Posted on 03/08/2010 6:26:22 AM PST by reaganaut1
It may not be news that politicians dissemble. But that's no reason not to care about what a president says. Let us, therefore, unpack last Saturday's presidential radio address.
President Obama said he had met with some of the insurance companies two days earlier and said that "they couldn't give me a straight answer as to why they keep arbitrarily and massively raising premiums -- by as much as 60 percent in states like Illinois."
Sixty percent! Could that be true? Actually it's not (see below), but let us examine the president's rhetoric first, because a clever rhetorician can, sometimes, hide his dissembling.
...
But back to Illinois. According to the March 4, 2010 Chicago Tribune, "Consumers in Illinois who lose their jobs and have no other option but to buy their own health insurance will get socked this year with premium increases of up to 60 percent…."
Whoa! The president went from that to "they keep arbitrarily and massively raising premiums -- by as much as 60 percent… ."
What the Chicago Tribune is saying is that individuals who lost their company health insurance will have to pay 60 percent more for an individual policy than they had been paying (out of pocket) for coverage under the company's policy.
"Out of pocket" is important here: it is well known (even, one must assume, in the White House) that employers who pay for their workers' health insurance pay their workers less than they would if they were not paying for that insurance. Indeed, that has been a central point of contention in the health care debate. A worker is worth only so much. He can be paid either in cash or in benefits (often untaxed), or partly in each.
(Excerpt) Read more at spectator.org ...
Liar in Chief.
I hope we become a nation of people that rushes to the aid of corporations...
said that "they couldn't give me a straight answer as to why they keep arbitrarily and massively raising premiums -- by as much as 60 percent in states like Illinois." Sixty percent! Could that be true? Actually it's not... According to the March 4, 2010 Chicago Tribune, "Consumers in Illinois who lose their jobs and have no other option but to buy their own health insurance will get socked this year with premium increases of up to 60 percent…."Thanks reaganaut1.
The original Chicago Tribune story stated: “For the state’s more than half-million consumers in individual health plans, base rates will go up from 8.5 percent to more than 60 percent, according to state data. Base rates do not take into consideration health status, gender, age, place of residence and length of a policy — all factors that could raise premiums further.”
Thus, in this case, it is American Spectator that is being misleading. Yes, someone going onto COBRA following a job loss will have to pay a large additional amount in premiums compared to what they are used to. But unless you believe the reporter was lying, he was actually referring to RATE increases that in some cases were as high as 60%. Obama’s a shameful liar and truth-twister, but the facts actually back him up on the claim that some insurance companies are raising rates by as much as 60%.
There are perfectly legitimate reasons for doing so, but Obama would rather you believe every penny of those rate increases goes into corporate profits. The reality is that insurance is a pretty low-margin business and that if you don’t raise rates to keep pace with changes in your subscriber mix, utilization or medical cost trends, you’ll soon be out of business. Obama, never having worked for a for-profit company in his life, has no idea how the real world works.
Dems got the press in their pocket, but you stand up to the DNC and they'll stick them on you... "Protection" comes at a price.
This ,”But unless you believe the reporter was lying, he was actually referring to RATE increases that in some cases were as high as 60%: isn’t saying a rate that a private insurer who has had private insurance for awhile will see an increase of 60% in their rtes. BUT a person who was on employee insurance and paid a rate of , as example 100.00 ( with the employer paying the rest) and then goes on COBRA would see their rate increase by 60%.
COBRA is NEVER the cheapest rate as most employer offered insurance covers co pays. A person on their own usually does NOT need dr visit copays.
So Obama used the Clinton method of relating facts. Some would say he flat out lied knowing most media would never call him on it.
I would agree with them
Let me repeat: “For the state’s more than half-million consumers in individual health plans, BASE RATES will go up from 8.5 percent to more than 60 percent, according to state data”
This is a statement about people who already have individual insurance policies. It has nothing to do with COBRA. It is saying that the year-over-year increase in premiums for selected groups in the individual market be as high as 60% (”as high as” is the formulation used by Obama).
I concur that COBRA isn’t the best deal for many employees, especially if they are young. But it may be the only viable option (short of going uninsured) for those with pre-existing conditions etc. But given that the average employer is paying 80-85% of premium costs, this means that the out-of-pocket cost for employees will essentially be 5 to 6 times under COBRA as it was when they were employed. Shifting to an individual policy may allow them to cut their premium in half compared to COBRA, but that’s still going to be an out-of-pocket increase increase in premium payments of 150 to 300%.
Obama has been flagrantly mendacious about his health plan. It will bend the cost curve UP, not down. It will require tax increases on individuals at all income levels, his promise to the contrary notwithstanding. Honestly scored, it will increase rather than decrease the deficit. He should be hammered repeatedly on these falsehoods. But in this particular instance, what he said was truthful, so I don’t think there’s much mileage to be gained about trying to “prove” he wasn’t.
is there actual proof any insurance company in ILL has sent notices or reported increases of 60% on a base rate?
I didn’t see any back up in the Trib article. Nothing to verify this.
is there actual proof any insurance company in ILL has sent notices or reported increases of 60% on a base rate?
I didn’t see any back up in the Trib article. Nothing to verify this.
In fact this quote from the TRIB “Consumers in Illinois who lose their jobs and have no other option but to buy their own health insurance will get socked this year with premium increases of up to 60 percent….” seems to verify exactly what I said.
People who lost their jobs, jobs with employer offered insurance will see increases of 60%.
Don’t let the omission of the word COBRA confuse you. Anyone who loses their job and tries to continue the same coverage they had either trough COBRA or on the open market ( coverage being co pays, low deductab le, low lab fees) easily could see 60% increase
BUT you are wrong, according to the Trib article this increase is not pertaining to people who have had private insurance all along.
COBRA is NEVER the cheapest rate as most employer offered insurance covers co pays. A person on their own usually does NOT need dr visit copays”
As I understand COBRA—You get to continue your insurance as a carry over for up to 6 months-—but the employer you had it with is no longer required to pay a single dime.
It was meant to help a person go from one job to another without a gap in insurance coverage.
You are correct. COBRA is a program that allows you to continue the same insurance you add under your former employer and it used to be paid for by you
But now is is for 18 months
And the fed gov’t is subsidizing it
Nevermind that people could get their own insurance much much cheaper, It won’t likely be the same cadillac coverage one had under an employer. Most people don’t need that kind of coverage.
But heck as long as the rest of us will pay it for those they will let us
“is there actual proof any insurance company in ILL has sent notices or reported increases of 60% on a base rate?”
“BUT you are wrong, according to the Trib article this increase is not pertaining to people who have had private insurance all along.”
Let me repeat: “For the state’s more than half-million consumers in individual health plans, BASE RATES will go up from 8.5 percent to more than 60 percent, ACCORDING TO STATE DATA”
No, the reporter didn’t explicitly state that he went down to the state department of insurance and obtain figures from bureaucrat X or reported in rate filing report summary Y, but it’s implied that he did something equivalent, i.e., this is not an estimate he pulled out of a hat or even relied on some expert’s “guesstimate” about. It is based on real live data representing 500,000 EXISTING plan members. I sure hope you don’t think 500,000 Illinois residents went onto COBRA in the past year.
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