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1 posted on 04/25/2009 8:51:28 PM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem
But on March 24, after interviewing one of the MIT professors who conducted the study on which the GOP relied to produce its estimate, the St. Petersburg Times fact-check unit, Politifact, declared the GOP figure of $3,100 per household was a "Pants on Fire" falsehood. The GOP claim is "just wrong," MIT professor John Reilly told Politifact. "It's wrong in so many ways it's hard to begin."

I'm sure it's wrong, too. It's probably too low.

2 posted on 04/25/2009 8:58:25 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: neverdem
ANYTHING that costs cash strapped (many unemployed and some fearing unemployment on a daily basis) citizens will be an excessive burden.

Surmising the endless stream of available government money is translated by goverment bean-counters as likely the same for American households. They would be WRONG and severely underestimating the burden they will be creating.

3 posted on 04/25/2009 9:01:45 PM PDT by MamaDearest
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To: neverdem

I think glo-bull warming is one of the biggest pieces of crap to come down the pike in a long time - but - the first part of a book titled “how to lie with statistics” which was written in the 30s and which I got from my grand pa - deals with never letting yourself be roped into revealing the mean.

Always, always, always use averages if you intend to deceive.

There aren’t good enough numbers in this to evaluate it.
But the strict use of averages makes it highly suspect. Let the DUmmies do the spinning.


4 posted on 04/25/2009 9:05:16 PM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: neverdem

With all the nObama prosperity that should be flooding the nation, it will be a mere pittance for each household to cough up another $260 a month!

Extreme Sarcasm.


6 posted on 04/25/2009 9:14:23 PM PDT by Reddy
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To: wardaddy; Joe Brower; Cannoneer No. 4; Criminal Number 18F; Dan from Michigan; Eaker; Jeff Head; ...
A Gannett paper allowed this guest OpEd in Missouri.

Well-informed voters must not allow laws for cap-and-trade

Don’t Waste Time Cutting Emissions NY Times guest OpEd

Will California Shuck Corn Ethanol?

Some noteworthy articles about politics, foreign or military affairs, IMHO, FReepmail me if you want on or off my list.

8 posted on 04/25/2009 9:58:09 PM PDT by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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To: neverdem

Great Post, everyone should read this.

This is still a huge understatement in the cost, Manufacturers aren’t going to get some of the money returned to them, and if they did it would be a world trade organization violation.

Bottom line, you can say bye to manufacturing.


9 posted on 04/25/2009 10:05:12 PM PDT by dila813
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To: neverdem
There was a very good argument against Cap and Trade yesterday on the radio. The ham sandwich argument.

While Cap and Trade will affect energy consumers in slightly higher electric bills, gas and oil costs, it affects businesses across the country with higher overhead costs which in the end will be passed on to consumers, clients and patrons everywhere and in every enterprise.

The farmer's cost growing wheat increases, the baker's cost of baking the bread increases, the packing house's cost of baking the ham increases, the distributor's costs increases and your lunch goes from $5 to $10 in the stroke of a pen.

Ain't gonna be 99 cent McMuffins any more. Hasta la vista to free refills on coffee and drinks.

The $3200 figure is Low Ball.
11 posted on 04/25/2009 10:37:12 PM PDT by BIGLOOK (Keelhaul Congress! It's the sensible solution to restore Command to the People.)
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To: neverdem
The only way that money does not get recycled to the "average" household is if it is spent on something that provides no useful service for anyone--that it is true government waste.

If I was a betting man that is where I would put my money. For example

Congressional Democrats have left the door open to spending the revenues to "invest in clean energy jobs and cost-saving energy efficient technology," as Rep. Markey's staffers have written.

Democrats trolling for campaign cash by sending tax dollars to useless start ups that could not make a profit with out government subsidy

13 posted on 04/25/2009 10:43:35 PM PDT by Pontiac (Your message here.)
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To: neverdem

Cap & Trade: Even More Expensive Than Thought The fact is, cap and trade is going to cost taxpayers significantly more than the measly $13/week tax cut that the Democrats and the left are so excited about. While the $3,900 cost cited by John McCormack is an accurate accounting of what Reilly’s study portends, even that is probably an unrealistically low estimate.
http://www.qando.net/?p=2214


16 posted on 04/25/2009 11:22:33 PM PDT by anglian
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To: neverdem

I get it!

Taxes don’t cost anybody ANYTHING, because the government is going to SPEND the taxes on GOOD THINGS!


17 posted on 04/26/2009 1:17:46 AM PDT by Arthur McGowan (If Bishop D'Arcy finds out a priest is molesting kids, he will boycott the parish's Fall Supper!!!)
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To: neverdem

Whatever the true cost, this cap and trade baloney is like attaching a one pound or more weight to the leg of sprinter, and then claiming the runner can still run almost as fast as he or she could before the weight was put on. The question is: why put the weight on in the first place?


19 posted on 04/26/2009 1:57:09 AM PDT by driftless2 (four)
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To: FrPR; enough_idiocy; Desdemona; rdl6989; Little Bill; IrishCatholic; Normandy; ...
 


Beam me to Planet Gore !

21 posted on 04/26/2009 2:57:40 AM PDT by steelyourfaith ("The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money." -Lady Thatcher)
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To: neverdem

Cap and trade is an outrageous sam, a tax on air. It is merely a fig leaf to cover sucking money from the populace.

There is but one course....... exterminate the scammers


22 posted on 04/26/2009 4:41:05 AM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 . Crucify ! Crucify ! Crucify him!!)
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To: neverdem
1913 Congress re-adopted the income tax that same year, levying a 1% tax on net personal incomes above $3,000, with a 6% surtax on incomes above $500,000.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

When Lyndon Johnson left the presidency in 1969, he left behind the legacy of a transformed federal government. At the end of the Eisenhower presidency in 1961, there were only 45 domestic social programs. By 1969 the number had climbed to 435. Federal social spending, excluding Social Security, rose from $9.9 billion in 1960 to $25.6 billion in 1968

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I'm sure cap and trade will never cost very much. Alarmist wackos are standing in the way of the Messiah saving the planet. How could they! (/sarcasm off!)

23 posted on 04/26/2009 5:05:58 AM PDT by listenhillary (Rahm Emmanuel slip - A crisis is a terrible thing to waste.)
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To: neverdem

If the feds refund the $3,128 (average) to the people, then the feds won’t be able to use any of that money to fund alternative energy research. I thought part of Zero’s sales pitch was that the extra ‘fees’ on fossil fuel energy would fund such research. No?

The same money can’t be used for both purposes at the same time.

BTW, $3,128 is very close to what we pay each year for gas and electric combined. Zero and Nostrilitis will double my gas and electric costs????? What great guys.


24 posted on 04/26/2009 5:21:16 AM PDT by savedbygrace (You are only leading if someone follows. Otherwise, you just wandered off... [Smokin' Joe])
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To: neverdem

I’d be willing to pay the 3,900 for one year if it would wake people up to what the Dems have in mind for this country.


28 posted on 04/26/2009 6:24:16 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: neverdem
3K is just the tip of the iceberg....the number of job losses and the decimation to small businesses would be far reacjing...

....IMHO....this will be the straw that breaks the camels back....

The US electorate has elected left wing radicals to high powers of influence....what did they expect would occur....being lazy and naive is not an excuse...theie history and words were available for everyone to see...just because we chose to ignore it and be led like lemmings...well....now we see the end product of our collective efforts....

We may fondly be remembered as the "Least Generation"...the generation that ushered in the destruction of the greatest nation that ever existed....
30 posted on 04/26/2009 7:11:36 AM PDT by PigRigger (Donate to http://www.AdoptAPlatoon.org - The Troops have our front covered, let's guard their backs!)
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To: neverdem

BTT

Europe’s experiment with cap and trade has turned into a bureaucratic mess that has failed to live up to its initial expectations. A report by the GAO reveals that the supply of carbon permits has exceeded the demand causing allowance prices to fall substantially. This policy failure has caused the European economy to suffer and expectations to reduce CO2 emissions have been lowered.

Additionally, Europe’s cap and trade experiment has led to decreased employment opportunities and higher energy prices across the continent. In France manufacturers have packed up and left for Morocco. In the Netherlands factories are forced to close early to meet emissions standards. In Germany energy prices have risen 5% each year sparking widespread outrage. All across Europe evidence shows that cap and trade has hurt the economy. If the United States implements a European style cap and trade system, estimates http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d09423t.pdf show that it could wipe out between 1.2-1.8 million American jobs by 2020.

Cap & Trade: Bad for Europe, Wrong for America By Lee Lukoff http://americansolutions.dev2.apperceptive.com/energy/2009/04/cap-trade-bad-for-europe-wrong-for-america.php


31 posted on 04/26/2009 9:28:04 AM PDT by anglian (0bama's Stealth Reparations: "Mouthfulls of 'Gimme' and handfulls of 'Much 0bliged'")
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To: neverdem; 11B40; A Balrog of Morgoth; A message; ACelt; Aeronaut; AFPhys; AlexW; America_Right; ...
DOOMAGE!

Global Warming PING!

You have been pinged because of your interest in environmentalism, alarmist wackos, mainstream media doomsday hype, and other issues pertaining to global warming.

Freep-mail me to get on or off: Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to all note-worthy threads on global warming.

Overweight? You're causing the climate to change...

Fear over higher costs looms over climate debate

Climate change hearings reveal divide

Global warming on Free Republic

Latest from Global Warming News Site

Latest from Greenie Watch

32 posted on 04/26/2009 5:24:42 PM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Barack Obama: in your guts, you know he's nuts!)
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To: neverdem
Downward pressure on prices affects wellhead prices as well. Which means there is a distinct disincentive to replace depleted wells with new production, which causes price increases for gas and oil, and eventually another price bubble like the one we just went through as supplie get tight. This is not a viable energy policy for the long term if the government is going to be muching around with the consumer cost, and the real pain is in the future, not just the extra cost on implementation.

In addition, heat is not optional, expecially in colder areas in the country where we already have plenty of clean air and subzero winter temperatures are the norm.

33 posted on 04/26/2009 7:31:24 PM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing.)
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