Skip to comments.Evolution Embedded in American Thought (polls show our Judeo-Christian heritage is eroding)
Posted on 08/28/2009 8:53:44 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
Polling data has revealed a trend indicating that America is not a Christian nation. Although a large majority of Americans outwardly claim to be Christian, their inward beliefs are actually non-Christian. Why is this so?
Classic Christianity is based on certain fundamental doctrines that are clearly taught in the Bible, such as the universality of sin, the universality of access to the Savior, and the exclusivity of that Savior. But apparently, many of those who call themselves Christians deny that Jesus Christ is the only Savior.
Newsweek reported, According to a 2008 Pew Forum survey, 65 percent of us believe that many religions can lead to eternal life, but 76 percent of us continue to identify as Christian. What kind of Christianity denies the very Christ for whom it is named?
The Bible speaks of a future time when...
(Excerpt) Read more at icr.org ...
With a heavy heart...ping.
And the effect is evident........
It is entirely possible to be a good Christian and accept the possibility of Evolution.
We should NOT be forced into an “either / OR” decision.
Thanks for the ping!
Exactly right...Christianity and evolution are compatible.
If evolution is true, then we must view the story of the Garden of Eden and original sin as nothing more than allegory. This viewpoint, however, severely undermines the significance of Christ's sinless life and sacrificial death on the cross because the Bible presents Jesus as analogous to Adam.
Evolution is a big part of the denial. It's banged into the heads of your kids. They can't explain the “big bang” but that doesn't matter. They tell your kids it took millions and millions of years for humans to “evolve”. The Bible states six, 24 hour days were needed to create all we see and don't see and humans existed with dinos. The Bible doesn't endorse any kind of evolution unless you want to believe the “image” of God is that of an animal that “evolved”.
Of course the Judeo Christian God is no animal and never “evolved”. He always was and always will be. He is God and we are not. Would you prefer a God that you can trump intellectually> Or have your God be superior to you - intellectually and otherwise?
This stuff is what makes kids atheists. There is no tolerance for God. Anyone who believes in evolution and what I briefly mentioned is rejecting God and calling him a liar. Yes, it might make a few feel bad. They'd like to believe in God - cafeteria style but it doesn't work like that. You can't accept some of it and reject other parts. I hope you don't find out the hard way ... that I am right in what I state.
 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
Yes they are lying and people re believing them.
Bible based Christianity is INCLUSIVE but the teachings are EXCLUSIVE. Something is either TRUE or FALSE.
 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Many are being conformed to this world. It's easier. They are cowards. They "fit in" better. They are LAZY. They don't want to dig our objective scientific facts to defend Him. Heck, if you don't defend Him, WHY should be KNOW YOU or look out for you? He won't.
When you deny Him, why wouldn't Christ deny you?
He is warning you:
 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Laugh, ridicule me or whatever you want, I'm telling you the TRUTH. Be careful. Eternity is a long time to spend with evil people. It's a CHOICE that each individual, not the "community" or "group" will have to make.
You need to choose which you will serve: God or god.
We should NOT be forced into an either / OR decision.
God stated what He did.
You either believe Him or you believe imperfect people that openly DENY Him.
You are not “forced” into believing in Him.
It is a CHOICE!
Evolution is NOT Christian.
It never has been Christian and it never will be Christian.
Sure call me names. Call me “intolerant.
It doesn't matter. It leaves me rolling my eyes in amusement when others do that. Name calling will never change His truth. It is a “either/or” decision. EITHER you believe Him and what is stated in the Bible OR you do not. It's that simple and straight forward. Luke warm people will be spit out of His mouth. He clearly lays out where He is coming from:
 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
You do Christians a disservice by suggesting to be a fence sitter is okay with God. It is NOT okay with God. Compassion is not about COMPROMISE on PRICIPLES. Surely you have seen that fail in the secular political world. Well, it works the same way in the world of Christianity - regardless of how you “feel” about it.
You need to choose which you will serve: God or god.
It’s an INDIVIDUAL choice.
I’ll serve the bigger one.
That’s right. We need to STAND UP and SPEAK BOLDLY! SILENT NO MORE. SILENCE IS CONSENT.
It is entirely possible to believe in BOTH Evolution and Christianity.
IMHO, God will laugh at the nuts on both sides of this stupid argument, when your times comes, you will see that HE does have a sense of humor.
This is a nonsense article. Evolutionary principles are not incompatible with christianity. That is like saying double entry accounting is incompatible with christianity.
Seems you can have entirely 2000 years consistent christianity without the political creationism debate.
If “Christian” means that you believe that Man walked the Earth at the same time as dinosaurs........then we are most certainly not a “Christian nation.”
Every SINGLE person who authored, edited, or compiled the various books of the Bible was Human and subject to Human error.
More to the point, if you were to try and make the point, to uneducated, illiterate tribal people, that God created Heaven and Earth, and Man, and try hard, to make that statement, with as few scientific conflicts as possible, yet still make your work understandable to such folks, before anyone understood cell structure, DNA or anything about modern science -—
You would be hard pressed to do a better job than Genesis.
It is rather egotistical for any of us to believe that was was written, centuries ago, was meant only for our eyes.
The audience at the time must be taken into account.
If you do not have the faith to believe that all things are possible with God, it is your faith which is weak, not mine.
Only if God lied when He told us....
Gen 2:7 Then the LORD God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.
Gen 2:19 Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature, that was its name.
If you wanted to explain cell structure, DNA and biology to ancient people, what smaller particle could they understand, than “dust”??
And, why do nuts on the right get outraged over the idea that evolution says that “man came from slime” -—
When nuts on the right have no problem with the idea that man came from “dust”???
Look up “dust” would you please?
House dust is dust mite poop.
“Humas” is the decayed vegetable and animal matter that makes for fertile soil.
And “Breathed Life” is a Biblical phrase that does not require a literal interpretation.
It amazes me that Biblical literalists, who avoid or ignore quotes like:
“This is my body, this is my Blood”
“Do this in memory of me”
“Peter, you are rock, and upon this rock I will build my Church” -—
and -— who ignore the fact that Jesus drank alcohol, in the form of WINE -—
Try to force the stupid idea on us that all of Genesis must be taken literally.
More to the point:
GOD DOES NOT GIVE A RIP ABOUT ANY OF OUR OPINIONS ON THIS MATTER!
nice mirror...great for the bedroom...for young marrieds..lol
but what’s yer point?
There, fixed it.
There's no more reason to believe that the ToE is true than the Bible, if you're going to strip the Bible of it's credibility like that.
Another evo stating that if you don't believe as the evos do, then your faith is weak.
Who made you the judge of what is strong faith and what is weak faith and on what basis? What is the Scriptural criteria that you use to make that determination?
It's odd that evos accuse creationists of having weak faith when evos depend so heavily on evidence and then turn around and accuse creationists who supply evidence to support their viewpoint of having weak faith because they depend on evidence, not faith.
So, which is it evos?
Does depending on evidence demonstrate weak faith, or does depending on God demonstrate weak faith?
Creationists are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
If they use evidence, they have weak faith. If they don't accept the ToE which depends on evidence, they have weak faith.
Not after two world wars and 100+ million dead.
>> Every SINGLE person who authored, edited, or compiled the various books of the Bible was Human and subject to Human error.
An idolater is a person who worships a man-made object. Anybody here fall into that category?
You strict Creationists slur the faith of those who are open to the subject of Evolution -—
Yet you get all insulted when we tell you that YOUR faith is lacking.
There is no moral justification for you to question the faith of those of us to disagree with you on this issue.
There is great moral justification for me to question your faith, if you can not be humble enough to admit what we all simply will not know for sure until our own deaths.
God will laugh at you on this subject.
I am sure, however, that He will have some words for me, on other subjects.
If you do not have the faith to believe that all things are possible with God, it is your faith which is weak, not mine.
The Bible makes the claim for itself that it is inspired and preserved, which means that the humans involved in writing (not authoring) and editing it were supernaturally preserved from error and perfectly transmitted the message God wanted us to have.
Since you're arguing that all things are possible with God, then surely you have no problem accepting the perfect inspiration and preservation of Scripture, do you?
So the mirror is for the Creationist, to see themselves.
He clearly and boldly called those who said ONLY the Bible could be used as a basis of faith: IDOL Worshipers!
Now where does the Bible claim the authority that Bible-only Christians claim that the Bible has.
However, you Protestants often use it as part of “The Lord’s Prayer” -—
The words are actually “gloss” from a Catholic Monk.
The Bible is subject to error on minor details.
The Bible is intended to teach us how to live, and not intended for any scientific or historical purpose outside of that Divine purpose!
Thanks for sharing your insights, dear sister in Christ!
Science indicates to me that some degree of evolution occurs in species’ genes.
Religion informs me that God directs all.
What’s the problem?
Ah, but you just told us that all things are possible for God. Are you saying that this is NOT the case with regards to the inspiration and preservation of Scripture, all on the basis of some garbage dumped out by some Presbyterian convert to Catholicism a hundred years ago?
I don’t know that worship is the right word — but I believe and follow what I think is the core message of Christianity. It isn’t written down succinctly anywhere.
1) Trust in God. (faith)
2) Tough it out. (stoicism)
3) Be optimistic. (?)
4) Help others. (?)
Because God is so big (omnipotent, in fact) he can do something that isn’t generally talked about. He can undo the past, including whatever is evil, painful or harmful. And when something never occurred, and isn’t remembered.
Conclusion: we already live in the best of all possible worlds.
and isn’t remembered => it isn’t remembered.
I would ask, How much of the penetration of Darwinism into the American mind is the fault of nominal Christian churches in the U.S.?
Furthermore, if Darwinism is in some sense a religion, what religious need is it fulfilling that the churches are not?
I don't think these questions will be on a poll, however.
==Science indicates to me that some degree of evolution occurs in species genes.
Although creationists would not call it “evolution”, they would agree that God designed each created kind with the ability to adapt to changing environmental conditions within the boundaries of their original design.
Ah, but they were guided by the Holy Spirit. Do you understand that? God doesn't allow LIES. To reach fallible humans, he allowed the personality of the writer to come through to reach you. You also need to acquaint yourself with the Dead Sea Scrolls. They match what we have today.
God cannot lie! to lie is a sin. Tit.1:2  In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began; He can not tolerate sin, so Christ took on our penalty for sin.
 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
You don't have to believe that. You can believe that God lies. You may believe the lies fallible mortals pedal.
"More to the point, if you were to try and make the point, to uneducated, illiterate tribal people, that God created Heaven and Earth, and Man, and try hard, to make that statement, with as few scientific conflicts as possible, yet still make your work understandable to such folks, before anyone understood cell structure, DNA or anything about modern science -"
LOL! You shouldn't insult God's spokespeople as you have done. Many of the deciples of Christ were more educated that you or I. Luke was a doctor. Judas was extremely well educated Jew of privilege - but the "world" and material things were more important to Judas - ah a moral to the account .... . I guarantee you His disciples were not "uneducated" or "tribal". Some were less educated than other but that doesn't mean they were not capable of understanding and recognizing TRUTH. He purposely appealed to many through His disciples.
When science is properly applied, it screams of GOD. Modern science supports God and His incredible intelligence. All science does is point you to God.
"You would be hard pressed to do a better job than Genesis."
OTOH, you reject God, but on the other you embrace Genesis. You embrace people like this:
The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins
(Hardcover - Jan 1, 2006)
Of course intelligent people will reject that.
God is No Delusion: A Refutation of Richard Dawkins by Thomas Crean (Paperback - Oct 31, 2007)
This is the premise of all prominent evolutionists - There is NO GOD! It is all about THEM and their monstrous EGO. They can't accept that there is something BIGGER and more INTELLIGENT than they are.
There is no indwelling of the Holy Spirit with these atheists. The Holy Spirit is mentioned all over the place. The Holy Spirit is a living spirit Being, one of the three members of the Godhead. As such He has been active throughout Bible history.
He was active in creation and in sustaining the universe (Genesis 1:2; Psalms 104:30; Job 26:13; 33:4).
Yes, He's mentioned in Genesis!
He then empowered these men to perform miracles to confirm that their message was from God (Hebrews 2:3,4; 1 Corinthians 12:4-11; Acts 2:4; 10:44-46; 14:3).
He teaches, convicts, and sanctifies sinners (John 16:8-11; 1 Corinthians 6:11; John 3:3-5; Ephesians 2:18; 1 Corinthians 12:13; 1 Peter 1:2).
He gives Christians joy, comfort, unity, love, etc. (Romans 5:5; 14:17; 15:13; Ephesians 4:3; Acts 9:31; Galatians 5:22-25; 1 Thessalonians 1:6).
He revealed God's will to men who then taught this message to others (1 Corinthians 2:10-14; Ephesians 3:3-5; Mark 13:11; John 14:26; 16:13; 2 Peter 1:21). Romans 8:9 - We should be led by the Spirit of God. If the Spirit of God (Christ) does not dwell in us, we do not belong to God.
Evolutionists and atheists do not have His Spirit indwelling in them. I state that WITHOUT apology. Clearly the Spirit does dwell in people today. In fact, the Spirit dwells in ALL true children of God, and He begins to dwell in us at the moment we become God's children (not at some later point).
"It is rather egotistical for any of us to believe that was was written, centuries ago, was meant only for our eyes."
There you go again! Contradicting YOURSELF! I agree with the OPPOSITE of your statement. It is fallible men who are not Christians that have the HUGE EGOS and DENY Himand what is in the Bible. God is humble and merciful. God is the OPPOSITE of these egotistical maniacs that have skewed science to support their hatred of God. It was written for the eyes of everyone! The choice is timeless as well - you either ACCEPT or REJECT Him!
Christianity is INCLUSIVE. Christian teachings though are EXCLUSIVE. The reason teachings are exclusive is because His teachings are the TRUTH. Others imitate Him but are flawed. When they are flawed, they are no longer TRUTH. "The audience at the time must be taken into account." Yes TRUTH is timeless and doesn't need to change for an "audience". That would be ridiculous. God is not ridiculous.
"If you do not have the faith to believe that all things are possible with God, it is your faith which is weak, not mine."
So why do you post THIS: (Do YOU really believe what YOU wrote? Really?)
#5 "It is entirely possible to be a good Christian and accept the possibility of Evolution. We should NOT be forced into an either / OR decision."
If your faith is so strong, then why do you give an allowance for LIES that compromise TRUTH? Me thinks you are confused ... . You say one thing and then go and contradict what you say with another. If your faith is strong than why do you deny Him with your other statements? I see some confusion here ....
Something to think about: Ephesians 3:17; Romans 10:17 - How does Jesus dwell in our hearts? By faith. But faith comes by hearing God's word. If you REJECT the word of God, what does that say about your "faith"? Clearly, rejecting His word, is also rejecting Him.
Think about it ... . try to be consistent - one way or the other - it's a CHOICE!
==Furthermore, if Darwinism is in some sense a religion, what religious need is it fulfilling...?
The following quote comes to mind:
“I had motive for not wanting the world to have a meaning; consequently assumed that it had none, and was able without any difficulty to find satisfying reasons for this assumption. The philosopher who finds no meaning in the world is not concerned exclusively with a problem in pure metaphysics, he is also concerned to prove that there is no valid reason why he personally should not do as he wants to do, or why his friends should not seize political power and govern in the way that they find most advantageous to themselves. For myself, the philosophy of meaninglessness was essentially an instrument of liberation, sexual and political.”
Aldous Huxley: Ends and Means, pp. 270 ff.
“The Bible is subject to error on minor details.”
No. there are no errors in the Bible.
God is perfection.
Apparently you were taught falsely about God.
Could it be that false teachings pleased the fallible mortals in your “church” that prefer their teachings over His teachings? Hmmmm?
Be careful ... eternal life is at stake.
Changes within biblical "kinds", absolutely.
Changes into other biblical "kinds" -- impossible, both biblically and statistically.
What of their opinions?
“Science indicates to me that some degree of evolution occurs in species genes.”
“Religion informs me that God directs all.”
So you believe that God is an animal that evolved?
 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Ever noticed that?
You couldn’t be more wrong. I have had numerous PMs thanking me for posting these links, my ping list keeps growing and growing with out soliciting for new members, and a couple of FReepers even informed me that these links helped them make a decision to accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. If nothing else, that makes it all worthwhile right there.
Since when did any ToE research papers have any predictions (prophecies) come true to the letter 600-1000 years later?
Amen to that :o)
I said this where?
you lost me.. sorry.
I am of the view that believing living things evolve isn’t incompatible with Christianity.
believing it’s a cosmic random event derived from an amino acids soup mix on some just perfect by accident planet and henceforth explains how humans ..who have only been here for an electron orbit of time in day of space... came to be ..is incompatible with Christianity.
not to mention other arguments for God’s presence like behavior and fate and emotional tells
is that hypocritical, debunked, ignorant and ad nauseating?
btw...i have a mirror...it’s getting older..lol
Really? How so?
What makes you think that you have a better reason to question the faith of someone else, than creationists do?
Who made you so special?
The double standard that evos display on FR is so blindigly and blatantly obvious that everyone can see it, except other evos.
How do you spell hypocrite? e-v-o-l-u-t-i-o-n-i-s-t