Posted on 06/20/2011 10:09:45 AM PDT by justlittleoleme
Hmmmm ... If or when the government comes to help, they may be actively harmful, and (harming) you may well be near the top of their priority.
I can’t remember the specifics, but I know the shielding has to be pretty tight - as in measured in micro-millimeters... I have the scientific data on this subject laying around here somewhere. The shielding must be tight enough to block out the EMP wave at a specific frequency - I just can’t remember what the frequency wavelength is off the top of my head. I know that in the past (when I was working on a project) that I had to find a very high grade gold screen wire to go over the windows of a hardened above ground shelter (think of something along the lines of the screening you see used on those “reusable” gold mesh coffee filter baskets) in order to keep out EMP. You could see through the mesh, but it would block EMP. It was like extreme “window tinting”...
Barry has already stated that we would absorb any first strike. He will allow it.
Iran just announced that they plan to put a man into orbit. I don't know the altitude. So, we have Iran building a nuke and also a vehicle that can put a payload of some size into LEO. And North Korea is following a similar line.
The day may come when we all gather around our TVs to watch a third world country put a man into space.
We see the man.
We see the man wave.
We see the rocket lift off.
Everyone cheers.
What we don't see is that the man didn't get on the missle. He's still on the launching pad.
And then the EMP goes off. At 50 miles up? 100 miles up? 150 miles? Whatever altitude it is, it could be real bad for us.
ping!
Remember those missing hard drives from Los Alamos? The Clintons and bag-man Richardson were deeply involved in the transfer (sale) of our high tech an Al Gore was bringing in loads of cash (millions) from Buddhist monks sworn to poverty. No connection whatsoever, I'm sure... /s
The world has to quit playing games with the pretense of “legal” and “illegal” activities by sovereign nations.
I give no support to weakening national sovereignty, or its concept, for ANY “global” legal agenda.
It is pretense.
It is never more than: “We - those that decided - have decided that the activities that you are conducting - the party “we” decided against - are activities not allowed to you (or that should not be allowed to you).
That is not, and should never be construed as a matter of law.
We simply don’t trust the party we are deciding against and we believe their motivations are threatening to us.
That’s not a matter of “law”, other than the time-honored “law” of us acting in what we believe is OUR sovereign interest.
What I am seeking here as an end to pretense about “international law” and “international sanctions” on the matters of the WMD activities of North Korea.
It’s time for 17th century solutions - stop it or else. Not because of some silly notion that their activity is illegal; just because we don’t want them to do it - period.
‘I can’t remember the specifics, but I know the shielding has to be pretty tight - as in measured in micro-millimeters.”
The specific answer is ‘it depends’. Depends on how close you are to the blast and what the device you’re seeking to protect is constructed. Military spec’s are usually on the tighter end of the spectrum since its assumed they will be a target.
If you don’t need to see through it then a simple metal can will do unless you are at ground zero.
‘In fact, most people, maybe 90% of the population today, would not survive it, it would be too arduous.”
I think the magic number is 75%. At least I think that is what Hillary suggested.
Isn’t it funny how its too late for Palin, but just fine that others like Perry, DeMint, etc. are still pondering?
If I remember correctly, the Kellogg-Briand Pact outlawed war sometime in the 1920s. That, uhhh, that didn't work.
After WWII, we put a lot of Germans on trial. Now, they were bad people. If we wanted to shoot them, that's fine -- victors get to do that. But we did the whole Nuremburg thing, and gave them layers, and gathered testimony -- and then we killed them.
When Bush was president, the Left wanted the War on Terror conducted like a criminal case -- "You can't drop bombs on Osama bin Laden! He hasn't had a trial! We don't know if he's guilty!"
It is not proper that nation states worry about such things. Nation states do what they can get away with. When we see an enemy, we should weigh the costs, and if it looks like a good idea, we should just devastate them without a lot of fuss. Who cares about the legality?
I guess you are right. But we would never know about it.
Call me an isolationist. But I don’t care about North Korea now, and I would not care about them then either.
Proud Canadian posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 12:58:15 PM: “Interesting scenario. Except the Chicoms lose their best customer. Their US treasuries are worthless. Their export business is gone. Their economy is toast. Their people starve, rioting and pillaging before they do. Then the US retaliates and wipes them out. Its a lose/lose.”
The problem here is we often think our enemies are more or less like ourselves, with only a few differences.
China currently operates more like a fascist country than like a Maoist or Stalinist state. Think how Hitler would have governed if he’d been satisfied with controlling only Europe through a militarized nation-state centered in Germany with various protectorates around the German heartland, basing his rule on a semi-socialist economy with the government supporting favored capitalists in return for their political neutrality or endorsement. However, given the radical changes in China’s ideology and government over the last four decades, I’m not sure we can presume that its future stability is assured by the development of a wealthy commercial class based on free trade with the West.
The two Bushes and Bill Clinton took a major gamble on their hunch that encouraging the development of a capitalist economy will stabilize China. They may be right — we did, after all, do something similar in Korea, Germany, and Japan — but we did that in countries that we controlled through a history of military occupation in all three cases, twice as the conquerors and once as the ally who saved South Korea, but in all three cases with a population that in the postwar period regarded the United States as the victors whose culture should be emulated.
However, if America’s leaders guessed wrong, we’ve enabled the creation of the world’s largest military and sown the seeds of our own destruction. I seriously question whether capitalist concepts of economic freedom can survive very long without at least some degree of political freedom. If the Chinese government doesn’t figure out how to loosen up its political strangehold on society without
As for North Korea, it is not at all clear that the North Korean leadership is even sane, let alone basing its decisions on a rational evaluation of solid facts. They’re so isolated from the rest of the world that even the most senior leaders may not have basic facts on which to make decisions.
Anyone who thinks North Koreans are purely puppets of China needs to remember that the founder of the Kim dynasty defied both the Chinese and the Soviets to launch his invasion of South Korea. Then, after MacArthur nearly destroyed the North Koreans, the Chinese were forced to intervene on their behalf and restore the Kim family to their de-facto throne in Pyongyang.
Kim and Tito may be the only Communist leaders to defy their masters and survive. With a history like that, I’m not sure we can rely on North Korea to do what China tells them, and I’m not at all convinced that the North Koreans won’t do something totally irrational based on wrongheaded paranoid beliefs about external threats.
Oh yes... I am certain that it was all innocent! ;-)
LLS
Now you are singing my song!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sam Donaldson:
“Mr. President... what are your plans for the cold war”
Reagan:
“We win... they lose”.
LLS
Large back up generators - they might have a chip or two, right? Can a cold shutdown be achieved without ANY electricity?
LLS
Say an EMP delivered FROM a site off the coast - or from a land missile in Nebraska ... get that baby up in the air 125 miles - and most of the US is taken out. How do we retaliate? Aim are stuff at who? Our planes have their chips fried - they're grounded - for good. Communication systems down - everywhere. Missile command structure inoperable... We'd have no clue who did it...
Our best people would be dealing with important things - like keeping their families from starving to death.
Our subs could knock out Russia or China - or Iran - or North Korea or some terrorist cell supported by a rich ME country... But we'd better guess well ...
'cause things can get worse.
The Japanese had an advantage - they had back-up generators that worked for a while. In a US EMP attack that might not be the case.
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