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Wind farms interfering with weather radar in NY
NWS ^ | Recently | NWS

Posted on 10/14/2009 5:26:24 AM PDT by xcamel

During the last several years, New York State has been a leader in supporting the growth of wind energy. As a result of this effort, there have been several "wind farm" projects developed across the region. In western New York, some of the bigger projects include the towns of Sheldon, Wethersfield, Eagle/Bliss in Wyoming county. These farms are located between 20 miles and 35 miles directly southeast of the Weather Surveillance Doppler Radar located at the National Weather Service office in Cheektowaga (KBUF) in northern Erie county. The towers are on top of ridges at elevations that exceed 1600 feet above mean sea level.

Unfortunately, the Wyoming county wind farms and their turbines are within the radar line of sight (RLOS) of the NWS doppler radar in Cheektowaga. The height of the wind turbine towers are about 265 feet above the ground, and the turbine blades extend an additional 125 feet. Hence, the top of the wind turbine rotors are about 400 feet above the ground in western and southern Wyoming County.

At this height, the rotating turbine blades of the wind farm impact the KBUF Doppler Radar beam. As you can see in the above image depicting most of western New York, the rotating wind turbines are having an affect on the radar beam.

A small part of the electromagnetic energy radar beam sent from the radar is reflected back by the rotating turbines. The radar processes this "returned energy" as an area of precipitation and plots it accordingly on the map. This contamination of the base reflectivity image as illustrated in the below image, has an effect on the radar algorithms used to estimate rainfall and to detect certain storm characteristics.

See NWS site for graphics..


TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: weather; windfarms
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Its illegal to take ducks out of season but these monsters take birds 12 months of the year.

Bats, too, from what I've read.....

21 posted on 10/14/2009 6:37:25 AM PDT by Thermalseeker (Stop the insanity - Flush Congress!)
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To: xcamel
Most of the blades have CF or aluminum ribbing for lateral strength.

IIRC, the videos of a windmill shedding a blade and disintegrating do show the internal ribbing (albiet torn and mangled).

22 posted on 10/14/2009 6:37:48 AM PDT by Charles Martel ("Endeavor to persevere...")
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To: nascarnation
Actually that shredded poultry will be used to help feed the starving masses as the Baraqqi depression grinds on.

Hey, there's a "shovel-ready" sort of job to really lust after - standing under a windmill with a large basket, catching bird chunks.

23 posted on 10/14/2009 6:42:38 AM PDT by Charles Martel ("Endeavor to persevere...")
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To: Thermalseeker

Bats are sometimes rendered “deaf” by these machines. Not sure of how this happens...


24 posted on 10/14/2009 6:47:15 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Thermalseeker
I would be curious to see if the generator produces a large enough magnetic field when in operation and maybe that is what is causing the distortion?

The magnetic field would need to be oscillating near the frequency of the radar beam. You can spin a beam of electrons around that fast — this is how radar transmitters do it. A generator armature would send flying pieces into orbit before it got anywhere near that speed.

25 posted on 10/14/2009 6:51:30 AM PDT by thulldud (It HAS happened here!)
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To: thulldud
The magnetic field would need to be oscillating near the frequency of the radar beam.

My thinking exactly. These windmills are operating at what, maybe 120 rpm? Even three phase it wouldn't approach the distant harmonics of the radar IF.

26 posted on 10/14/2009 6:59:10 AM PDT by Thermalseeker (Stop the insanity - Flush Congress!)
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To: xcamel
This is in northern Erie County?

Home of Dreary Erie - The Mistake on the Lake?

Wind farms?

They need to reverse the turbines since the wind there doesn't blow, it sucks!

Traveling through there in the '70's and while waiting at a stoplight, an entire car was swallowed by a pothole.

27 posted on 10/14/2009 7:06:43 AM PDT by N. Theknow (Kennedys: Can't fly, can't ski, can't drive, can't skipper a boat, but they know what's best.)
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To: Thermalseeker

The blades are mostly fiberglass. Judging from the weather radar vs the Twin Groves Wind Farm in east central Illinois, it seems that most of the interference occurs when the blades are damp.


28 posted on 10/14/2009 7:07:15 AM PDT by Western Phil
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To: Eagle Eye
We can’t put drilling platforms in some areas of the Gulf of Mexico because someone might see them and be offended.

And we can't have incandescent light bulbs sucking up electricity but we CAN have millions of plug-in electric cars.

29 posted on 10/14/2009 7:09:28 AM PDT by N. Theknow (Kennedys: Can't fly, can't ski, can't drive, can't skipper a boat, but they know what's best.)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Bats are sometimes rendered “deaf” by these machines. Not sure of how this happens...

My former business partners and I have been looking into the possibility of starting another engineering business that would cater field engineering services to the wind power biz. We were a little less than impressed with what we saw at WindExpo 2009 back in May. We did do a trip to a wind farm under construction out in Texas, though. These things make a weird whistling noise. Pretty annoying, really. I don't know what the hearing range of a bat is, but I imagine there are higher frequencies being generated than we could hear. Maybe that is what is messin' with the bats?

30 posted on 10/14/2009 7:10:00 AM PDT by Thermalseeker (Stop the insanity - Flush Congress!)
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To: N. Theknow


You can still kind of make out that it's going to rain ... I think it's fine.
31 posted on 10/14/2009 7:13:15 AM PDT by Scythian
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To: xcamel

You should see what they do to over the air television reception.


32 posted on 10/14/2009 7:13:46 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Joe Wilson speaks for me.)
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To: Yo-Yo

It sure ‘ups’ the cable TV connections... in Hamilton NY, OTA TV was completely unwatchable.


33 posted on 10/14/2009 7:20:27 AM PDT by xcamel (The urge to save humanity is always a false front for the urge to rule it. - H. L. Mencken)
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To: Scythian

Are each of those radials the effect of shadowing from windmills? Interesting that they all seem to occur at the same distance from the transmitter and at more or less regular intervals around the station......


34 posted on 10/14/2009 7:22:23 AM PDT by Thermalseeker (Stop the insanity - Flush Congress!)
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From NWS webpage link at top of article:

Below is a one hour animation from the morning of June 8, 2009 between 730 am and 830 am EDT. As you can see, there is a persistent, stationary area of interference in Wyoming county from the wind turbine farm that appears on the KBUF base reflectivity radar image. In situations with slow moving or stationary areas of rainfall/thunderstorms, the wind farm interference could be misinterpreted as an area of heavy precipitation.


35 posted on 10/14/2009 8:05:58 AM PDT by onemiddleamerican (FUBO)
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To: Willie Green
“Those creepy little cave critters spread rabies anyway”

We would likely all be sick without those *critters*.

They are very necessary for the elimination of mosquitoes and other pests.

36 posted on 10/14/2009 11:28:49 AM PDT by wolfcreek (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lsd7DGqVSIc)
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To: xcamel
Are they radiating some sort of electro/magnetic field beyond their structure?
37 posted on 10/14/2009 11:32:58 AM PDT by wolfcreek (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lsd7DGqVSIc)
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To: wolfcreek

Doppler radar can detect the movement of the blades because of a persistent layer of condensation on the blades, and if doppler radar can detect wind speed (air) it can sure as hell see spinning fiberglass.


38 posted on 10/14/2009 11:43:22 AM PDT by xcamel (The urge to save humanity is always a false front for the urge to rule it. - H. L. Mencken)
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To: xcamel

Our local Doppler can be lowered to detect drizzle and raised to see the heights of thunderheads. Why can’t they eliminate these objects?


39 posted on 10/14/2009 11:47:23 AM PDT by wolfcreek (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lsd7DGqVSIc)
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To: wolfcreek

Mostly because the ridges they’re placed on (horizon line) now gets raised and cluttered by another 400-600 feet, and the movement of the blades causes false reflections 2 to 3 times that.


40 posted on 10/14/2009 11:50:40 AM PDT by xcamel (The urge to save humanity is always a false front for the urge to rule it. - H. L. Mencken)
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