Posted on 01/22/2009 7:17:29 PM PST by marktwain
The words "liberal" and "Utah" are rarely used in the same sentence, unless you're talking about firearms statutes. Utah's concealed-carry permit law is one of the most liberal, and by that we mean permissive, in the nation.
Utah permits are inexpensive, simple to acquire, slow to expire, easy to renew and are accepted in 32 other states through reciprocity agreements. And, for those reasons, they're the permit of choice for a nation of gun lovers. Approximately half of the new permits issued by the state in recent years have been acquired by nonresidents, many from states with more restrictive laws.
But that could change. There's a gun battle shaping up on Utah's Capitol Hill.
State Sen. Scott McCoy, D-Salt Lake City, fired the first shot last week, filing a bill that would prevent nonresidents from obtaining Utah gun permits. And gun advocates, who claim to have been ambushed by the proposal, appear determined to shoot it down.
There are three good reasons why McCoy's bill should be enacted into law.
First, Utah taxpayers shouldn't have to subsidize the cost of gun permits for anyone, particularly non-Utahns. While the initial application fee of $35 (plus $30.25 for the FBI to process fingerprint cards) covers the cost of criminal background checks and issuing permits, the permits cost only $10 to renew. But the renewal requires the same amount of work by employees at the Utah Department of Public Safety's Bureau of Criminal
Identification. A legislative audit eight years ago determined that the $10 fee doesn't come close to covering the actual costs.
Second, there's no guarantee that out-of-state residents are properly trained. Some out-of-state instructors take shortcuts, and allow applicants to watch a video instead of taking an actual firearms safety course. And, with just three firearms investigators as of last summer, the BCI has a difficult time regulating out-of-state instructors.
Third, while the BCI conducts daily checks of Utah court records to determine if permits should be revoked, disqualifying crimes committed in other states by nonresidents can't be detected until a permit renewal is sought.
Gun-rights advocates criticized McCoy for failing to consult with stakeholder groups before filing the bill. And Charles Hardy, policy director for Gun Owners of Utah, said the measure amounts to an "egregious assault on firearms and the right to self-defense." That's ridiculous.
McCoy's bill isn't anti-gun. It's pro-common sense.
It would be better to do away with the fingerprint requirement altogether!
It’s anti-gun and that’s that.
1. Raise the fee for out of staters. Problem solved.
2. He's saying with a straight face that the state of Utah can guarantee that all resident permit holders are properly trained? I know a load of crap when I hear one.
3. The stated problem doesn't exist. It is absolutely false to assert that Utah can't find out if a permit holder committed a crime in another state until his permit comes up for renewal. It's nothing but a lie. They can find out whenever the heck they want to.
...[S]hall not be infringed. Don’t need a permit to exercise my freedom of religion or my freedom of speech, or a permit to vote, but I need a permit to carry a gun?
Sounds fair. They’ll start issuing abortion permits tomorrow, with the same requirements, right?
LOL
In Alaska no permits required - we are citizens still
DOn’t know for how much longer, but still.....
well thats simple, just raise the price to where it would be the actual cost of a permit
too frickin easy.
Oh well. There’s always Florida
No permits here in VT either. When I bought my pistol I just filled out the 4473, they called it in, I paid and walked out with it. Very easy.
It kind of astounds me( and I’m happy for it). Vermont is such a liberal hellhole in some ways, but in other ways it’s very conservative. Half the hippies up here are armed as well, it’s a very bipolar sort of situation.
LQ
LOL
Gunz & Drugz don’t mix, eh?
But, good for you. Alaska is the free-est place I have lived, NV used to be pretty free, but the Califlowers moved in and runined the place.
I have a class this Saturday to get the UT non-resident permit. I already have my CO CCW permit. Hopefully this bill doesn’t go through and I’ll still be able to get the permit. (crossing fingers)
“Common Sense”
Liberal code words for gun control. There is no known example of a liberal using or promoting common sense.
Sounds like I should keep my Florida permit renewed just in case.
Colorado changed their law not long ago and stopped recognizing out-of-state permits issued to non-residents of that state. Also, Colorado doesn't issue permits to non-residents. As a result, somebody like me, living in an anti-gun hellhole, can't carry in Colorado.
For that reason I will not be visiting Colorado but will plan vacations elsewhere. Perhaps you could work on getting that changed back for me. Meanwhile, I'll work on getting your Colorado permit recognized here in the People's Republic of Kalifornia. .... Really! .... Stop laughing!
Anti-second amendment types always to market their silliness as common sense.
There should be no fees for anyone simply excercising their constitutional rights. Poll taxes are forbidden aren’t they?
Don’t want to hyjack the thread but:
I had a permit in Michigan and moved to state B and also obtained a permit.
During a traffic stop in Michigan, the cop told me that my permit was now invalid since becoming a resident of state B. I was still well within the duration of the Michigan permit.
There was a reciprocity agreement with state B, but the cop claimed he was unaware of it.
This could’ve become a big problem. The cop knew I was right (state B reciprocity) but couldn’t admit to being wrong (cop in control syndrome). He threatened me with felony arrest but needing an out tried to portray himself as being generous and not arrest me.
I wasn’t about to argue.
Anyone know about Michigan permits? Are they invalid once one moves out of state?
Couldn’t find anything in Michigan law. I also contacted MCRGO and they never responded.
They always do and it doesn’t matter where.
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