Why don't you start some place that begins "You're wrong again" and pick the discussion back up at Matthew 24:36-44.
End-times prognosticators are on the perpetual loser's treadmill. Might want to boost your credibility by stepping off.
FReegards!
Posted on 04/01/2010 2:24:59 AM PDT by TruthInThoughtWordAndDeed
The Western European Union released a declaration Wednesday, stating that its 10-nation military alliance has agreed to dissolve itself. Plans are being made to end the alliance, preferably by the end of June 2011.
Read the declaration here.
What does this mean for those of us who have wondered if these 10 nations could be the 10 kings of Bible prophecy? We have to wait and see.
(Excerpt) Read more at fulfilledprophecy.com ...
Don't let that detract you from considering the implications of the article - if the WEU is to dissolve by next summer, then whatever part it plays in prophecy has to be fulfilled either as part of its demise or as the result of its demise.
IMO, we are very close to the end of the age.
Though I am not a Believer, I think the writers of the Bible were political and sociological geniuses. At the time, they transformed the nature of man and their writings were the foundation of law and justice.
The writers of the Bible also had some very keen foresight. It is natural for there to be more central control as the human population grows, as it expands ever larger of course unpredictable consequences should be expected and I would consider any collapse of the Current Order as “end times.”
Given it is only the military alliance being dissolved, sounds like BamBamKennedy’s peace plan is working. s/
No they are not the 10 kings... as referenced in Chapter 17.... Those 10 kings apply to this whole earth not just Europe, and the ‘global state’ is held together by religion.
“IMO, we are very close to the end of the age.”
Could be. Folks have been thinking that for 2,000 years.
I suppose I should have been more specific. Since we humans cannot see into the future, and since much of Biblical prophecy is written cryptically, we can never say with certainty how it will all play out.
However, given that a seven year agreement (European Neighborhood Project, ref. Daniel 9:26-27) exists between the EU and Israel, and that we are currently half way through it (April 3 is the midpoint if you count its start from when it was funded in October of 2006), then “very close to the end of the age” means “within the next 3 1/2 years.”
If the dissolution of the WEU happens about a year from now, then I expect The Great Tribulation to start somewhere during or at the end of that dissolution process.
IMO, The Great Tribulation will last from then until the fall of 2012. The last year of the seven years is reserved for “retribution” or “redemption” by our heavenly father.
(Ref. Isaiah 34:8 “...a year of retribution...” and Isaiah 63:4 “...the year of my redemption...”)
Bottom line: Be prepared for a time of great trouble that will start between now and the summer of 2011 and will last until the fall of 2012.
Also, consider this: the Bible potrays a realistic historical account of the Hebrews, with nuances of psychology and human-ness not seen in other old legendary accounts of people groups. You would expect an ancient narrative of a people to extol their virtues and blame all their shortcomings on someone or something else.
In addition, think about how history has played out. Why on earth should so much attention be placed on Israel and Jerusalem? It appears to me to be a rocky, treeless, unattractive place. So why is Jerusalem a “burdensome stone” for all the rulers of the world?
Keep reading the Bible and using your mind. I’m praying that you will become a Believer.
That the lunatics who think they can glorify God and bless their neighbors by fearmongering, divination, and fortune telling are, once again, looking like the fatalistic losers they want to be -- and want to turn us into.
How does it honor the Savior when one becomes an unpaid cheerleader for antichrist, whoring for the other team? How does it promote manly virtue, courage, and optimism among those God calls "more than conquerors," when one preaches as a certainty the global triumph of evil?
"Prophecy teachers" may be Christians -- but they serve Satan. They undermine Christian living. They bring shame and ridicule upon the name of Jesus.
Hmmm...Who then, is the Antichrist?
April 1st
I believe that it is Javier Solana. You can learn all about him at www.fulfilledprophecy.com. He was a signatory to the seven year European Neighborhood Project.
He is “retired.” However, he is the busiest “retired” man I have ever seen. He very much wants to play a part in crisis management. I expect him to step out of retirement and back onto the world stage as part of this process.
Blessings.
Why don't you start some place that begins "You're wrong again" and pick the discussion back up at Matthew 24:36-44.
End-times prognosticators are on the perpetual loser's treadmill. Might want to boost your credibility by stepping off.
FReegards!
RJR_fan,
I agree with you that many prophecy teachers interpret scripture incorrectly and merely make things more confusing.
However, evil does not triumph. In the end, believers are rescued and evil is defeated. I am not happy about suffering through evil, but I take great encouragement that our Savior will return soon and make things right. If I did not believe that to be so, I would be very disheartened at the state of things in the world today.
Blessings.
Agamemnon,
I fully understand the “perpetual loser’s treadmill” analogy. Thank you for your advice. I know that you wish me well.
I am trying to stick to the facts. A seven year agreement is prophecied in the book of Daniel. Israel entered into a seven year agreement with the EU in October of 2006. A seven year agreement is unprecedented in Israel’s history. We are now approaching the midpoint of that agreement. I am merely attempting to put the puzzle together on how things may play out from here.
Blessings.
At this point in history, there are two global enemies to the gospel: Islam, and America's state religion of secular humanism. Both have an appointment with God behind the woodshed of history. I fear that the contemptible ingrates who ignored His victory over communism will provoke His wrath. Perhaps, in annoyance at fatalistic doomsayers, He will destroy our reigning ideology first.
Wise Christians undermine secular humanism by refusing to participate in the American state church. They refuse to render unto Caesar that which is God's -- the children entrusted to their care. Their kids don't show up in public schools, those kiddie penal colonies.
Wise Christians also pray for the fall of Islam, and study Arabic, Turkish, or Farsi so that, when that day comes, and a billion people wonder what to do next, they'll be ready with answers.
Foolish Christians continue reading their tea leaves, using God's Word for a ouija board, and always seeing therein the message that pleases Satan most: that God has ordained the world-wide triumph of evil.
Forgive me if I decline your kind invitation to become an unpaid cheerleader for the devil's team. God is at work around the world. I want to be in on what He is up to. Not contaminating His people with fatalistic despair and impotence.
I believe the Camp David accords are now 33 years old are they not?
Apart from the general "peace, peace, but there is no peace..." prophecy, can you point to a place in Daniel or elsewhere that mentions an agreement that has lasted almost 5-times longer than the October, 2006 agreement made with the EU about which you appear to be so transfixed?
Is that the only agreement Israel has with the EU? Or with the US even, that extends 7 years or beyond? Absolutely not.
Were you aware that there have been special tariff abeyance agreements that have existed between the EU and Israel and the US and Israel which have provided Israel with tariff-free importations to both regions going back nearly 40 years with the EU (or EEC as it was once was originally formed) and with the US almost since the time of the re-establishment of the modern State of Israel in 1948?
These are the equivalent of bi-lateral free trade zones existing between Israel and the two regions which have afforded Israel favored trade advantages for 40 years in one context and 60 in another.
Sadly end-timers have cherry picked their "facts" and crafted subsequently less-than-credible predictions far too many times, and those serial failings have redounded to the shaming of those calling themselves Christians who traffic in this sort of thought process.
End-timers make suckers out of the pathologically gullible.
Here's a new one. Maybe this will tickle your ears: is Rahm Emmanuel the anti-Christ? Hey, you never know. He's coincidentally got the name after all, right? And he served in the Israeli military at one point, and ....
Christ said that above all in the context of the end-times -- don't be deceived.
Like I said. Get off the treadmill.
FReegards!
Agamemnon,
Concerning the agreement with Israel, it is not that it lasts 7 years or longer, it is that it lasts exactly 7 years. That is what is unprecedented.
Blessings.
So now you're telling me this is the only agreement Israel has EVER made that has terms that last for a specified time period of 7-years with either the EU, EC, or the EEC?
You mean to tell us that you have made the effort to plow through the terms of every agreement the modern State of Israel has EVER made with the EEC, the EC, or EU going back to at least 1957, and you know that for a FACT not one other has a term of 7 years?
Now the way the line used to go, when the EEC had 6 nations in 1957 there were going to be a total of 10 nations of Europe that would get together (as popular prophecy would have it) into that thing from which the Beast would emerge even as 3 of the states would dominate, and blah, blah, blah.... But as anyone should know the EC now comprises 27 states, and its flag represents 12 of the original Euro-zone members c. 1990 (now 15 or 16 I think).
So since we're talking treaties and member states as few as 6 and as many as 27, and borders of Israel that have changed from 1948 to 1967 to 1973 to 1979.... And the EU/EC/EEC membership has fluctuated -- it may even blow apart as a monetary system if the "PIIGS" economies collapse (i.e., Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece, Spain), where did that 10-nation idea go and those 3 dominant states? Do 7-year contracts with Israel only have meaning now for some strange reason?
I won't do your research for you but since it's your point I'll challenge you to furnish credible source for this 7-year "unprecedented" agreement. And if you tell me end-times hucksters like Salem Kirban, Hal Lindsay, or Jack van Impe, we'll just end the discussion here.
FReegards!
Agamemnon,
I wish you well.
I stand by what I said. Israel entered into a 7 year agreement known as the European Neighborhood Policy with the EU in October, 2006. The nominal dates of the agreement are January 1, 2007 to December 31, 2013, which is exactly 7 years. Modern Israel has never entered into a 7 year agreement before with any nation or coalition of nations.
The size, shape, and history of the countersigning party or parties, in this case, the EU, is not relevant. Israel is the only nation that matters.
BTW, I believe that the strong majority (perhaps almost all) of modern day end-times authors are wrong in their beliefs. Some of them may mean well, but I believe that they are misguided.
Blessings.
Since when? 1948, 1967, 1973, 1979?
...has never entered into a 7 year agreement before with any nation or coalition of nations
Once more, you have demonstrated yourself to be incapable of substantiating this claim.
As much as you may wish it to be so in order to fit the "facts" to your "model," you have repeatedly failed to base your claim in anything resembling fact. This is a common trait of end-timers.
I'm not surprised that you believe most if not all other end-timers are incorrect in their respective beliefs. This trait too is characteristic of end-timers.
End-timerism most often manifests itself as a spirit of elevated self-importance, which has more to do with one's presumed inside track on what is supposedly "received wisdom," than anything else.
This "wisdom" is also supposedly doled out very narrowly to only a select few who are in their own minds the only ones most attuned to the Spirit of God.
Some consider themselves to be "the remnant" -- in a Revelation 12:17 sort of way.
Very self-promoting. Very self-destructive.
--- To themselves, to their acolytes, as well as to their own Christian testimony and spiritual growth.
Man too often deceives himself, and this is no less true of Christians. The sooner you get off this treadmill, the better structured your arguments will be in the near term and the better off you will be personally in the long run.
FReegards!
Agamemnon,
I picture myself as sitting at a table with others, all of us whom believe we have something important to contribute. As each person speaks, the rest of us hear some things with which we agree, and other things with which we disagree. Sometimes we learn something new. Sometimes we reject what we hear.
And then it comes my turn to speak, and I realize that now all of the others see me as I saw them...
In scripture, we are commanded to watch. As imperfectly as I may be doing that, I am watching and trying to understand and interpret. And when I see something that I think that others may not see, I try to bring it to their attention so that they may benefit.
You are one of the people who sits at the table with me. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that you are unwilling to accept what I have offered. I understand. I may be wrong. All of what I have seen develop over these last few years may merely be coincidence. If that is the case, then I am playing the part of the fool.
But if I have any morsel of truth, if I have solved even just one piece of the puzzle, then my prayer is that it blesses and brings hope to those who consider what I have offered.
Our savior (Yahusha, a.k.a. Jesus) is in charge. I place my trust in him. I pray that others do, too. If there is trouble in our immediate future, it is good to know that he is our savior and will be our protector and leader, if we let him. And importantly, it will be good for him to find us working to the benefit of his children when he returns.
Blessings.
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