Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

On Hyperinflation (Dire predictions. Be forewarned.)
The Market Ticker - Commentary on the Capital Markets ^ | 1/12/09 | Karl Denninger

Posted on 01/12/2009 10:10:30 AM PST by randita

On "Hyperinflation"

The Market Ticker

Monday, January 12. 2009

at 09:44


On "Hyperinflation"

Let's put this to rest right here and now.

"Hyperinflation", or even "Serious Inflation" (similar to what we had in the 1970s) is impossible without a means to transmit the rise in prices into wages.

In today's United States that simply cannot happen for two reasons:

  • The union representation of workers has been eviscerated due to their own idiocy over the previous thirty years. In effect, they have no power to impact economic or labor policy - no matter what Gettlefinger thinks.
  • Outsourcing of work to China, India, Mexico and other nations makes wage demands impossible for American workers to enforce. Such demands simply result in the loss of the job to overseas workers.

As a consequence a hyper-inflationary or even seriously-inflationary spiral is impossible to sustain.

Think about your associates, people who you know in the middle class.

Now consider that a 10% inflation rate (moderately bad "serious inflation" ala 1970s) goes on for four years.

This raises the cost of living for everyone by 46%.

How many people who you know are saving 46% of their income? How many will survive a 46% increase in their cost of living?

Such an outcome will result in half or more of America becoming immediately homeless, hungry, and as a consequence out of work. It will as a consequence crash GDP by 50% or more immediately which in turn will crash income tax receipts by a like amount at both state and federal levels.

This will in turn crash prices, but at that point it's too late as now the price crash in turn destroys what remains of the business community and further crashes tax receipts, while at the same time foreign bond investors throw up their hands and say "screw you!", cutting off all foreign capital inflows to the government.

Down that road lies immediate insurrection - that is, the violent overthrow of the government. You are delusional if you think the military could stop such a thing - 150 million Americans, maybe even 200 million of the 300 million in our population? Not a prayer in hell, even if all the Americans had was pitchforks, torches and a gallon of gasoline, and they don't - they have firearms, and lots of them. Even the Chinese, who are (by demonstrated act) willing to roll tanks over their own people would have no chance against 100 million of their citizens if hunger ever trumps fear.

This didn't happen in the 1970s because we had vastly more union work representation and they were able to force wages to keep pace for the average working man. While the pinch was bad (I grew up in it and remember it vividly) society never degenerated because the self-reinforcing crash of production, jobs and tax income never happened, and as a consequence the sort of mass-unemployment, disenfranchisement and loss of essential human needs did not come about.

Today the average working man works for WalMart or some other non-union shop and has no wage pricing power; ergo, there is absolutely no way to prevent the implosion from initiating.

The government must not engage in any sort of policy that could lead to this outcome. Absolute protection at the top levels of government must be put in place to prevent it, because if this occurs then everything - absolutely everything - that we know and love about America disappears.

This is where the Peter Schiffs and McHughs are wrong in their hyperinflation thesis and their "defensive" measures to try to do something about it (or worse, McHugh's belief that not only is this inevitable but that the government should intentionally cause it through something like a "money drop" to households.)

They are wrong because if this outcome occurs there will be no United States of America, your gold will be confiscated and/or rendered worthless by executive fiat, and at approximately the same time an angry marauding mob consisting of half the population of the country will literally loot and burn everything to the ground.

Vengence inevitably follows when justice is denied for a long enough or in an egregious enough fashion. We have seen this with Rodney King and now with the apparent BART assasination of a suspect in Oakland, and that was one man who was abused at the hands of government. Make the abuse half the population and there is a zero chance that civil and political order is maintained.

Pray that our nation's leaders aren't stupid enough to set in motion such a course of action either by accident or under the foolish belief that they can "keep the outcome under control".

Time is running out to demand and obtain justice folks. America's clock is literally ticking towards zero.

Facebook On "Hyperinflation"

Digg On "Hyperinflation"

Bloglines On "Hyperinflation"

Bookmark On "Hyperinflation"  at YahooMyWeb

Bookmark On "Hyperinflation"  at reddit.com

Bookmark On "Hyperinflation"  at NewsVine

Bookmark On "Hyperinflation"  at blogmarks

Stumble It!

Trackbacks

No Trackbacks

Comments
Discussion takes place at The Tickerforum Comment Zone (registration required to post)

Quicksearch

Calendar

Back

January '09

Forward

Mon Tue

Wed Thu Fri Sat Sun

      1

6

11
13

14 15 16 17 18

19 20 21 22 23

24 25
26 27 28

29 30 31  

2008 Review, 2009 Forecast



Top Referers

www.tickerforum.org (3965)
www.stumbleupon.com (2492)
www.google.com (1353)
ml-implode.com (1186)
patrick.net (1042)
www.denninger.net (811)
www.newsgator.com (275)
www.321gold.com (235)
www.fedupusa.org (230)
my.yahoo.com (223)

Legal Disclaimer

The content on this site is provided without any warranty, express or implied. All opinions expressed on this site are those of the author and may contain errors or omissions.

NO MATERIAL HERE CONSTITUTES "INVESTMENT ADVICE" NOR IS IT A RECOMMENDATION TO BUY OR SELL ANY FINANICAL INSTRUMENT, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO STOCKS, OPTIONS, BONDS OR FUTURES.

The author may have a position in any company or security mentioned herein. Actions you undertake as a consequence of any analysis, opinion or advertisement on this site are your sole responsibility.

Looking for "The Best of Market Ticker"? Check out
Ticker Classics.

Visit the forum to discuss this and other investing-related topics; see the FAQ on the forum for information about Gold Donor status.

All material herein Copyright 2007/2009 Karl Denninger. All rights reserved.

 


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; cwii; economy; government; hyperinflation; moneylist
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 121-134 next last
To: MittFan08
It's hard to buy a billion dollars of mint Babe Ruth cards, or NIB Colt Pythons. Gold is a pain and you have to pay people to store it.

Buying US Treasuries is like becoming Saddams best friend for life. Not so great, but where else do you plop ten million, a hundred million, ten billion dollars and not only have it safe, but a little profit?

41 posted on 01/12/2009 11:11:19 AM PST by Leisler (It is always said it is for the children. (Not your children..others...somewhere))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
The odds are that after just a few years, he will be helpless, hopeless, and prematurely aged by things beyond his power to control.

Photobucket

42 posted on 01/12/2009 11:12:27 AM PST by Jackknife (Chuck Norris grinds his coffee with his teeth, and boils his water with his rage)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: milwguy
If the rest of the world refuses to fund our Trillion $ stimulus package, what then? Supply/demand dynamics can only be delayed for so long, if their is no external demand for the huge bond issuance to come this year from the Gov’t, the yeild must rise to attract buyers.

That will be the tipping point...

43 posted on 01/12/2009 11:13:35 AM PST by GOPJ ("A consensus of 100 scientists is undone by one fact." - - Einstein (take that Al Gore))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: randita

I dunno, I see this all as being a GOOD thing. This is how we get our country back...


44 posted on 01/12/2009 11:17:32 AM PST by wastoute
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: randita

I dunno, I see this all as being a GOOD thing. This is how we get our country back...


45 posted on 01/12/2009 11:17:39 AM PST by wastoute
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: wastoute

Vista


46 posted on 01/12/2009 11:18:02 AM PST by wastoute
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: kingpins9
Fed stopped reporting M3p

Using algebra, couldn't we get this figure ourselves?

We know they're printing at 100% capacity.

I've even heard outsourcing to the Swiss?

47 posted on 01/12/2009 11:18:21 AM PST by norraad ("What light!">Blues Brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: MittFan08
"China will likely try to prod us constructively into more responsible fiscal policies by making threats to do so."

Good luck to them on that. Its never worked when conservatives tried it.

48 posted on 01/12/2009 11:19:23 AM PST by Leisler (It is always said it is for the children. (Not your children..others...somewhere))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: wastoute

“I dunno, I see this all as being a GOOD thing. This is how we get our country back...”

I think illegal immigrants are saying the same thing.


49 posted on 01/12/2009 11:21:38 AM PST by Hacklehead (Liberalism is the art of taking what works, breaking it, and then blaming conservatives.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: hiredhand

same situation here!


50 posted on 01/12/2009 11:27:01 AM PST by woollyone ("When the tide is low, even a shrimp has its own puddle." - Vance Havner)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: GOPJ

During the revolution the Continental Congress printed dollar bills, redeemed in Spanish gold dollars( although they didn’t have any, it was a lie ). When they first came out, a paper dollar would pay a soldiers pay for a month. Seven years later after running the presses, the same bill would buy a small loaf of bread.

The Federal Government will do, take, force, impoverish, print what ever it has to do to take care of those near and dear to it. And, we are not the ones.


51 posted on 01/12/2009 11:27:46 AM PST by Leisler (It is always said it is for the children. (Not your children..others...somewhere))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee; All
Well, the Feds are burning up the presses, printing more & more paper bills,

And...

Giving away trillions ( Gee, I can recall when a billion was Big Bucks... ) of Everybody Else's Money.

This tells me:

1)- Money will be worth less ( or is that worthless? )

2)- We now have a Looter's Economy...


52 posted on 01/12/2009 11:34:31 AM PST by backhoe (All across America, the Lights are going out...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee

Thanks.

Think I’ll try ‘n start me a garden. Beans, ‘taters ‘n ‘maters first, then....


53 posted on 01/12/2009 11:37:25 AM PST by wizr (Jesus, bluegrass, best friends 'n a beer.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: kingpins9

“They don’t want the people to know how much money is actually in circulation.”

I think this is the key when it comes to hyper or runnaway inflation. The article’s author says, “’Hyperinflation’, or even ‘Serious Inflation’ (similar to what we had in the 1970s) is impossible without a means to transmit the rise in prices into wages,” I think is misguided. All that is needed for it to occur is for everyone to think their money is becoming worthless, and for them to get rid of it as soon as possible.


54 posted on 01/12/2009 11:49:05 AM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Jackknife
Pray that our nation's leaders aren't stupid enough to set in motion such a course of action either by accident or under the foolish belief that they can "keep the outcome under control".

Have no fear, Zero's got it all under control!


55 posted on 01/12/2009 11:50:07 AM PST by COBOL2Java (Obamanation: an imploding administration headed by a clueless schmuck)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

“The first is that the typical American is not going to revolt as long as he has a roof over his head, and food in his belly. This was the single reason that ‘Ol’ Frank’ Roosevelt succeeded where Herbert Hoover failed.”

I don’t understand this point. FDR did not put roofs in over the heads and food in the bellies of the general population any better than did Hoover. What worked for Frank, in my opinion, was the beginning of “identity politics,” and the creation of coalitions of voters who depended on a particular candidate to get them goodies. But perhaps that’s what you meant in the first place.


56 posted on 01/12/2009 11:52:30 AM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: sickoflibs

“Liberal Cramer on CNBC says Obama needs to create inflation to start another boom.”

Of course. That’s what we’ve been doing all along, replacing old speculative bubbles and (”clusters of error”) with new speculative bubbles. How could it fail?

What’s that you say? It’s failed a million times already in human history? Well, be that as it may, we can’t just do nothing? What’s that you say? Yes we can? Okay.


57 posted on 01/12/2009 11:55:45 AM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: randita

So far I see deflation happening.

My children’s private school did not raise tuition for the first time in all 8 years by kids have been attending there. They usually raise it by 5-6%.

They are losing families due to rising unemployment/layoffs and therefore are trying to stem the bleeding.


58 posted on 01/12/2009 12:06:23 PM PST by olivia3boys
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: hiredhand
I think I'm changing the subtitle line of my new novel to:

"The long emergency and the struggle for America, through the Greater Depression and Civil War Two."

This country won't come through another depression intact, as a free constitutional republic of 50 states.


59 posted on 01/12/2009 12:11:11 PM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Tublecane; dalereed

FDR created the Federal Surplus Relief Corporation, whose purpose was to do something bizarre. Even in the Dust Bowl years, the rest of America’s farmers produced far too much food, at the same time people were starving. The FSRC was to relieve both of these problems.

This drove prices into the basement at a time when deflation was already bad. A bushel of wheat cost 50 cents, and farmers were burning corn for heat. It was said that agricultural surplus hurt farmers worse than the Dust Bowl.

One of the first actions of the FSRC was to slaughter and dispose of six million pigs. As the saying went at the time, “Then Ol’ Frank killed all the little pigs.” This was done to help the most farmers at once, because pig farming has long been far more decentralized than chicken or beef. Even today, pig farmers will tell you that they always walk the razor’s edge with pork prices. A few pennies in the wrong direction could wipe them out.

On the other side of the coin, the FSRC provided hundreds of tons of food to government and private relief agencies to feed the millions of hungry people.

dalereed: Say what you want about “cash payments to people” welfare, but when people are starving, they will vote for the devil himself if he promises them food.

Hoover was right that his economic program would have restored America faster, but even though he eventually realized that food had to be redistributed, he hesitated just long enough that the hungry public turned on him with fury that still exists. Giving starving people food is not welfare—it is national defense.


60 posted on 01/12/2009 12:43:52 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 56 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 121-134 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson