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To: LetMarch

Most of the Founding Fathers were Deists, not Christian fundamentalists.

The Bill of Rights does contain the Establishment clause and, even though the words “separation of CHurch and State” are not specifically there, the meaning is clear that the government cannot favor any religion. It’s part of the freedoms this great nation embraces and why many people first settled here.

Burning a cross onto a student’s arm is both child abuse and a blatant invocation of religion. We don’t need teachers branding kids with their religious symbols. THe guy needs to be fired and thrown in jail. The parents should get a good chunk of his assets. And just because some petty school board member wants government endorsement of religion does not make it right, not is it going to happen. She’ needs to leave office.


42 posted on 01/08/2009 5:36:35 AM PST by doc30 (Democrats are to morals what an Etch-A-Sketch is to Art.)
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To: doc30

“Most of the Founding Fathers were Deists, not Christian fundamentalists.”

No, not the silly Deist bit again.

“The Bill of Rights...blah...blah...the meaning is clear that the government cannot favor any religion.”

Basically true, but The Bill or Rights applied only to the General (federal) government. Even so, most Founders were not shy about official (though non-denominational) references to God and His wisdom and blessings.

The federal court’s theft of power was nearly complete by the time Chief Justice Rehnquist, in a disgusted dissenting opinion (Jaffree), reminisced about our fist President George. Washington, on THE VERY DAY the First Amendment passed Congress and at THEIR behest, proclaimed a day of “public thanksgiving and prayer, to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many and signal favors of Almighty God.”

Wrote Rehnquist regarding that event: “History must judge whether it was the Father of our country in 1789, or...the Court...which has strayed from the meaning of the Establishment Clause.”


60 posted on 01/08/2009 12:48:51 PM PST by BuddhaBrown (Path to enlightenment: Four right turns, then go straight until you see the Light!)
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To: doc30

http://www.wallbuilders.com


76 posted on 01/08/2009 1:59:10 PM PST by tpanther (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing---Edmund Burke)
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To: doc30
Most of the Founding Fathers were Deists, not Christian fundamentalists.

Most? Really? Who, and how many, do you count as “founding”? What comprises “most”? Have you an x number out of the total that describes the “most” who were Deists? What do you mean by “fundamentalists”? As a term of common art, “fundamentalist” came into popular usage in the late 1970s when many Christians came to understand the necessity of organizing for political self-defense. Earlier the term was used from time to time as part of the narrative surrounding the events encompassing the First and Second Great Awakenings and the other religious revivals that swept through America from the 1730s right on to the 1930s.

Aside from that alleged vast majority of Deists, what were the religious denominations of those pitifully few Founders who were Christian? You have quite a choice to select from: Methodist, Presbyterian, Dutch Reformed, Congregational, Baptist, German Reformed, Episcopal (High, Low, and Broad), Quaker, and even some Catholic (plus surely one or two more I’ve overlooked). Of these, which ones would you consider “fundamentalist”? All were profoundly impacted by the waves of religious revivalism mentioned above, save Episcopal, Quaker, and Catholic who were little affected or not at all.

The Bill of Rights does contain the Establishment clause and, even though the words “separation of CHurch and State” are not specifically there, the meaning is clear that the government cannot favor any religion.

What do you mean “government cannot favor”? Can you be a little more specific? Here, let me help by providing some examples that you can pass on, yea or nay:

a) An association of Christian students holds regular club meetings after school, and are allowed to use school facilities. Improper favoritism, or a proper practice?

b) Four separate Christian congregations have no place to hold their Sunday services, so county government permits them the use of its court house for a joint service, each denomination taking a week to lead the service. Improper favoritism, or a proper practice?

c) The Federal government permits church services to be held in some of its buildings, including the state department and in the capitol itself. Improper favoritism, or a proper practice?

d) The governing body of a state university decides that it will permit their students to hold morning devotionals before class, and to provide meeting places in the university’s lecture halls. Furthermore, the governing body also decides to permit any divinity schools located in the vicinity to use the same halls for Sunday services. Improper favoritism, or a proper practice?

Finally, in the context of the 1st Amendment, what, specifically, does the term establishment mean?

250 posted on 01/09/2009 5:13:12 PM PST by YHAOS
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To: doc30

“Most of the Founding Fathers were Deists, not Christian fundamentalists.”

That’s BULL. You are a liar or a fool.


314 posted on 01/14/2009 9:34:21 AM PST by demshateGod (the GOP is dead to me)
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