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To: Troll_House_Cookies
I always thought that good science came out of doubting old scientific theory and finding more/better ways to understand the world with new scientific theory. I always thought this was the way science “progressed.” But in this day and age, if you dare merely to question the science (global warming, evolution) then you’re a “buffoon” worthy of ridicule.

Very sad.

But you are missing the point. When you question a scientific theory you need to bring scientific evidence, not religious belief, as creation "science" does.

These "weaknesses" that were discussed, but not included, consist of hundreds of creationists' claims that have long since been refuted by scientific evidence. Why should they continue to be hashed out?

In grad school there was a seminar course titled something like "Problems in Evolution." I took it three times, as the subject matter changed to match current scientific findings and debates. Not a one of the standard creationist talking points was ever discussed, as they are simply "what if" stories with no scientific evidence to support them. They've long since been settled by science, and science has moved on. Creationists haven't kept up.

A good example--upthread is a comment disparaging evolutionary science for the lack of a "missing link." That's a phoney issue, and reflects a belief in creation "science" rather than a knowledge of science. See the chart below--which is the "missing link?"


21 posted on 01/23/2009 10:34:32 AM PST by Coyoteman (Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.)
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To: Coyoteman
But you are missing the point. When you question a scientific theory you need to bring scientific evidence, not religious belief, as creation "science" does.

That's just it, however. To actually believe all of this evolutionist nonsense, one basically has to suspend disbelief and approach the matter from the perspective of simple, blind faith.

For instance, there is no reason - none in the world - to think that the cladogram which you posted has any relevance to anything at all. It's just some palaeontologist arranging a variety of human and primate skulls, in various states of quality, into a structure that he or she thought looked like it fit together, assuming the unproven evolutionist paradigm. The actual dates given, as well as the actual arrangement of supposed evolutionary ancestors and descendants, have no actual, independent relevance. The whole structure is based on circular reasoning.

23 posted on 01/23/2009 10:39:59 AM PST by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (Nihil utile nisi quod honestum - Marcus Tullius Cicero)
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To: Coyoteman

[[Why should they continue to be hashed out?]]

Why? To expose how phony those ‘descritings’ really are, and how much htey rely on religious propoganda to ‘discredit’ instead of actual science, and to keep exposing the absurdity of claims such as the chart you posted- that’s why- Because the actual science betrays your beleif- that’s why- because hte actual scientific facts and evidences show common design, and discontinuity, and biological impossibilites, manthematical, chemical, and natural impossibilites, not common descent as has been preached for 150 years- that’s why- Because Kids DESERVE the truth- not religious propoganda of Darwinism that preaches faith in nature despite the growing scientific evidence agaisnt it- that’s why.


24 posted on 01/23/2009 10:41:29 AM PST by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: Coyoteman
Nice chart!

You could put together a much mopre convincing one using the skulls of the canis.

See http://www.skullsunlimited.com/domestic-dog-breed-skulls.htm

Pretty charts with skulls all arranged with connceting lines and time scales proves nothing other that the 3rd grade ability to create mobiles out of coat hangers and magazine pictures.

That is the VERY reason children need to critically evaluate your absurd ToE!!!

37 posted on 01/23/2009 11:46:27 AM PST by jimmyray
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To: Coyoteman
Heck, I'll even give it a try! This series finishes at the top with the common Shetland Collie, but started 30 million years ago with the Chiwawarex Snipicanus, first discovered in 1927 by Leroy Buffoonoxi in a West Pyranees dig. While not being as open to scientific interpretation as a few fragements of skull and a couple of teeth, the complete skull in convincing in it's own right.








39 posted on 01/23/2009 11:57:35 AM PST by jimmyray
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To: Coyoteman
See the chart below--which is the "missing link?"

See if you can find the missing link in this series. I can figure what order they go in, could you help. I can't provide ages for the rocks each skull was discovered in, though.

NOTE: Skull pictures size is not idicative a relative sizes of actual skulls.

44 posted on 01/23/2009 12:45:01 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: Coyoteman; GodGunsGuts; metmom; YHAOS

But you are missing the point. When you question a scientific theory you need to bring scientific evidence, not religious belief, as creation “science” does.


You’ve been debunked on this point a million times, so why do you continue lying like this?

Is there something science-hating or even religious in these observations?>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

As a chemist, the most fascinating issue for me revolves around the origin of life. Before life began, there was no biology, only chemistry – and chemistry is the same for all time. What works (or not) today, worked (or not) back in the beginning. So, our ideas about what happened on Earth prior to the emergence of life are eminently testable in the lab. And what we have seen thus far when the reactions are left unguided as they would be in the natural world is not much. Indeed, the decomposition reactions and competing reactions out distance the synthetic reactions by far. It is only when an intelligent agent (such as a scientist or graduate student) intervenes and “tweaks” the reactions conditions “just right” do we see any progress at all, and even then it is still quite limited and very far from where we need to get. Thus, it is the very chemistry that speaks of a need for something more than just time and chance. And whether that be simply a highly specified set of initial conditions (fine-tuning) or some form of continual guidance until life ultimately emerges is still unknown. But what we do know is the random chemical reactions are both woefully insufficient and are often working against the pathways needed to succeed. For these reasons I have serious doubts about whether the current Darwinian paradigm will ever make additional progress in this area.

Edward Peltzer
Ph.D. Oceanography, University of California, San Diego (Scripps Institute)
Associate Editor, Marine Chemistry


54 posted on 01/23/2009 3:15:25 PM PST by tpanther (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing---Edmund Burke)
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