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Posted on 01/11/2009 2:53:36 PM PST by em2vn
I think you’re on the wrong thread, or maybe on the wrong site, or in the wrong universe, or all three.
The Apostle Paul said, “I am determined to know nothing among you save Christ, and him crucified.”
Unfortunately, that’s not a sufficiently sexy subject for some preaching charlatans.
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The Armenian ultimately believes
LOL. Armenians are a nation and ethnic group originating in the Caucasus and in the Armenian Highlands, while Arminians are followers of Jacob Arminius and his followers.
I was predestined to be an Arminian but I’m considering choosing Calvinism.
New tagline.
>> Christianity has always offended religious people, so that doesn’t surprise me.
Agreed. People often get so lost in their own piousness, that they lose the message entirely. Christ Himself offended many ... He spoke to prostitutes and tax collectors — He was controversial — He slammed the pious and embraced the sinner.
I wonder if anyone here actually read the article, or whether they got caught up in the sensational stuff from the beginning. This pastor may have an unorthodox delivery ... but he seems to be EXACTLY on point with a LOT of his overall message.
For instance ...
“What really grates is the portrayal of Jesus as a wimp, or worse. Paintings depict a gentle man embracing children and cuddling lambs. Hymns celebrate his patience and tenderness. The mainstream church, Driscoll has written, has transformed Jesus into “a Richard Simmons, hippie, queer Christ,” a “neutered and limp-wristed popular Sky Fairy of pop culture that . . . would never talk about sin or send anyone to hell.””
This has often bothered me. Christ is ALWAYS portrayed as meek, gentle, quiet, timid, unassuming ... almost a wallflower. This portrayal HAS to be an error. This is a man who literally convinced people, by sight and sound alone, that He was the Son of God. He must have been a commanding presence, a fantastic speaker, and an imposing authoritative figure. Sure, he was kind and gentle, but crowds wouldn’t gather to hear a meek, timid speaker ... they’d gather to hear booming oratory from a man whose presence was commanding.
From the story ... “They [Driscoll’s Calvinists] are not “the next big thing” but a protest movement, defying an evangelical mainstream that, they believe, has gone soft on sin and has watered down the Gospel into a glorified self-help program.”
Honestly, I can get on board with this guy in many respects. I don’t agree with every word he says ... but, I’m a Baptist, not a Calvinist. But, I respect his message, his delivery, and that he reaches an audience that your standard, overly-pious fellowship hall may not reach. He’s not light on sin, he’s not a self-help fellowship ... and he’s bringing people to Christ. Good for him.
And, as for the sexual stuff — there is much to enjoy within the confines of marriage. Obey the Commandments, but enjoy away.
SnakeDoc
I just watched the guy’s message on oral sex. Apparently he takes questions directly from the audience, by text message, and will answer them at his evening service ... which is restricted to adults only. The questions are generally of an adult variety, and the content is therefore risque.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njYE-czENtg
The link is not work safe or kid-friendly ... no visually offensive material, but the content is adult.
The question was ...
“If I’ve given or recieved oral sex, would you consider me a virgin?”
Certainly a risque subject for church, but this is a question that MANY new believers or non-believers must have. This is the kind of question that pastors should be able to answer, and should be happy to answer. This is the kind of practical questions that new or non-believers need to have answered.
His answer was SPOT ON. “I don’t know if I’d consider you a virgin. I’d consider you a sinner that needs to repent.”
Some quotes ... “I would consider you someone that needs to stop.” He called a definition of “sex” that doesn’t include oral sex “convenient”, and specifically named Bill Clinton. He quotes Ephesians saying “Among God’s people there shouldn’t be a hint of immorality,” then concludes that “this would be more than a hint.”
He then says, “the issue is not ‘where is the line?’ [for sexual activity], the issue is ‘when is the time?’” “The issue is not ‘how far can I go?’, the issue is ‘you don’t get going until you’re married’.”
“[Oral sex] is perfectly acceptable in marriage (he mentions Song of Solomon). Just like fire works best in a fireplace, and outside of that, is very dangerous.”
If this response is representative, I completely approve. His answers are well founded Biblically, and he quotes scripture when answering. The content is risque, but relevant. If the question or answer offends delicate ears or pious minds ... then I question your ability to truly evangelize to anyone less pure and pristine than yourself.
SnakeDoc
I’ve been to Mars hill before (went with a buddy who is majoring in biblical text or something like that).
His message was based on scripture, but as I told my friend, there was a lot that made me uncomfortable about being there: the style of music, the clothing, the chapel itself, it all to me just seemed to drive away the spirit.
Seattle is one of the least religious places in America, so I guess whatever he needs to do to fill seats is a good thing, but it really just turned me off.
“marvel ye that, having once rebelled, protestantism veereth into all manner of perversion?”
got that right.
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