible situation…Also, I am very very displeased with what the Bush administration has done regarding the issue of Kosovo - as well as with Israel, etc. In fact this part (why the Bush admin is playing along with the islamists) I can not figure out.

(Excerpt) Read more at juliagorin.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: antichristian; bonlyreturns; clinton; clintonlegacy; dhimmwit; illegalimmigration; islamicimperialism; kosovo; military; nato; proterrorist; rbjagain; waronterror; wrongside
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This is a sad story for America.
1 posted on 05/07/2008 10:22:38 AM PDT by Bokababe
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To: joan; Smartass; zagor-te-nej; Lion in Winter; Honorary Serb; jb6; Incorrigible; DTA; vooch; ...

2 posted on 05/07/2008 10:23:46 AM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Bokababe

Bump!!


3 posted on 05/07/2008 10:27:15 AM PDT by Perseverando
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To: Bokababe
This is a sad story for America.

And to our eternal shame.

4 posted on 05/07/2008 10:27:23 AM PDT by processing please hold ( "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.")
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To: Bokababe

President Bush seems to feel like he HAS to be diplomatic and refer to Islam as “the religion of peace” on just the outside chance that it will influence moderate Muslims not to fall for the rhetoric of the radical Islamists - and possibly not inflame the radicals more than they already are, if that’s possible. He seems to think that if he uses inflammatory rhetoric across the board about Islam, it might make matters worse. It does look like he is not quite very well informed enough in his own religion to realize that the Moon God is NOT the Lord God (Jehovah) and the “Jesus” of the Muslims is NOT the Jesus Christ that we know. It’s good to be positive and nice if one can operate in reality while doing so.


5 posted on 05/07/2008 10:32:24 AM PDT by Twinkie (TWO WRONGS DON'T MAKE A RIGHT !!!)
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To: Bokababe

“In fact this part (why the Bush admin is playing along with the islamists) I can not figure out.”

Why shouldn’t they play along when they claim that Islam is a ROP?


6 posted on 05/07/2008 10:33:03 AM PDT by 353FMG (Don't make the mistake to think that Government is a Friend of the People)
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To: Bokababe

The alternative story, by Totten, who is a very credible source -

http://www.commentarymagazine.com/viewarticle.cfm/this-is-a-kosovar-muslim-11372

“American flags are on sale at kiosks everywhere. They fly in front of government buildings. The world’s second largest replica of the Statue of Liberty sits atop the five star Hotel Victory. The largest street downtown was renamed Bill Clinton Boulevard. Many businesses are likewise named after Clinton. One cafe owner called his establishment “Hillary” and placed two gigantic pictures of Bill and Hillary on the walls. Don’t assume, though, that this makes Kosovars Muslim versions of Euro-lefties. Clinton is rightly hailed as a liberator, but one resident told me “We are Republicans here in Kosovo.” They want a strong American President who won’t back down from commitments.

Just a few short blocks from Bill Clinton Boulevard is the Israeli Odyssea Bakery. It is not just a Jewish bakery, but an Israeli bakery owned and operated by an actual Israeli. The very idea of this would be unthinkable in even the most liberal of Arabic-speaking countries.

Accomplished businessman and practicing Muslim Luan Berisha told me that 90 percent of Kosovars support Israel in the Arab-Israeli conflict. I don’t know if that’s really true. But if so it means Kosovo is more pro-Israel than even the United States.”

Comment - Kosovo looks like an American success and there is no Caliphate there.


7 posted on 05/07/2008 10:34:26 AM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya

“Kosovo looks like an American success and there is no Caliphate there.”

Famous last words?


8 posted on 05/07/2008 10:42:19 AM PDT by indcons
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To: buwaya

How many Christian churches are left in Kosovo? How many were there just prior to the war?


9 posted on 05/07/2008 10:45:22 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (Who opposes John McCain's leftist agenda? The RNC, Rep Congress members, the Democrats? Good luck!)
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To: buwaya

Since when is Totten a credible source?
He is about as far left as you can get, from what I know of what he has written.


10 posted on 05/07/2008 10:50:48 AM PDT by HotDog1
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To: buwaya
"The alternative story, by Totten, who is a very credible source"

Yeah, Totten is a real "peach":

Michael J. Totten is a blogger who writes on politics in the Middle East, regularly reporting first-hand in mainstream publications, Web sites, and his blog, Michael J. Totten's Middle East Journal. He describes himself as a "weird combination of liberal, libertarian, and neocon."

As I said before, that article is a nonsense cheerleader piece designed to gain support for "the Kosovars", by flattering America. Most of us aren't stupid enough to think American flag-waiving trumps church-burning, nun-raping and the eviction of all non-Albanian, non-Islamic people.

You also linked directly to the article instead of the discussion of the same article here on FR that refutes a lot of Totten's Liberacon bull.

11 posted on 05/07/2008 10:53:36 AM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: buwaya
"Kosovo looks like an American success and there is no Caliphate there."

those that could fight for a Caliphate government are in Iraq fighting or died there.
I believe Iraq has helped all the middle east.

12 posted on 05/07/2008 11:24:47 AM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Bokababe

Our actions there have rightly been tagged “The War to Make The World Safe for Islam.”

And, as bad as 911 was, THAT will come to bite us in the ass in ways we can only imagine.


13 posted on 05/07/2008 11:51:14 AM PDT by Dick Bachert (INCENT)
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To: Bokababe
"He describes himself as a "weird combination of liberal, libertarian, and neocon."

In other words, a guy with no emotional, moral or logical consistency.

14 posted on 05/07/2008 11:56:37 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Steve Van Doorn
"those that could fight for a Caliphate government are in Iraq fighting or died there."

I think that the Islamists are in Iraq to defend "their ME world" and the Islamists are in the Balkans to make inroads into "our Western world". It's not an "either/or" -- it's an "and".

Unfortunately, while we are fighting them on one front, we are holding the door for them in the other.

15 posted on 05/07/2008 12:05:29 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: buwaya
"Accomplished businessman.."

Yes, they accomplished the creation of a business in trafficking human organs and other various criminal enterprises.

16 posted on 05/07/2008 1:03:24 PM PDT by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: HotDog1

Totten is far left ?

He is one of the best journalists working in Iraq and the ME in general. He is as pro-American and pro-victory as Michael Yon (and he got that point of view through being on the spot), and just as devoted to reporting the facts on the ground.

I have been following his Middle-Eastern reporting for years.


17 posted on 05/07/2008 1:42:36 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya

IMO, Totten is hardly a “credible source”, for he seems to me that he has a rather heavy pro-Albanian bias. The Albanians like us because we intervened or interfered (take your pick) in a civil conflict basically on their side. I have heard it said that that is not the way to build a real friendship. People can and do change. After all, not all that long ago we helped liberated Kuwait from Saddam’s occupation, yet today there’s anti-Americanism present there.


18 posted on 05/07/2008 1:42:40 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: Bokababe
absolutely they are after the world but they can only put so many forces at a time in different areas. The Fight in Kosovo and Europe has been put off until they can 'clean up' their back door, Iraq which is near the center of Islam.

I know they don't have a real good central command or anything but those that fight seem to know were the problem areas are and right now that is Iraq.

19 posted on 05/07/2008 1:46:22 PM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Joe 6-pack

Its fairly consistent.

Its pretty much the Hitchens position.

Its not mine, or yours, but it is something we can deal with. The important point is as far as US international strategy goes we are on the same side. If we are unwilling to accept people like Totten on our side, we don’t have a side, we have a bunch of irrelevant cults.


20 posted on 05/07/2008 1:48:10 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya

Sure, Totten may be pretty knowledgeable when it comes to the Middle East, but Kosovo and the Balkans in general are not the Middle East.

>Totten is far left ?

The guy admitted that his ideology was a mixture of neoconservatism, libertarianism, and *liberalism*. I suspect that he may really be a liberal with a hookah and a taste for stealth bomber diplomacy(though I admit that it’s basically just speculation on my part). Kind of like a hawkish version of Bill Maher. At the least, he does appear to have a rather strong and perhaps excessive pro-Albanian bias.


21 posted on 05/07/2008 1:48:16 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: Jacob Kell

Totten is on the spot, and he is known for reporting in detail and without bias. He writes what he sees.

Nations and peoples do not have personal friendships, that is a very misleading analogy.

Kuwait is still on board as a pro-American state; they have minority Islamic problems because they are Islamic, there isn’t much you can do. We have anti-American problems right here in the US also.


22 posted on 05/07/2008 1:55:07 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya
"If we are unwilling to accept people like Totten on our side, we don’t have a side, we have a bunch of irrelevant cults."

It's the old stopped clock argument. Twice a day, I'm perfectly willing to consider it correct.

23 posted on 05/07/2008 1:56:39 PM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Jacob Kell

If you want to define pro-American liberals as being out of the club, as being on the “far left”, then we have a very poor class of club. This is the kind of attitude that gets leaves the real far left perpetually broken up into mutually antagonistic cults.

Conservatism is, I would like to think, a rather more adult and practical way of seeing the world, that can deal with differences of opinion and accomodate them.


24 posted on 05/07/2008 1:59:19 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya
Comment - Kosovo looks like an American success and there is no Caliphate there.

200 plus Christian churches, monasteries, and cemeteries destroyed and you call that an American success.

God forbid the Serbian people should have to endure your idea of a failure!

25 posted on 05/07/2008 2:01:02 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Joe 6-pack

He has constantly and powerfully supported the US political and military efforts in Iraq and Lebanon, and gainst Iran and Hezbollah. In fact he spends almost all his time doing those things, that is his journalistic niche.

Thats not being right twice a day, thats 24 hours consistency.


26 posted on 05/07/2008 2:03:51 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: FormerLib

The Serbian people have some serious failings.

Among them was an imperialistic attitude towards their fellow Slavs, such as the Catholic Croats no less than the Muslim Bosnians and Albanians, an attachment to fascist politics and a disdain for economic and political liberty.

Plus an attachment to Russian pan-Slavic imperialism. This doesn’t sit well with other Slavs like the Poles and Czechs.

Not all our enemies are Muslims.


27 posted on 05/07/2008 2:08:22 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: FormerLib

How many Croat Catholic churches, monasteries, and etc. did the Serbians destroy ?

And they were in fact doing the same and worse to the Albanians for years.

We are not talking about saints on either side.


28 posted on 05/07/2008 2:10:53 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya

>and he is known for reporting in detail and without bias.

Could have fooled me. At least when it comes to Kosovo.

>He writes what he sees.

Does he see everything? What about what he doesn’t see?


29 posted on 05/07/2008 2:13:35 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: buwaya

>If you want to define pro-American liberals as being out >of the club, as being on the “far left”, then we have a >very poor class of club.

I don’t mind pro-US libs, even though they’re probably rare. However, I also believe in being realistic, and not let stars get in our eyes.


30 posted on 05/07/2008 2:16:10 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: buwaya

>He has constantly and powerfully supported the US >political and military efforts in Iraq and Lebanon, and >gainst Iran and Hezbollah. In fact he spends almost all >his time doing those things, that is his journalistic >niche.

As I said, he’s pretty knowledgable about the Middle East, but Kosovo and the balkans are not the Middle East.
Just because he knows a lot about one part of the world doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s an expert on another.

>Thats not being right twice a day, thats 24 hours >consistency.

Maybe more like 19 or 20 hours. :-)


31 posted on 05/07/2008 2:18:36 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: Jacob Kell

Look up Totten on Lebanon, Kurdistan, Turkey and Iraq. He has written piles of excellent reporting and analysis, and superb travel writing for that matter.

Naturally nobody sees everything. But if we are going to work on information we receive in the media then we need to develop some judgment about who is credible and who isn’t about what they do see, otherwise we might as well go there and see for ourselves, or forget about pretending we have a worthwhile opinion.

That credibility comes from a track record. Fisk, for instance, has a terible track record, Totten and Yon have the opposite.


32 posted on 05/07/2008 2:21:42 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya

>We are not talking about saints on either side.

Here, we are in agreement. There were few, if any, saints on either side. Though it seems to me like Totten has considered the Albanians to be saints.


33 posted on 05/07/2008 2:24:23 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: Jacob Kell

“Just because he knows a lot about one part of the world doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s an expert on another.”

No, but he came by this expertise very quickly through observation. This is a guy who went to Lebanon (and Iraq, etc. later) just a few years ago cold. At some point you have to trust the man.


34 posted on 05/07/2008 2:25:31 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: Jacob Kell

No, he’s just saying they are friendly and not Islamically insane.


35 posted on 05/07/2008 2:26:47 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya

>No, but he came by this expertise very quickly through observation. This is a guy who went to Lebanon (and Iraq, etc. later) just a few years ago cold. At some point you have to trust the man.

Maybe, but he still seems to me to be at least somewhat biased. Though that’s just my opinion.

>No, he’s just saying they are friendly and not Islamically insane.

At least right now. Who knows what the future may hold? Still, I suspect that when it comes to radical political ideologies among the Albanians,there’s probably more to worry about from the more secular ones like ultranationalism or communism.


36 posted on 05/07/2008 2:34:49 PM PDT by Jacob Kell (Member of the LCMS since birth.)
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To: buwaya; joan; Smartass; zagor-te-nej; Lion in Winter; Honorary Serb; jb6; Incorrigible; DTA; ...
How many Croat Catholic churches, monasteries, and etc. did the Serbians destroy ?

You tell me, you're the one attempting to justify the atrocities against the Serbs.

And they were in fact doing the same and worse to the Albanians for years.

Wrong again.

But are you suggesting that it is OK to commit atrocities against an entire people because some of them were criminals? That's how you're attempting to justify the crimes against the Serbs.

The illegal immigrants from Albania waged a terror campaign against the Serb, Roma, and Jewish population in Kosovo for decades. When the Serbs began to fight back against the Jihadist and win, we joined on the wrongside.

Peace and justice will return to Kosovo alongside the Serb Army.

37 posted on 05/07/2008 2:48:00 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: buwaya

Right because if they reveal their true colors, the foreign troops who are keeping their criminal state in existence will leave and the Serbs will take the place back before the weekend.


38 posted on 05/07/2008 2:49:28 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: buwaya
Not all our enemies are Muslims.

But all the terrorists against us are Muslim.

Giving them a new base of operations in Europe is stupid beyond belief.

39 posted on 05/07/2008 2:51:34 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: FormerLib

I am saying that the Serbs don’t have clean hands - if anything they started the whole mess by being overbearing towards their kin, and the Albanians, under the truly disastrous leadership of Miloslevic.

As for what the Serbs were up to -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Vukovar

The Yugoslavian wars were full of mutual atrocities, much like the partition of India.

These wars and atrocities were committed against all participants, Orthodox, Catholic and Muslim.


40 posted on 05/07/2008 3:03:40 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya
These wars and atrocities were committed against all participants, Orthodox, Catholic and Muslim.

And we have been militarily supporting Muslim atrocities against Jews and Orthodox Christians in Kosovo for a decade. This is not only stupid but unconscionable.

41 posted on 05/07/2008 3:06:36 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: FormerLib
"Peace and justice will return to Kosovo alongside the Serb Army."

42 posted on 05/07/2008 3:07:27 PM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated)
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To: Kolokotronis

The Serb army ?

They are Communists, or would dearly like to be.

And that Greek flag ? Is there a more anti-American, ugrateful people in Europe than the Greeks ?

The US should ban Greek immigration and declare the lot of them enemies of the people. They cheered 9/11 as much as any Arab or Muslim.


43 posted on 05/07/2008 3:37:04 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya
It's useful to read about Kosovo through Western eyes, before the Kosovo Albanian PR firms were hired, and even, before Milosevic took power, in order to see what was really going on -- and who the Kosovo Albanians really are.

As for today, it's fair to say that I don't think that all Kosovo Albanians are "jihadists". But since NATO took over, Wahhabis have been growing in number where they never existed before -- even Steven Schwartz, one of their prime Muslim cheerleaders, has complained about the Wahhabi incursion into Kosovo. The average Kosovo Albanian is dirt poor and ME Wahhabis have been showing up with big money to build mosques and pay the locals to practice sharia in Kosovo.

Add to that, the Albanian and Kosovo Albanian leadership are corrupt to the bone -- it is a mafia culture dealing on an enormous scale in illegal drugs, people trafficking, illegal arms trafficking, sex slavery and illegal organ trafficking, even of their own children.

Point is that in a location where over 50% of the Muslim population is unemployed and you have a Mafia culture of corruption running things, Kosovo Albanians will do the bidding of whoever pays them the highest amount.

Kosovo Albanian "loyalty" is to whoever pays them the most. No matter what we have done for them, if they get a better deal elsewhere tomorrow, we are screwed. And to some extent, this is only fair, given that we stole Kosovo from Serbia in the first place!

44 posted on 05/07/2008 3:37:17 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: buwaya
"The Serb army ? They are Communists, or would dearly like to be. And that Greek flag ? Is there a more anti-American, ugrateful people in Europe than the Greeks ?"

You just displayed your complete and utter ignorance of the Balkans with those statements.

If I were you, I wouldn't quit your "day job"!

45 posted on 05/07/2008 3:40:07 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: buwaya
And they were in fact doing the same and worse to the Albanians for years.

Which underlines the point the Serbs make that the only real Kosovars were the Serbians who were evicted from their ancestral homeland by the colonizing Albanians. Serbia has not been fighting Kosovar independence, it has been fighting Albanian and muslim imperialism.

46 posted on 05/07/2008 3:42:18 PM PDT by PeterFinn (McCain in 2008 means Hillary in 2012.)
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To: Bokababe

And this archive leads to what conclusion ?

It seems to me that it is clear there was a long-standing desire for independence from Serbia on the part of the Kosovar-Albanian majority, which was repressed at gunpoint for decades, and that this desire had little if anything to do with jihadist sentiment.

“Let my people go” is a powerful argument.


47 posted on 05/07/2008 3:46:32 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: PeterFinn

If the majority in that region (Kosovo) was Albanian for centuries, why don’t they have the right, according to principles of self-determination, to demand separation and independence ?


48 posted on 05/07/2008 3:49:01 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: Bokababe

Er, I believe I am accurate on both counts.

The Greeks are not virulently anti-American ?

Serbia isn’t still dominated by the successors of the old nomenklatura ?


49 posted on 05/07/2008 3:50:25 PM PDT by buwaya
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To: buwaya
What--- did you just get back from an imams for peace conference?

Your postings exhibit a serious lack of knowledge about the Balkans.. esp the 600 year history of Islamic jihad against the Serbian people!

In the meantime why doncha fixate on this photo and tell me which one you are the Nazi Kraut or the nazi albanian...


On right, Kosovar Albanian Muslim Nazir Hodic, a member of the Nazi SS Division Handzar in Bosnia. On left is Rudi Sommemer, the commander of the Nazi SS Albanian Battalion, 6/28 in Handzar. Hodic is shown wearing the Albanian skull cap issued by the SS with a Nazi swastika on his collar.

50 posted on 05/07/2008 4:15:47 PM PDT by eleni121 (EN TOUTO NIKA!! +)
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