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Editorial: At the Saddleback Forum, Senator McCain and Pastor Warren took the Gold
Catholic Online ^ | 8/17/08 | Deacon Keith Fournier

Posted on 08/17/2008 6:42:59 AM PDT by tcg

Senator Barack Obama miserably failed the test concerning the foundational world view issue. Without the right to life, there are no other rights. Rights attach to persons and abortion kills little persons. Without the freedom to be born, there are no other freedoms. When Senator Obama was asked about the humanity of the child in the womb, he said that such a question was “above his pay grade”. Oh, he then blathered on about their being a “moral and ethical” dimension to the issue. However, he then stated unequivocally “I am pro-choice, I believe in Roe v Wade”. He mouthed something about reducing abortions but the utter clarity of the moment was the highlight of the evening. The pastor, this man of purpose, followed through with this question, ”Have you ever voted to limit abortions”? Barack Obama was, for the first time in my viewing, at a loss for words. Because the truth is now out there and he knew he could not lie about it.

Senator John McCain on the other hand, hit a home run in the eyes of people like me who insist that the issue of respecting the dignity of every human life from the womb to the tomb is not a “single issue” but rather a “World View” issue in Pastor Warren’s terminology. The same question was posed to him, “At what point is a baby entitled to human rights”. John McCain’s answer came without any hesitation. Obviously such an incredibly important answer was not above “his pay grade”. He said it with conviction, “From the moment of conception”. He continued on by affirming to the Pastor, to all those assembled and to the thousands watching, that he has a 25 year record of being Pro-life and that he will be a Pro-life President...

(Excerpt) Read more at catholic.org ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2008; abortion; election; electionpresident; elections; mccain; obama; saddleback
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The first winner of the Gold for the evening was Pastor Rick Warren who presided over the forum with excellence. Next was Senator John McCain for affirming the truth of that the Right to Life attaches “From the moment of conception”.
1 posted on 08/17/2008 6:43:00 AM PDT by tcg
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To: tcg

kool!


2 posted on 08/17/2008 6:44:28 AM PDT by ken21 (people die and you never hear from them again.)
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To: tcg

Excellent job by McCain!

Obama been Lyin’

http://www.polistic.com


3 posted on 08/17/2008 6:49:53 AM PDT by nesnah (Expression with an attitude - www.polistic.com)
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To: tcg

Too bad there was little publicity about this program. I would liked to have watched.


4 posted on 08/17/2008 6:51:41 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

You can watch. The video is here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2063235/posts


5 posted on 08/17/2008 6:55:17 AM PDT by library user
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To: tcg
he said that such a question was “above his pay grade”

Senator Obama - when you're the President, there IS NO ONE ABOVE YOUR PAY GRADE. God this man is a scary little weasel.

6 posted on 08/17/2008 6:55:19 AM PDT by Hardastarboard (I have Zero Tolerance for Zero Tolerance policies.)
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To: tcg

I’ve been surprised by how many people didn’t know that B.O. supported infanticide. This is not a new story.


7 posted on 08/17/2008 6:56:00 AM PDT by Tax-chick ("It's hard to be stressed out over your spouse while you're in a bathtub drinking wine together.")
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Say no more, my FRiend...

"I am pro-choice, I believe in Roe v Wade"

8 posted on 08/17/2008 6:58:57 AM PDT by StAnDeliver (Matthew 7:15-16)
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To: Hardastarboard

I hope the RNC is working on a commercial containing the “above my pay grade” answer.


9 posted on 08/17/2008 6:59:03 AM PDT by SandyInSeattle (Go, Sonics! And take the Mariners with you.)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Too bad there was little publicity about this program. I would liked to have watched.

You need to frequent Free Republic more often!
There was an announcement on Breaking News all day yesterday.
It's still up with over 2,000 posts and over 50,000 views.

If you go to CNN, you can catch all the video from the forum,
as well as some rich post-forum commentaries.

10 posted on 08/17/2008 6:59:25 AM PDT by XR7
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To: tcg
"but the utter clarity of the moment was the highlight of the evening. The pastor, this man of purpose, followed through with this question, ”Have you ever voted to limit abortions”? Barack Obama was, for the first time in my viewing, at a loss for words. Because the truth is now out there and he knew he could not lie about it."

So very well put.

11 posted on 08/17/2008 6:59:56 AM PDT by StAnDeliver (Matthew 7:15-16)
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To: SandyInSeattle
Yeah. Its the Obama equivalent of “voted for it before I voted against it.”
12 posted on 08/17/2008 7:00:15 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: tcg
Finally, Pastor Warren asked them a question concerning which sitting Supreme Court Justices that would NOT have recommended for appointment. It was a brilliant way of eliciting the stark contrast in their Judicial philosophy when most honest observers know that the next President will appoint at least two new Justices and that these appointments will either secure the infamy of the Roe and Doe decisions, the current regime of abortion on demand, or undo the wrong. Senator McCain again took the gold.

I got to see the end of the re-run early this a.m. on Fox News and was very impressed with McCain. I agree that he did very well. I am disappointed that this article didn't say which SCJ's he wouldn't have recommended for appointment. I'd like to know who he named. If anyone saw the forum, please tell....

13 posted on 08/17/2008 7:01:26 AM PDT by right wing (The Drive-By Media Are Terrorists Too)
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To: tcg

Warren is going to fall fast because he is speaking at the DNC Denver Convention per another post here.

Warren’s softballs to obama and visible frustration at his missing them means he wanted “his man” to win in order to promote his chinese menu christianity.


14 posted on 08/17/2008 7:04:22 AM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: Hardastarboard
Senator Obama - when you're the President, there IS NO ONE ABOVE YOUR PAY GRADE

The job, of President, Obama is applying for, is above his pay grade

15 posted on 08/17/2008 7:05:12 AM PDT by YellowRoseofTx (Evil is not the opposite of God; it's the absence of God)
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To: right wing

Ginsberg, Souter, and one other...


16 posted on 08/17/2008 7:05:42 AM PDT by SandyInSeattle (Go, Sonics! And take the Mariners with you.)
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To: right wing

“”that this article didn’t say which SCJ’s he wouldn’t have recommended for appointment. I’d like to know who he named. If anyone saw the forum, please tell....””

McCain named all the liberals.
Obama hesitated a teensy bit and named Clarence Thomas.


17 posted on 08/17/2008 7:06:09 AM PDT by Thank You Rush
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To: right wing

McCain listed all the lefties except Kennedy.


18 posted on 08/17/2008 7:08:01 AM PDT by Beagle8U (FreeRepublic -- One stop shopping ....... Its the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: longtermmemmory

The candidates were asked the same questions.

I know Rick Warren, and he didn’t look frustrated to me at all. He did have a “what the heck are you saying” look a few times, but that’s all I saw.


19 posted on 08/17/2008 7:08:17 AM PDT by SandyInSeattle (Go, Sonics! And take the Mariners with you.)
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To: ken21
Mr. Obama is a typical new-age secularist. I doubt very much that he really believes in God. The only reason he was a member of any church was to solidify his black identity.

He certainly doesn't believe in God as the Creator, Lawgiver, and Ruler of the Universe.

20 posted on 08/17/2008 7:08:44 AM PDT by reg45
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To: Beagle8U
McCain listed all the lefties except Kennedy.

Well, he is eminently forgettable :-).

21 posted on 08/17/2008 7:09:25 AM PDT by Tax-chick ("It's hard to be stressed out over your spouse while you're in a bathtub drinking wine together.")
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To: longtermmemmory
Warren’s softballs to obama and visible frustration at his missing them means he wanted “his man” to win in order to promote his chinese menu christianity.

The anti-Warren crowd always has to get their little digs in.

22 posted on 08/17/2008 7:09:41 AM PDT by Skooz (Gabba Gabba we accept you we accept you one of us Gabba Gabba we accept you we accept you one of us)
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To: longtermmemmory

I don’t see Warren as a true pastor of Christ. I see him as a motivational speaker that uses the word “God” every so often.


23 posted on 08/17/2008 7:10:19 AM PDT by autumnraine
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To: Tax-chick

Yes he is, but he doesn’t vote wrong 100% of the time.


24 posted on 08/17/2008 7:11:19 AM PDT by Beagle8U (FreeRepublic -- One stop shopping ....... Its the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: Beagle8U
he doesn’t vote wrong 100% of the time.

True. And although he's a goof, he's not a cartoon-parody goof like Breyer.

25 posted on 08/17/2008 7:13:55 AM PDT by Tax-chick ("It's hard to be stressed out over your spouse while you're in a bathtub drinking wine together.")
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To: right wing
I'd like to know who he named.

McCain rattled off the names of the most 4 liberal justices (Souter, Ginsburg, Stevens, Breyer) and said something about he doesn't want justices who legislate from the bench and will uphold the Constitution. Said he liked Roberts the best.

26 posted on 08/17/2008 7:16:37 AM PDT by Always Right (Obama: more arrogant than Bill Clinton, more naive than Jimmy Carter, and more liberal than LBJ.)
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To: StAnDeliver
"I am pro-choice, I believe in Roe v Wade" as opposed to "I am pro-life, I believe in God".

That really says it all. I think Obama believes that the decisions of the courts (at least the leftist ones) are more important than the divine scriptures and that the laws of man are superior to the laws of God.

27 posted on 08/17/2008 7:17:19 AM PDT by reg45
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

The forum was advertised on Fox and Fox News, plus there was at least one reference on the MSM I heard. although it was not mentioned where one could view it.


28 posted on 08/17/2008 7:17:20 AM PDT by o_zarkman44
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To: tcg

Pics from the event:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2063167/posts


29 posted on 08/17/2008 7:17:42 AM PDT by Ladycalif (Free - Ramos and Compean)
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To: Beagle8U
Yes he is, but he doesn’t vote wrong 100% of the time.

Having Kennedy as the lone swing vote is much better than the days when O'Conner was in the mix. We may not have a 2nd Amendment if Sandra was still around.

30 posted on 08/17/2008 7:18:24 AM PDT by Always Right (Obama: more arrogant than Bill Clinton, more naive than Jimmy Carter, and more liberal than LBJ.)
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To: YellowRoseofTx
The job, of President, Obama is applying for, is above his pay grade

I'm from Illinois, and I think that the job he currently has is above his pay grade.

31 posted on 08/17/2008 7:20:13 AM PDT by reg45
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To: tcg; All

Here’s all any Conservative needs to know about Barrack Hussein Obama:

Special Interest Group Ratings:

Planned Parenthood - 100% Support
National Right To Life - 0% Support
NARAL - 100% Support
Americans for Tax Reform - 0% Support
ACLU - 83% Support
NEA - 100% Support
NOW Hags - 100% Support
Citizens Against Government Waste - 13% Support
Gun Owners of America - 0% Support
NRA - “F” Rating
Federation for American Immigration Reform - 0% Support
US Border Patrol - 8% Support
Unions - 82% - 100% Support
Population Connection - 100% Support (These are the ‘Zero Growth’ freaks)

http://vote-smart.org/issue_rating_category.php?can_id=BS030017

[Barrack Hussein Obama’s record in the Illinois senate:]

- Opposed the Defense of Marriage Act; would work to repeal it in the U.S. Senate; would not vote for any legislation that would restrict the ability of gays and lesbians to marry.
- Opposed the Born Alive Infant Protection Act four times in Illinois. A similar bill passed the U.S. Senate 98-0. The Born Alive bill would have prohibited a baby from being born alive but left to die according to the mother’s wishes. Obama inexplicably opposed this bill not once, twice, or three times, but four times.
- Obama took almost $90,000 in bundled contributions from the Council for a Livable World. The council is a well-known anti-defense organization.
- Obama puts rigid ideology before what’s best for the people of Illinois, and presumably he would do that as President as well. He has on several occasions made public his opposition to the NAFTA trade agreement and his belief that it must be negotiated. All the while thanks to NAFTA, Illinois exports $1.3 billion in agricultural goods to Canada.
- Obama refused to vote for a bill in the Illinois State Senate that would have increased penalties for drug traffickers.
- Obama voted against a bill that would have delivered the death penalty to gang members who murder first responders.
- Finally, just in case you thought it couldn’t get any worse, Obama was the only member of the Illinois State Senate to vote against a bill that prohibited early release for sexual predators.

Can’t kill the innocent fast enough, can’t free the guilty soon enough!


32 posted on 08/17/2008 7:20:57 AM PDT by Diana in Wisconsin (Save The Earth. It's The Only Planet With Chocolate.)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

“Too bad there was little publicity about this program. I would liked to have watched.”

It will probably reach the Catholic voters, and they are the REAL swing voters, and they are numerous in key states.

The key now is not to snatch defeat from victory. Do not nominate a pro-choice running mate. Repeat DO NOT NOMINATE A PRO-CHOICE RUNNING MATE.


33 posted on 08/17/2008 7:21:44 AM PDT by BobL (http://www.brusselsjournal.com/blog/4556 (here is where the real Europe is going))
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To: tcg

Killing humans in utero are not the only category of killing Obama supports; this is just his beginning and a target easy to kill.


34 posted on 08/17/2008 7:23:42 AM PDT by Neoliberalnot ((Hallmarks of Liberalism: Ingratitude and Envy))
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To: Diana in Wisconsin

Nice list.

Excellent post.

Thanks.


35 posted on 08/17/2008 7:24:34 AM PDT by Skooz (Gabba Gabba we accept you we accept you one of us Gabba Gabba we accept you we accept you one of us)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Too bad there was little publicity about this program.

I think it was pretty well advertized on FOX News.

But don't beat yourself up...I'm a news junky and am too often
suprised (after the fact) at things that get past me!

It's a hazard of living in this 25 hours-a-day news cycle and
today's endless tsunami of news, further congested by the insertion
of "entertainment news" (e.g., What's up with Britney?)!
36 posted on 08/17/2008 7:24:38 AM PDT by VOA
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To: Diana in Wisconsin
Can’t kill the innocent fast enough, can’t free the guilty soon enough!

I'm swiping that for my tagline.

37 posted on 08/17/2008 7:27:39 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Obama: Can’t kill the innocent fast enough, can’t free the guilty soon enough!~ Diana in WI)
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To: Hardastarboard

I suppose it’s his way of saying I don’t know and trying to sound cool. I can accept I don’t know as a response. It’s something you believe not know. But, and here’s the big but. if you don’t know then you are saying that the unborn “could be” totally human.In that case the only option is to treat thm as such. You can’t say the fetus may be fully human or it may not, let’s kill it. That attitude is a 1000x worse than saying the fetus is just tissue. If a person claims to be compassionate then abortion cannot be an option. If there is a possibility of life, life must be the choice. It is time to turn Mario Coumo’s 1984 speech in San Francisco against the Dems. Choose life not death.


38 posted on 08/17/2008 7:27:41 AM PDT by xkaydet65 (Freedom is purchased not with gold, but with steel.)
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To: Neoliberalnot

Let me correct another error made in haste: Killing humans in utero IS not the only category of killing Obama suppports; this is just his beginning and a target easy to kill.


39 posted on 08/17/2008 7:28:45 AM PDT by Neoliberalnot ((Hallmarks of Liberalism: Ingratitude and Envy))
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To: autumnraine

“I don’t see Warren as a true pastor of Christ. I see him as a motivational speaker that uses the word “God” every so often.”

So does that disqualify Warren as a credible interviewer?
Warren offered no opinions. What I saw of the interview was an outstanding question and answer session that touched on everything that matters.
Just because the Preacher don’t proclaim fire and brimstone is not a basis for making a bigoted assumption his intentions are not rightous.


40 posted on 08/17/2008 7:30:34 AM PDT by o_zarkman44
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To: Neoliberalnot

I agree about the Veep spot - McCain needs to pick a solid conservative and possibly a woman. Sarah Palin has been mentioned and would be an awesome choice. I am not thrilled that the senator from Texas would be a possibility (Kay Bailey Hutchison). He needs to go young, smart, and ACCEPTABLE TO THE BASE REPUBLICAN PARTY! Plus, if he picks Gov Palin from Alaska, she would be an excellent supporter of FINALLY DRILLING IN ANWR - what a great representative to have presiding over the senate!


41 posted on 08/17/2008 7:33:13 AM PDT by princess leah
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To: o_zarkman44

Oh no, he did very very well in that forum! He was about as non-biased as you could get and I don’t think he lobbed any softballs to Obama, he asked the same questions as far as I know.

I’m just saying he doesn’t fit with the Christian pastor in the traditional Christian church. That’s just my opinion as a Christian. I do think that the Purpose Driven Life was a good model to live by though.


42 posted on 08/17/2008 7:39:22 AM PDT by autumnraine
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To: Hardastarboard
There is ONE but he serves without pay.

Garde la Foi, mes amis! Nous nous sommes les sauveurs de la République! Maintenant et Toujours!
(Keep the Faith, my friends! We are the saviors of the Republic! Now and Forever!)

LonePalm, le Républicain du verre cassé (The Broken Glass Republican)

43 posted on 08/17/2008 7:42:50 AM PDT by LonePalm (Commander and Chef)
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To: tcg

Outstanding article! I, too, was pleasantly surprised by the performance of the Rev. Warren and also vey pleased with McCain.
Obama was a joke. He’s quickly becoming a farce.
Too bad most people were probably watching the Olympics.


44 posted on 08/17/2008 7:44:16 AM PDT by BnBlFlag (Deo Vindice/Semper Fidelis "Ya gotta saddle up your boys; Ya gotta draw a hard line")
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To: Thank You Rush

Probably since he could not name all the SCJ. Thomas is a traitor in his mind.


45 posted on 08/17/2008 7:45:39 AM PDT by Orange1998
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

“Too bad there was little publicity about this program. I would liked to have watched.”

Hope you see this in time - it will be on again tonight (Sunday) on CNN at 7-9pm Central Time, 11-1 am and 2-4 am. CNN had been advertising it for a couple of weeks, but last night it was also on cspan and fox news channel. Maybe you can catch it tonight. And yes, I also felt that McCain won this one big. Obama’s answers were long, weasely, and lawerly. McCain’s were so short and direct that Rick Warren had time to ask him several MORE questions, unlike Obama who ate up so much time with his long rhetoric.


46 posted on 08/17/2008 7:45:51 AM PDT by llandres (I'd rather be alive and bankrupt than dead and solvent)
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To: o_zarkman44
Warren offered no opinions. What I saw of the interview was an outstanding question and answer session that touched on everything that matters.

I thought Warren did well in the interview. I wish he had asked about illegal immigration - if he did I missed it. People that read my posts know that I do not like John McCain - but I will admit that he did well last night - and that Obama performed "abominably".

Since the interview took place in a church, I'm sure both candidates tailored their responses to that crowd. McCain said what conservatives would want to hear. I'm still reserving my judgment for him as a candidate, based on who he picks for VP & what he says from this point out. His answers were short & direct - almost bordering on canned answers. I think he was well-prepped for it. I still think actions speak louder than words, so we'll see.

47 posted on 08/17/2008 7:46:23 AM PDT by alicewonders (I'm a conservative, and I'm hated by the GOP & the Dems - I must be doing something right!)
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To: tcg; wagglebee; narses; Salvation; NYer
Paging Doug Kmiec... Please pick up the white courtesy telephone.
48 posted on 08/17/2008 7:47:02 AM PDT by Norman Bates (Freepmail me to be part of the McCain List!)
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To: longtermmemmory
Notice how Obama tilts his head when speaking. That must mean something in body language. No eye to eye contact unless you tilt your head as well.
49 posted on 08/17/2008 7:49:08 AM PDT by Orange1998
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To: Tax-chick

“I’ve been surprised by how many people didn’t know that B.O. supported infanticide.”

While most know that BHO’s “pro-choice”, few probably know that he supports partial-birth aborton OR what that grisly procedure entails AND fewer yet realize that he also is for killing or deliberately allowing a newborn survivor of aborton to die immediately following its birth.


50 posted on 08/17/2008 7:51:10 AM PDT by llandres (I'd rather be alive and bankrupt than dead and solvent)
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