Tiller supporter: 'You people disgust me'

Renew America ^ | June 3, 2009 | Matt C. Abbott

[ReformationFan]

I love it when a reader decides to send a nasty e-mail from his company e-mail address in response to one of my columns.

In this case, the e-mail came from Brian Sturtevant of Southern California Edison, who obviously disdains pro-lifers. Mr. Sturtevant wrote:

'You people disgust me. Although, I suppose we should all thank you.....in exchange for the murder of one American hero, we now have a National Martyr who will serve as an effective recruitment tool for the rights of women for decades to come. I expect to see all of you pushed back into the cave from which you crawled over the next eight years.'

One would hope Mr. Sturtevant isn't speaking on behalf of Southern California Edison, although it's interesting that he uses "we" twice. So I decided to send an e-mail to SCE's media relations department:

Dear Sir/Madam —

I received the [above] e-mail from an individual apparently connected to your company. The executives at your company should be aware that an employee has sent out a nasty e-mail from his company e-mail account that has nothing to do with the work of SCE.

Respectfully, Matt C. Abbott Catholic Internet columnist www.renewamerica.us

Thus far there has been no response from SCE officials, but if and when I receive one, I may print it.

[ketsu]

This guy is too stupid to breath on his own. First off Tiller will never be an American Hero. While the media made a lot of noise about the murder, most Americans can not reconcile late term abortions with the so called right to choose. Politicians still view abortion as a third rail and those that advocate the murder of the unborn will find it difficult to use Tiller as a tool against the forces of good.

Most of the children Tiller aborted were encephalitics, down syndrome etc... That's also why he had the graveyard.

Tiller was a far more complex character than you give him credit for. There are a ton of testimonials popping up from women that aborted various children with (admittedly horrible) birth defects that consider Tiller the best thing since sliced bread.

Conservatives aren't doing themselves much good here.

[mad_as_he$$]

That's what they want. Every time I meet one in person I offer to hold the door to suicide for them so they can be a shining example of doing what they preach.

[ketsu]

I consider Tiller and his ilk more along the lines of Henry Lee Lucas, The Zodiac, Jeffrey Dahmer, etc. The difference is that the abortionists are intelligent enough to use legal means to satisfy their blood lust. Because of that, they can indulge in their enjoyment of causing pain, suffering, and death, and their hatred of women--and get rich and have useful idiots singing their praises all at the same time. For those without souls, it's a win-win situation.

You don't understand abortionists. A serial killer is inherently selfish. They *use* people to satisfy their own needs. An old school abortionist, especially one who grew up in the "coathanger" era, views themselves as a public servant, preventing women from having to suffer what they did in the past.

What they do may or may not be evil, but abortionists tend to be fundamentally different types of human beings than you group them with.

[exit82]

Most of the children Tiller aborted were encephalitics, down syndrome etc... That's also why he had the graveyard. Tiller was a far more complex character than you give him credit for. There are a ton of testimonials popping up from women that aborted various children with (admittedly horrible) birth defects that consider Tiller the best thing since sliced bread.

Yes, a regular angel of mercy this guy was.

You're not familiar with the disinformation tactics of the pro-aborts, are you?

[exit82]

What they do may or may not be evil, but abortionists tend to be fundamentally different types of human beings than you group them with.

You should be ashamed of that first phrase, especially for someone who has been here five years.

They may absolve themselves for the EVIL they engage in by calling themselves public servants, but that is a lie to themselves and to us.

It's all about the money. Most abortionists are low graded doctors. You don't have the brilliant practitioners doing this for a living.

[Let's Roll]

Oh, yeah, real effective with 80% of the American people repulsed by PBA or as tiller preferred calling them “late term abortions”.

We call them “viable” babies.

[MHGinTN]

Um, were these Downs children alive prior to George Tiller killing them? Were these children at an age making them ‘viable’ outside of the womb? Do you do serial killing of alive unborn? Do you even have a medical degree? ... Very creidible physicians who were brought in to review the cases Tiller was brought to trial over have stated that he did kill children who did not ‘fit’ into the parameters of Kansas law, but the governor of Kansas protect him from having these testimonies used in his trial. George Tiller was a stone, cold, murdering monster. How many Downs children do you think should be snuffed out, since you appear to believe the viable preborn Downs children are fair game for a serial murderer?

[big'ol_freeper]

What a moron.

[ketsu]

Yes, a regular angel of mercy this guy was.

You're not familiar with the disinformation tactics of the pro-aborts, are you?

I know *tons* of liberal doctors. I've also had friends that have *had* abortions and told me about the experience. Things are more complex than you think.

It's all well and good to say the practice is wrong or even evil. But thinking of abortionists as evil snidley whiplash types is laughable. They *really* do believe in what they're doing. Otherwise they wouldn't put up with the protests.

Truly evil and selfish doctors get into plastic surgery.

[ketsu]

You should be ashamed of that first phrase, especially for someone who has been here five years.

They may absolve themselves for the EVIL they engage in by calling themselves public servants, but that is a lie to themselves and to us.

It's all about the money. Most abortionists are low graded doctors. You don't have the brilliant practitioners doing this for a living.

Not really. I've lived among liberals and conservatives all of my life. I think I have a pretty good handle on the liberal mindset.

Again, you're deluding yourself if you think it's about money. A bad doctor can make far more with less hassle as a psychiatrist or plastic surgeon.

[Let's Roll]

fixing

[ketsu]

Um, were these Downs children alive prior to George Tiller killing them? Were these children at an age making them ‘viable’ outside of the womb? Do you do serial killing of alive unborn? Do you even have a medical degree? ... Very creidible physicians who were brought in to review the cases Tiller was brought to trial over have stated that he did kill children who did not ‘fit’ into the parameters of Kansas law, but the governor of Kansas protect him from having these testimonies used in his trial. George Tiller was a stone, cold, murdering monster. How many Downs children do you think should be snuffed out, since you appear to believe the viable preborn Downs children are fair game for a serial murderer?

Huh? I don't think you understood what I wrote at all. I wasn't talking about the morality/legality of Tiller's actions. I was talking about *the liberal mindset* and its reaction to Tiller's killing.

I will tell you something to get you riled up though. I've spent a good part of my life in Japan, where abortion is extremely common and matter of fact. In fact it was possible to "abort" a child after it was born up until the 70's/80's. You just didn't put it on your family register and took it down to the neighborhood abortionist. A great book that talks about this is Kenzaburo Oe's "A personal matter".

[MHGinTN]

Actually, you have been posting assertions aimed at graying out the evil George Tiller committed, as if it is not by liberal standards so bad and even a public service. You chose to approach this topic in such a way as to give 'wiggle room' to a stone cold serial murderer, as if killing Downs children is not so bad, and killing alive unborn children with enlarged brains is not so bad as the method used would indicate, that we poor deluded conservatives are not doing ourselves any favors by telling the fact of George Tiller, serial killer.

If you were a truthful person, you would not let slip with such exposure as 'Tiller was a far more complex character than you give him credit for ... Conservatives aren't doing themselves much good here' then try to paint yourself as merely being objective. Why not just admit that you make few distinction along lines of right and wrong, that the circumstances determine which way you'll come down on an issue?

[exit82]

You’re selling ice to an Eskimo on this topic.

I’ve been on the front lines of this issue for more than 20 years, in every facet.

I don’t agree with your assessment. The abortion field is full of the sidney whiplash types, deceit, uninspected facilties, and unprofessional behavior. These doctors, like Tiller, believe so much in what they are doing that they made a LOT of money selling parts of aborted babies.

It’s all about the money.

[Campion]

Most of the children Tiller aborted were encephalitics, down syndrome etc

We have this incredible, insane idea that they're still *people*, and have right to live, not to be treated as disposable mistakes. Murdering a Down's syndrome baby is still murder.

As far as abortionists being "complex characters" and thinking of themselves as public servants, who cares. Plenty of mass murderers have developed elaborate moral justifications for what they do.

[exDemMom]

You don't understand abortionists. A serial killer is inherently selfish. They *use* people to satisfy their own needs. An old school abortionist, especially one who grew up in the "coathanger" era, views themselves as a public servant, preventing women from having to suffer what they did in the past.

What they do may or may not be evil, but abortionists tend to be fundamentally different types of human beings than you group them with.

I do not have any desire to understand an abortionist. The thought processes of someone who has chosen to kill both for money and pleasure are not things that I wish to dwell on.

There is no reason to believe that abortionists are anything other than how I characterized them previously, while there is plenty of evidence to believe they are exactly how I described.

1) There never was a time when it was commonly accepted scientific dogma that life is not present in the fetus until some triggering event occurs and causes the fetus to become alive. That was always propaganda put out by the abortion industry to keep business coming.

2) The vast majority of abortions are for birth control purposes. This has always been true, whether abortion was legal or not. Abortionists have always been aware of that. There is also no rational, convincing way to argue that a woman's convenience is more valuable than a human life. Therefore, the supposedly high-minded rationalizations that abortionists make for doing abortions rather than actually helping people are no more than marketing ploys.

3) No one lies to someone for the benefit of the person being told the lie. Lies are always self-serving to the liar. Since the abortion industry cannot survive without lies, the logical conclusion is that those who are in that business have a profound disrespect and disregard for women, i.e., misogyny.

4) Try reading the words of an abortionist. At the very least, they come across as profoundly unempathetic--there are no normal human feelings at all towards the babies they kill. The words of Tiller and Hern, especially, convey not merely a lack of empathy towards their victims, but a distinct pleasure in the pain and suffering they cause. They are monsters.

[Charlespg]

I wish the supporters of tiller would abort themselves

[Mom MD]

reconstructing someones face after a horrible accident is selfish and evil?

Killing a baby in the womb days before it is born is not evil?

You have a strange definition of evil....

[Fzob]

I’m sure Tiller was complex. He must have been to rationalize his actions. Perhaps it’s not politically expedite to call Tiller a murderer, perhaps it’s not in conservatives best interests to speak out about late term abortions, but no matter what Tiller’s excuse, he is still murdering a person. In the big picture it is a unspeakable crime to murder the innocent no mater how bloody well intended you are.

[ketsu]

I’m sure Tiller was complex. He must have been to rationalize his actions. Perhaps it’s not politically expedite to call Tiller a murderer, perhaps it’s not in conservatives best interests to speak out about late term abortions, but no matter what Tiller’s excuse, he is still murdering a person. In the big picture it is a unspeakable crime to murder the innocent no mater how bloody well intended you are.

Conservatives really don't understand the liberal mindset. Liberals don't believe in a god, nor a soul. To a liberal humans are defined by their experience. A baby, because it has no experience, is not yet a person. You're snuffing out a *potential* human being, but not a human being as far as their concerned.

I'm not asking for political expedience, what I'm arguing is that conservatives, by *not understanding the liberal mindset* are ruining any chance they have at convincing other people of their point of view.

All this "nobody will lionize Tiller because he kills babies" stuff won't work, because as far as the people who supported Tiller are concerned Tiller saved parents from the agony of having to watch their children be born just to have a terrible life.

There are plenty of arguments that you can make against this position. But so far conservative discourse regarding Tiller's death really hasn't understood the other side's opinions. Which is why comments like "Nobody will consider Tiller a hero" can be made with a straight face.

There are *tons* of liberals that are going to use this as a rallying call. And you can bet that Obama is going to use this as a bludgeon against conservative interests.

Just don't say I didn't warn you.