FBI agents conduct raids in Mich., Ohio, Ind.

AP ^ | 3-28-10 | By MIKE HOUSEHOLDER

[CincyRichieRich]

ADRIAN, Mich. – The FBI said Sunday that agents conducted weekend raids in Michigan, Indiana and Ohio and arrested at least three people, and a militia leader in Michigan said the target of at least one of the raids was a Christian militia group.

Federal warrants were sealed, but FBI spokeswoman Sandra Berchtold said there had been activity in two southwest Michigan counties near the Ohio state line. She wouldn't say whether they were tied to the raids in the other states.

FBI spokesman Scott Wilson in Cleveland said agents arrested two people Saturday after raids in two towns in Ohio. A third arrest was made in northeast Illinois on Sunday, a day after a raid took place just over the border in northwest Indiana.

Michael Lackomar, a spokesman for the Southeast Michigan Volunteer Militia, said one of his team leaders got a frantic phone call Saturday evening from members of Hutaree, a Christian militia group, who said their property in southwest Michigan was being raided by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

"They said they were under attack by the ATF and wanted a place to hide," Lackomar said. "My team leader said, 'no thanks.' "

[culpeper]

Only Islamic militias are allowed in this country. According to 0bama, America is not a Christian nation anymore.

[tbw2]

Heck, how about the organized kidnapping and killings of American citizens and Mexican immigrants on our soil, as has been happening in San Antonio, Houston and Dallas in the past year?

[hiredhand]

I don't know anything, nor do I have an inside source. I merely have the experience of being in a past position which permitted me to observe the external after-effects of actions which were unseen by almost everybody, and I merely use this contrast to make comparisons.

We all see what's happening. But I've seen the CAUSE (in times past) that has actually preceded somewhat similar events, and so I can possibly surmise with a little more accuracy. That's all. :-)

[culpeper]

Dont all gun laws conflict with the 2nd Amendment ?

[Knitting A Conundrum]

It could indeed...

[Dead Corpse]

How many people here on FR have made "threats" of one type or another? How many in any "conservative" group have wished less than "well health" to the Isamofascist movement?

This is just the beginning...

[Dead Corpse]

That is not a coincidence. A lot of the methodologies being dreamed up to fight the "drug" war are being used in every other area as well. It's the "slipper slope" and "unintended consequences" some of us "l"ibertarian types have been yelling about for the last decade or two.

A government off it's rails will use any and all methods to protect itself. No matter what the Laws or Constitution may say...

[rbosque]

Yup, they don’t seem to give a rat’s ass about the border or border victims.

[magslinger]

Yup, they don’t seem to give a rat’s ass about the border or border victims.

Of course. More illegals crossing the border=more Dem voters. Most of the border victims=fewer non-Dem voters.

I can't explain "Maverick" McCain except to say he keeps running and panting but he never catches up to that herd of donkeys.

[rbosque]

Our border agents get thrown in the slammer for defending themselves against drug runners. Where the justice there?

Where is the justice for this poor guy who was just defending his property? Why is no one calling for the heads of La Raza or other mutants who promote illegal immigrant causes? Unless they caught the murderer, we’re gonna end up paying for this animal’s medical bills soon.

Just INFURIATING! :-(

[Knitebane]

Indeed. There are some of us that have developed certain skills over the years that allow us to pick out valid data from the background noise.

For instance, some people might look at this:

length = 74 000 : 47 45 54 20 2F 73 63 72 69 70 74 73 2F 2E 2E 25 GET /scripts/..%
010 : 63 2E 2E 2F 2E 2E 2E 2F 2E 2E 2F 2E 2E 25 32 2E c../.../../..%2. 020 : 2E 2F 77 69 6E 6E 74 2F 73 79 73 74 65 6D 33 32 ./winnt/system32
030 : 2F 63 6D 64 2E 65 78 65 3F 2F 63 2B 64 69 72 20 /cmd.exe?/c+dir
040 : 2E 65 78 65 3F 2F 63 2B 64 69 .exe?/c+di

...and just see random noise.

But a there are some of us that look at that and go, "Hey! That's the Nimda exploit!"

It's not magic, it's just a skill you pick up when you look at random noise all day looking for something that sticks out.

[Texas Fossil]

Yes. This is just the beginning...

There is no option for "We the People" but to stop this, whatever it takes.

--

"Rebellion to Tyrants is obedience to God"

Reverse side of the First Committee U.S. seal proposal.

The first committee consisted of Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, and John Adams.

Franklin chose an allegorical scene from Exodus, described in his notes as "Moses standing on the Shore, and extending his Hand over the Sea, thereby causing the same to overwhelm Pharaoh who is sitting in an open Chariot, a Crown on his Head and a Sword in his Hand. Rays from a Pillar of Fire in the Clouds reaching to Moses, to express that he acts by Command of the Deity." Motto, "Rebellion to Tyrants is Obedience to God."

[ctdonath2]

My longstanding summary of your point: “the nuts move first”.

[NurseZac]

“. It’s the ones without websites that the goons should be worrying about.”

You are absolutely correct. It is the quiet ones that are the dangerous ones. Either the feds are idiots or they are trying to send a message, unless something unlawful was occurring. Either way, I do not believe they are idiots.

[hiredhand]

I know I’ve been doing this TOO long when I see things like that and think, “Oh! A Snort rule for nimda!” :-)

[hiredhand]

My longstanding summary of your point: “the nuts move first”.

Exactly. It's observable, quantifiable, and PROVABLE ...now!

[hiredhand]

How many people here on FR have made "threats" of one type or another? How many in any "conservative" group have wished less than "well health" to the Isamofascist movement?

Yes, but the militia in question didn't do themselves any favors. They created a favorable environment to be set up.

This whole thing is just so dumb that I'm on the verge of declaring that they got what they deserved. First off, IF they are Christian, then they should KNOW what John 15:20 says (among other places in God's Word) and not be surprised OR disappointed!

But from an OPSEC standpoint, IF they are really holding out for a fight with anti-christ (which is completely stupid from a biblical/eschatological standpoint), then it's not exactly wise to put up a website and pose in uniform with weapons. They pretty much asked for trouble, and it seems to me that they lacked the wisdom and insight to realize they would bring something completely predictable... which has now happened.

Think about it... IF you were going to start or maintain a militia, would you have a website...WITH photos? ...bearing in mind WHO is currently in charge of our national Legislative and Executive branches?! Probably not!

...in my best "John Boy" (from John Boy and Billy) voice, I ask them the question, "How'd that work out for ya'll?!" ..."NOT TOO GOOD!"

Yeah... it's the "beginning" alright....the beginning of where all the wannabe light weights disband, drop out of sight, bury their weapons, and hide in fear hoping that they don't get their doors broken in at 0200...and where those who have the capability of doing serious and collective damage start coming together to actually discuss prospects.

Like I said in a previous posting... I don't have any factual information, nor do I know anybody who does. But you can bet on the outcome above based on currently available information.... whether that information is factual or not, and whether ultimately anything comes of it or not, it will happen. It's completely predictable and highly probable based on a knowledge of simple human nature and knowing enough about the American sub-cultures involved.

[hiredhand]

They're not idiots. I believe that the vast majority of our law enforcement personnel at all levels are pretty good people. Most of them are what we would consider to be the good guys. Believe it or not, they consider low hanging fruit such as these militia types we're talking about to be inconsequential. It allows them to appear to be doing their job, while satisfying some number of bureaucrats above them, but at the same time having no real effect on the overall situation. Remember, we already agreed that the crazies "go first".

The problem will come if the current administration pushes the national situation into a holy war. This has been discussed in various think tank circles for the past several years. There is a large subculture here in America which will react with organized extremism to certain triggers. Criminals who break into their houses at night find this out the hard way... ditto for car-jackers. It could be triggered by something such as an executive order declaring all box magazine fed rifles outlawed, or a suspension of the November elections, or any number of things really.

But the probability of those things happening aren't good. If those scenarios occurred, those in power wouldn't enjoy the richness of their power for long. They don't want to turn America into a third world nation, regardless of what it seems like they're doing.

The power-brokers are really in a tough spot right now. If they push a certain (large) portion of America over the edge, we'll have armed insurrection and public hangings of some big name political figures. If they do nothing, then they know what's going to happen in November. So they might as well bluff and pick on the easy ones like this militia in MI and hope that everybody else gets in line.

...make sense? :-)

[Dead Corpse]

Yeah... Let's toss all the "fringe groups" under the bus. Especially when it's the FedGov and the MSM defining who exactly is a "fringe group".

How would that calculus work out for ya' Ace?

[hiredhand]

"Fringe groups" that advertise can't be helped. They're their own worst enemies. The FedGov and the MSM have until November to do all the defining that they can...unless they really screw things up and bring a public armed backlash.

I didn't suggest we toss anybody under the bus. Truth be known, most people toss themselves under the bus just fine with no help from anybody else.