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Single Payer Coming Under Obamacare
Human Events ^ | October 2, 2010 | Roger Hedgecock

Posted on 10/03/2010 10:01:49 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

Leftists who opposed Obamacare because it was not the British-style National Health Service or the Canadian "single payer" system should take another look.

Constitutional conservatives who feared that Obamacare was a blueprint for an incremental roll out of "single payer" have been proven right.

California's governor is about to sign legislation to set up that state's Health Benefits Exchange. The HBE is authorized under Obamacare and is supposed to be a place where small business and individuals can access the best insurance plans at the cheapest price—a real exchange where customers can compare benefits and price in a competitive atmosphere.

Not in California. The main feature of the California HBE allows the exchange governing board to meet in secret and determine not only which insurance companies can participate and what must be covered, but also what they can charge.

Exchange employees would not be limited by Civil Service pay rates and personnel decisions would also be secret. The exchange would operate independent from either legislative oversight or the governor's authority.

The main goal of this California HBE is to impose government price controls on insurance while mandating the expanded coverage that policies must provide.

California appears to be fulfilling the real intent of Obamacare. Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius assailed the "free rein" which insurers had before Obamacare to set any price they wished. Obamacare she vowed would bring "accountability" to health insurance price.

States already regulate the health insurance industry. Responding to higher premium costs driven by new benefits mandated in Obamacare, the HBE in California and soon in your state will destroy what’s left of the insurance free market.

We've seen this slow motion nationalization before.

Decades ago, flood insurance carriers were hit by a political flood when Congress criticized alleged high premiums, slow response and stingy payouts following severe Mississippi flooding. Mandated coverage, de facto price controls, and federal subsidies from Congress eventually forced private insurance carriers to drop flood insurance.

These days, flood insurance is a federal program. Environmentalists should be livid. The federal coverage is so generous that homeowners in flood prone areas have built new homes after every flood. Taxpayers foot the bill. This year the federal flood insurance program is running a deficit over $25 billion. Is this the model for "affordable" health insurance under Obamacare?

The architect of Obamacare, Sen. Harry Reid (D.-ev.), tired of being hammered by challenger Sharron Angle on Nevada's worst in the nation unemployment, has gone on the attack defending Obamacare.

Ignoring the public revulsion over the midnight secret bill drafting, the bribes to individual senators to secure votes, the fact that senators voted on a bill that they did not read, and the repeated lies about what was in the bill, Reid brought Sebelius to Reno, Nev., to tout the benefits of Obamacare.

Democrats vowed to "run on our record." And what a record it is.

Sharron Angle continues to point out that Obamacare will force everyone to pay for coverage they may not need because the federal government will dictate through the political process what coverage is required in every policy. You may not want a transgender operation, but you're covered for it and will pay for it anyway.

The Reid/Sebelius retort was to present 5 year-old Brennan, an autism patient, whose father (an admitted Reid supporter) claimed he could not get insurance coverage for the expensive autism treatment.

No further facts were offered, leaving many questions. Did he have individual or group insurance? Was the father's preferred "treatment" different from a treatment allowed for autism under the coverage? Was the autism a "pre-existing" condition? Did the father try to get insurance before or after the autism diagnosis?

Reid's appeal to emotion clouds the fact that mandated coverage coupled with price controls would eventually put the sky-rocketing costs of medical coverage on the backs of taxpayers was not lost on Angle. In a Reid TV ad meant to slam Angle, she is shown saying "Take off the mandates for coverage... You're paying for things you don't even need."

True. And it's another reason Angle is right and Reid just plain wrong for Nevada and for the country.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: declineofamerica; democrat; democrats; govhealthcare; impeachobama; obama; obamacare; rinocarelite; romney; romneycare; singlepayer; socialism; socializedhealthcare; socializedmedicine; talkradio; wreckinghealthcare

1 posted on 10/03/2010 10:01:53 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Most of the people who voted Obamacare will be re-elected this Nov.

Have a nice day.


2 posted on 10/03/2010 10:11:58 PM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: Tzimisce

Most of the people who voted Obamacare will be re-elected this Nov.

Have a nice day.
_________________________________________________________

Care to elaborate?


3 posted on 10/03/2010 10:14:09 PM PDT by Artcore
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To: All

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2308266/posts

#

Stepping back in time...

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2308266/posts?page=3#3

Video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpAyan1fXCE

“Obama on single payer health insurance”

Video Description - quote:

6y2o12la | June 29, 2008

Obama on single payer health insurance

Category:
News & Politics

Tags:
Obama AFL-CIO Single Payer Health Care Insurance Policy News


4 posted on 10/03/2010 10:17:22 PM PDT by Cindy
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To: Tzimisce
Most of the people who voted Obamacare will be re-elected this Nov. Have a nice day.

Huh?
5 posted on 10/03/2010 10:31:02 PM PDT by GLDNGUN
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Not in California. The main feature of the California HBE allows the exchange governing board to meet in secret and determine not only which insurance companies can participate and what must be covered, but also what they can charge.

That Arnold, he's a REAL fiscal conservative!

See tag line.

6 posted on 10/03/2010 10:47:59 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (Grovelnator Schwarzenkaiser, fashionable fascism one charade at a time.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

No one will want to offer insurance with these rules.


7 posted on 10/03/2010 11:29:50 PM PDT by screaminsunshine (counter revolutionary)
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To: StarFan; Dutchy; alisasny; BobFromNJ; BUNNY2003; Cacique; Clemenza; Coleus; cyborg; DKNY; ...

ping


8 posted on 10/03/2010 11:33:47 PM PDT by nutmeg (29 days 'til Election Day...)
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To: Artcore

House seats “in play” this Nov = 90 to 100.

There were 217 Congressmen who voted for Health Reform - that’s not even half.


9 posted on 10/03/2010 11:58:55 PM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: GLDNGUN

House seats “in play” this Nov = 90 to 100.

There were 217 Congressmen who voted for Health Reform - that’s not even half.


10 posted on 10/03/2010 11:59:13 PM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
WoW at first i thought it said “Single prayer”. I mean hey the guy is a moslem.
11 posted on 10/04/2010 12:30:52 AM PDT by Plumberman27
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“The architect of Obamacare, Sen. Harry Reid (D.-ev.), tired of being hammered by challenger Sharron Angle on Nevada’s worst in the nation unemployment, has gone on the attack defending Obamacare.”

Oh...that’s going to work out well. /s

“Sharron Angle continues to point out that Obamacare will force everyone to pay for coverage they may not need because the federal government will dictate through the political process what coverage is required in every policy. You may not want a transgender operation, but you’re covered for it and will pay for it anyway.”

This is the redistribution of wealth/health care that they were able to sell to a the dumb cultists/small minority of the country. It stinks...

“The Reid/Sebelius retort was to present 5 year-old Brennan, an autism patient, whose father (an admitted Reid supporter) claimed he could not get insurance coverage for the expensive autism treatment.”

Of course they will determine if a mere child gets the help they need according to the costs involved, and that child’s “benefit” to society. This is exactly what Sarah Palin addressed in her reference to Trig’s needs having to go to the bureaucracy for help.

Death panels are in the legislation...


12 posted on 10/04/2010 12:48:00 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: Tzimisce

“House seats “in play” this Nov = 90 to 100.

There were 217 Congressmen who voted for Health Reform - that’s not even half.”

Those seats in play are huge!

All the Republicans need is 39 seats...and they will have that many, and more.

That is a swing of 78 seats. When one ‘rat loses his/her seat, and a Republican picks that seat up, it’s a swing of two seats.

Just think about the possibilities of having 90 - 100 seats in play!


13 posted on 10/04/2010 12:55:25 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Not to defend ObamaCare, but let's be honest here. There hasn't been a "health insurance" industry in years -- and for the same reasons why there hasn't been a flood insurance industry in years.

The whole purpose of an insurance policy is to protect the policy holder against the risk of facing enormous costs related to catastrophic events. The whole concept is based on the expectation that the "catastrophic event" in question for any given insurance policy (major damage to a home, an auto accident, the death of the insured, etc.) will happen infrequently. For property/casualty insurance, a policy holder can go an entire lifetime without ever filing a claim -- and most people are perfectly happy with that.

Once you get to the point where an insurance policy is used as nothing more than a financial mechanism to pay for things that occur on a regular basis, then it isn't "insurance" anymore -- it's just a financial tool to pass off the costs of the products or services in question (a new home for flood "insurance," regular health-related expenses for medical "insurance," etc.) onto someone else.

14 posted on 10/04/2010 2:35:09 AM PDT by Alberta's Child ("Let the Eastern bastards freeze in the dark.")
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Mitt will fix it, like he did the Utah hack Olympics, or proposed for Detoilet. He’ll get a federal bailout. ( See, free money. It’s fix? You don’t have to go to Harvard Business school. )


15 posted on 10/04/2010 5:01:58 AM PDT by Leisler ("Over time they create a legal system that plunders and a moral code that glorifies it." F. Bastiat)
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To: Tzimisce

Have you been asleep for 2 years?


16 posted on 10/04/2010 6:33:15 AM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: dixiechick2000
Those seats in play are huge!

All the Republicans need is 39 seats...and they will have that many, and more.

That is a swing of 78 seats. When one ‘rat loses his/her seat, and a Republican picks that seat up, it’s a swing of two seats.

Just think about the possibilities of having 90 - 100 seats in play!


So you agree with what I said - Most of the guys running for the House will coast to easy re-election.

Most of the guys who voted for Obamacare will win and get sent back.

And that was my point.

There is a reason Nancy Pelosi is smiling: cause she just took a dump on the American people and she's not even facing a re-election challenge in her home district.
17 posted on 10/04/2010 10:28:54 AM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Not if we can repeal Obamacare!


18 posted on 10/04/2010 10:41:04 AM PDT by SuziQ
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To: dixiechick2000
Of course they will determine if a mere child gets the help they need according to the costs involved, and that child’s “benefit” to society. This is exactly what Sarah Palin addressed in her reference to Trig’s needs having to go to the bureaucracy for help.

The autistic boy's family is basically screwed if the boy did have a pre-existing condition and they didn't have insurance before they discovered he needed the treatment. It's unfortunate, but that is a common feature of insurance policies. The same is true of flood insurance, fire insurance, etc.

The essential, existential lie in the Reid/Sebelius political pitch is that somehow this would change if politicians were put in charge of the insurance function.

That's what the adumbrated Obama "death panel" provision and current triage functions in Britain's National Health are all about.

Just because healthcare or health insurance are nationalized by Socialists, won't change the unhappy future of people like the autistic boy Reid is holding up as an example of what he wants to do. He'll just have a somewhat different unhappy future, in which his family will fruitlessly beg bureaucrats instead of insurors for what society won't give them.

But politicians will enjoy enormous power over people with sick children -- or any children. This is what politicized health insurance is all about. Reid is the very first in line to try to cash that chip.

I hope Sharron Angle stomps Reid flatter than a tortilla.

19 posted on 10/04/2010 1:52:06 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus
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To: Tzimisce

“So you agree with what I said - Most of the guys running for the House will coast to easy re-election.

Most of the guys who voted for Obamacare will win and get sent back.

And that was my point.”

What are you talking about? Most importantly...what are you smoking?

The only Republican who voted for Obamacare in the House was Rep. Joseph Cao of Louisiana. IIRC, he defeated Dollar Bill Jefferson, who had $90K stuffed in his freezer and used government rescourses to retrieve it right after Katrina.

IIRC, he’s since changed his vote.

No Republican voted for porkulus.

“There is a reason Nancy Pelosi is smiling: cause she just took a dump on the American people and she’s not even facing a re-election challenge in her home district.”

That’s not a smile...it’s the result of multiple botox injections.

She doesn’t care if they run against her as long as it might end up with the results she desires.

That won’t happen, no matter how much she deludes herself.


20 posted on 10/05/2010 12:12:47 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: lentulusgracchus

What an awesome post! Thank you so much!

“I hope Sharron Angle stomps Reid flatter than a tortilla.”

Ohhhhh...I am SO there!


21 posted on 10/05/2010 12:17:06 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: dixiechick2000

Did you even read my responses?

Are you even trying to understand my point?

Or are you just arguing for the sake of arguing?


22 posted on 10/05/2010 1:40:01 PM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: Tzimisce

Okay...explain this...

“Most of the guys who voted for Obamacare will win and get sent back.”

That’s just one thing that I don’t understand.


23 posted on 10/06/2010 12:02:26 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: Tzimisce

Then, there’s this...

“There is a reason Nancy Pelosi is smiling: cause she just took a dump on the American people and she’s not even facing a re-election challenge in her home district.”

Every single member of the House is up for re-election...even Nancy Pelosi.

She will be re-elected, but she won’t have the power, anymore.

In fact, I suspect she will retire, shortly.


24 posted on 10/06/2010 12:11:18 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: Tzimisce

“Or are you just arguing for the sake of arguing?”

Everyone who knows me knows that I don’t do that.


25 posted on 10/06/2010 12:12:43 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: dixiechick2000
Every single member of the House is up for re-election...even Nancy Pelosi.

Didn't I just say that?

She will be re-elected, but she won’t have the power, anymore.

Wrong. She's a ranking Democrat part of the Democrat leadership in the House. She'll keep that.

In fact, I suspect she will retire, shortly.

Liberals never give up their power. They only "retire" when it's obvious they're beat (see Bart Stupak who's poll numbers were so bad he didn't even bother trying to run for re-election).
26 posted on 10/06/2010 12:51:11 AM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: dixiechick2000
“Most of the guys who voted for Obamacare will win and get sent back.”

That’s just one thing that I don’t understand.


Simple math. 435 House seats up for re-election this fall. According to most figures I've seen, anywhere from 90 to 100 seats are "in play". That's less than 25% of the House at large.

Now - 217 of this bunch voted for Obamacare. If 100 of them are voted out, that's less than than half the guys who voted for Obamacare.

Don't get me wrong - this will be historic, lots of people are going to get voted out. Lots of people from "safe" districts are going to have their butts kicked to the curb.

But in the big picture, it's pretty sad.
27 posted on 10/06/2010 12:55:17 AM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: Tzimisce

“Wrong. She’s a ranking Democrat part of the Democrat leadership in the House. She’ll keep that.”

She has seniority, but whether she will have any power at all after the election will depend on how the ‘rat caucus vote goes. There will be many/some who won’t be inclined to vote for again after her abysmal performance as party leader, and SOTH.

This remains to be seen.

“Most of the guys who voted for Obamacare will win and get sent back.”

This was my point of contention, and you still haven’t answered it. Or, maybe I missed something in the translation? It seemed like a pretty forthright statement to me, though.


28 posted on 10/06/2010 1:05:09 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: Tzimisce

“Now - 217 of this bunch voted for Obamacare. If 100 of them are voted out, that’s less than than half the guys who voted for Obamacare.”

Fuzzy math...

First...if one person loses a seat, that’s a swing of two seats. Take away one seat from one party, add that seat to the other party, and that amounts to a two seat swing.

Dems have 75...Reps have 25. Say 25 Dems lost.

75 - 25 + 50. Right?

However, 25 Reps + 25 Dem losses = 50 seats.

So, even though the Dems had 75 seats, and lost 1/3 of them...thus giving the Reps 25 more seats to add to their 25 current seats...it leaves them tied at 50 seats each.

If 100 are voted out, that’s a 200 seat swing.

You’re right...it’s simple political math.

“But in the big picture, it’s pretty sad.”

The entire years since November 4, 2008 has been pretty sad, but things are looking way up, now.


29 posted on 10/06/2010 1:18:00 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: Tzimisce

“75 - 25 + 50. Right?”

That should be 75 - 25 = 50.

Sorry...


30 posted on 10/06/2010 1:20:50 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: dixiechick2000

If you say so.

...I’m starting to realize why we’re in trouble as a nation...


31 posted on 10/06/2010 10:30:12 AM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: Tzimisce

“...I’m starting to realize why we’re in trouble as a nation...”

Me, too.

If there are only two sides, and one is taken from one side, the only place for it to go is to the other side.

Are you into basic math, or the really new math?


32 posted on 10/07/2010 12:42:02 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: Tzimisce

“Most of the guys who voted for Obamacare will win and get sent back.”

BTW. you still haven’t answered that...


33 posted on 10/07/2010 12:44:33 AM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: dixiechick2000

But, he has. I think his point is, even if the most optimistic scenario we have pans out, less than half of the rats who voted for Obamacare will still be tossed out, hence most would be re-elected. Your thinking of the swing in balance, which is not the same thing.


34 posted on 10/07/2010 1:04:48 AM PDT by Citizen of the Savage Nation
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To: dixiechick2000
BTW. you still haven’t answered that...

I've answered this question two or three times.

Okay, I'll answer it again: 217 people in the House voted for Obamacare. They "deemed" it passed. Their votes sent Obamacare to the White House and Obama signed it.

Flash forward to the present. It is now estimated that somewhere between 40 and 100 House seats are currently "in play". If 100 of those people lose their seats, there are still 117 who got re-elected.

100/217 = Less than 50%. And it's (100/435 = less than 25%) less than a quarter of the House at large.

There should be 217 Congress right now in close elections. Sadly, there is not.

35 posted on 10/07/2010 9:24:43 PM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: dixiechick2000
Me, too.

If there are only two sides, and one is taken from one side, the only place for it to go is to the other side.

Are you into basic math, or the really new math?


I don't know how much more plainly I can explain myself.

You truly can't understand my point?
36 posted on 10/07/2010 9:26:19 PM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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To: Tzimisce; Citizen of the Savage Nation

I give up.

You clearly don’t understand my point, and I don’t understand yours.


37 posted on 10/07/2010 11:57:44 PM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: dixiechick2000
You clearly don’t understand my point, and I don’t understand yours.

How can you NOT understand my point.

I understand yours: every Democrat voted out will become Republican.

But not that many Democrats are going to be voted out.
38 posted on 10/08/2010 1:41:10 AM PDT by Tzimisce (No thanks. We have enough government already. - The Tick)
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