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ELIMINATE MILITARY PENSIONS?
boblonsberry.com ^ | 08/17 11 | Bob Lonsberry

Posted on 08/17/2011 5:43:05 AM PDT by shortstop

They want to cut military pensions.

The Obama Administration’s panel of smart guys has decided military retirement has to go.

Welfare can stay, free pills for Grama can stay, bogus SSI checks for life can stay, Food Stamps for soda and steak can stay, cushy federal civilian benefits stay, congressional compensation packages remain the same, but pensions for guys on their fourth tour, well, we can’t afford them.

You now what this means?

It means the military is a small and Republican-leaning voting bloc that the Democrats don’t care about alienating. It means that veterans have no political pull – on either the support or the consciences of the politicians.

To balance the budget, in the Obama world, we target millionaires and the military. And not just weapons systems, but the men and women who use them.

We pull the rug out from under them.

We take a low-paying, dangerous, high-stress crap job with a pittance of a pension, and we yank the pension. And by so doing we will reduce spending, over the next 20 years, by less than one-sixth of this year’s Obama budget deficit.

Put another way, over those same 20 years, the savings from nixing military pensions will be about the same as was given to Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Citigroup and Bank of America in the bailout. We threw away in a foolish ineffective stimulus enough to pay military pensions for more than a century.

The big banks got theirs, and the soldiers are going to get the shaft.

SSI is a lifelong, guaranteed right, just like Food Stamps and any number of other welfare programs, and those programs absolutely dwarf the money spent on military pensions, but pensions go and welfare stays.

Because welfare recipients vote – if it’s not raining and you give them a ride – and they vote Democrat.

So their money is safe.

While reporters and politicians who’ve never been in the military opine about how we can’t afford military pensions anymore.

Let’s look at those pensions.

Currently, people in the military are allowed to retire after 20 years. They receive, as a pension, half of their base pay.

And what is that base pay?

Well, that depends on their rank, but the overwhelming majority of people in the military are junior enlisted people – low-rank grunts who get paid squat.

Here are some examples. An E-4 – the most common rank in the U.S. military – pays between $1,900 and $2,300 a month, depending on how long a person has been in the service. For those of you without calculators, that works out to between $22,800 and $27,600 a year.

That is less, in terms of spending power, than the money and benefits given to welfare recipients.

And, whereas GIs face the prospect of fighting and dying for our freedom, welfare recipients just sit around on their arses.

The most common retiree rank in the U.S. military is E-7, which has a base monthly pay, after 20 years of service, of $4,189. That’s $50,268 annually, or about what a New York State Trooper makes in his rookie year.

Of course, that same trooper will soon average $101,000 a year – if he never passes the sergeant’s test – and be eligible for 50% retirement after 20 years.

Just like an American combat veteran.

Except that half of $50,268 a year is $25,134.

Twenty-five thousand dollars a year.

In most of America, that’s not a mortgage payment. In most of America, that’s substantially below the welfare payout.

In all of America, that’s dramatically below congressional compensation and pension.

In all of America, that’s a crying, immoral shame.

The military is a lower-middle-class job. It is, financially, targeted at lower-income people, offering them a chance to step, barely, into the middle class, to get some college and maybe buy a house. The military is peopled by folks who, if they were less honorable, could have stayed home and made more money on public assistance.

And the Obama Administration is begrudging them a pittance of a pension.

The Obama Administration wants to push these people into a 401k – how much do people making $25,000 a year have left over to put into their 401k – and have that 401k be off limits to the military retiree until they are 65 or 70.

Apparently, the Obama Administration begrudges GIs their 20-year retirement. So let’s take up that issue. Why can people in the military retire after just 20 years of service?

Actually, the only people who ask that question are people who’ve never been in the military.

The military is the hardest, most dangerous and personally draining job our society has. It destroys families, it takes lives, it grinds down souls. It is very hard to be in the military. You are treated like crap, and your life is not your own. You do very difficult and dangerous things. Some sail off in ships for six months at a time, some are sent to war zones for a year at a time, all must uproot their lives and their families every two or three years to move off and start over at some far-distant post.

And some of them come home in a box, or with a hook where their hand used to be and a plate where their skull used to be.

And it is a young man’s game. Yes, older people serve, and some stay far more than 20 years. But the overwhelming majority of men and women in the service are young people whose duty is literally pounding the life and youth out of them. They give the best years of their lives and after 20 years many of them simply don’t have anything left anymore.

Cops all across America retire after 20, with better pay and retirement than servicemen, and they face less-stressful jobs.

How is that fair?

And how is it fair that an administration that was pushed into power with union money is targeting its largest non-union workforce for a benefits cut? Does anyone think for half a moment that the Democrat-affiliated, union-represented federal workforce would face similar unilateral cuts?

Absolutely not.

But there will be no negotiations, no asking of the troops, there will simply be a plundering, a breaking of promises, a deserting of our national honor.

And a repudiation of a sentiment of obligation felt since the disbanding of the Continental army and best expressed in Lincoln’s Second Inaugural:

“With malice toward none; with charity for all; with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in; to bind up the nation's wounds; to care for him who shall have borne the battle, and for his widow, and his orphan -- to do all which may achieve and cherish a just, and a lasting peace, among ourselves, and with all nations.”

To care for him who shall have borne the battle.

That started with Washington and will end with Obama.

If we are silent in the face of this outrage.

We have a massive, bloated, entitlement government. It is ripe for the cutting. And we are offered the veteran’s head on a platter. Let us refuse it. And let us turn our ire on those who take, but have given nothing. Veterans have earned their pension, let us pay them before we pay those who are “entitled” to welfare.


TOPICS: Editorial; Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 2012; bhofascism; bhosocialism; bhotreason; bhotyranny; bloodoftyrants; corruption; cwii; democrats; fubo; fubogtfo2012; govtabuse; impeach; liberalfascism; liberals; military; nobama; nobama2011; obama; obamatruthfile; pensions; progressives; socialistdemocrats; tyranny
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FUBO
1 posted on 08/17/2011 5:43:09 AM PDT by shortstop
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To: shortstop

Obama is fundamentally transforming America by gutting the military.


2 posted on 08/17/2011 5:49:14 AM PDT by TADSLOS (Free Republic- Still AAA++ rated)
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To: shortstop

All part and parcel to the public employee bash-fest, I suppose.


3 posted on 08/17/2011 5:49:39 AM PDT by Wolfie
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To: shortstop

$ for Porkulus; $ for Cash for Clunkers; $ for ACORN; $ for HAMAS; $ for building mosques around the world....

But, let’s cut MILITARY RETIREMENTS.

FUBO.


4 posted on 08/17/2011 5:51:15 AM PDT by ScottinVA (As a party that gives Obama what he wants, what again is the GOP`s 2012 selling point?)
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To: shortstop

It means that veterans have no political pull
____________________________________________________

at less than 30 million veterans (<10% of the US pop) yes theres not a lot of influence there

but theres 4 times that amount on food stamps etc


5 posted on 08/17/2011 5:51:29 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: shortstop
ELIMINATE MILITARY PENSIONS?

See: Bonus Army - 1932

6 posted on 08/17/2011 5:51:40 AM PDT by Mike Darancette (Obama get our AAA back.)
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To: shortstop

Rendering the military into the opposition and then cutting their last string to the civilian government is often a bad idea.


7 posted on 08/17/2011 5:54:26 AM PDT by FateAmenableToChange
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To: shortstop

I understand the outrage at singling the military out, while continuing to pour billions for (much) less worthy folk in the rat hole...however, I’m fairly certain the income from a 401K, conservatively invested, after 20 years can exceed a 1/2 pay pension.

This could also serve as a model for Soc. Security reform.

I don’t know the exact numbers, but, the power of compound interest is a mighty thing...


8 posted on 08/17/2011 5:55:39 AM PDT by AnalogReigns
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To: shortstop

The biggest voices the veterans ever had were the WWII veterans

Then they mostly died off and the Vietnam veterans took their place

Now the Vietnam veterans are dying (age 60 and up)

Will the Iraq/Afghan veterans fight for pensions medical bennies etc ???

I dont know

They were raised in a different era..


9 posted on 08/17/2011 5:57:02 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: shortstop
FUBO

Well-stated, shortstop. Worth repeating.

FUBO

DEFUND socialist collectives, foreign and domestic.

Resign POSOTUS.

10 posted on 08/17/2011 5:57:41 AM PDT by PGalt
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To: Mike Darancette

Hoovervilles 2011


11 posted on 08/17/2011 5:58:03 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: shortstop

“Veterans have earned their pension, let us pay them before we pay those who are “entitled” to welfare.”

AMEN.

Say it loudly and often.


12 posted on 08/17/2011 5:58:29 AM PDT by roaddog727 (It's the Constitution, Stupid!)
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To: shortstop

In addition to being a small Republican voting block, it’s one that does not get its votes counted, anyway.


13 posted on 08/17/2011 5:59:00 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: shortstop; JLAGRAYFOX; Doogle; Foolsgold; 70th Division; ExSoldier; SkyPilot; navyguy; flat; ...

Every military veteran and every member of their family must call the political vermin in DC. They must hear the American people and their anger.

202-225-3121; ask for the corrupt, self-serving politician of your choice.


14 posted on 08/17/2011 5:59:31 AM PDT by ExTexasRedhead
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To: Tennessee Nana

How many Veterans are in Congress? Very few. My old pal Navy Ace and Commander Randy “Duke” Cunningham is in prison. That’s another story. Face it folks, Americans’ percieve the US Military as a FIRE DEPARTMENT-like government service. Obamacans and Clintonistas simply loath them. Elections have consequence.


15 posted on 08/17/2011 6:00:30 AM PDT by Broker (Never take a lawyer to a knife fight.)
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To: shortstop

Once they occupy your mind-housing-group, the rest is easy!

This old fart was born and lived in a place called America for many years before the occupation; I remember when they slipped the zip code in, saying it would never become mandatory!
Now we no longer can abbreviate California as Calif; nor Florida as Fla, etc, etc.
Bu, in this New Age most seem to like the way things are...

Semper BS!
*****


16 posted on 08/17/2011 6:00:57 AM PDT by gunnyg ("A Constitution changed from Freedom, can never be restored; Liberty, once lost, is lost forever...)
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To: AnalogReigns

All “defined benefit” plans need to go. It is evident that at all levels of government and in private industry also, that promises are made that can’t be kept years down the road.

Private 401K plans will remain and be your personal responsibility.


17 posted on 08/17/2011 6:01:44 AM PDT by kayak42
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To: shortstop

There are many out there who look at conservatives in disbelief when we say that, the mission of Obama and the democrats is to destroy America.

Cutting the pensions of our military should be proof enough of what conservatives have been saying. That would essentially turn the military into a provider of short-term jobs, and no chance to build experience and no continuity of experience. Without experience, our military people would never be effective in combat.


18 posted on 08/17/2011 6:02:10 AM PDT by adorno
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To: shortstop

This is an outstanding article.

When they needed civilian truck drivers in Iraq, the going rate during those first few years was 200 grand plus. A freaking truck driver. Why? Because to go into that kind of danger, that’s the kind of money they had to pay to a guy who’s doing a private’s job.

Military pension is not a “benefit”. It is deferred pay. Had they all been paid what their duty was actually getting on the market, all our troops with their multiple deployments would be qualify for Obama’s tax increases on the rich.

A new military march on Washington is in order.

Obama hates the military.


19 posted on 08/17/2011 6:02:23 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True Supporters of our Troops PRAY for their VICTORY!)
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To: shortstop

Just another example of folks failing to grasp the fact we are at war and under attack...pathetic


20 posted on 08/17/2011 6:02:51 AM PDT by montanajoe
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To: shortstop

There goes the career military force and all that experience. This is one of the stupidest proposals I have ever heard.


21 posted on 08/17/2011 6:02:59 AM PDT by Roklok
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To: shortstop

Cut pensions of the three branches of Government too then.


22 posted on 08/17/2011 6:03:08 AM PDT by the_daug
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To: shortstop

>>You now what this means?

That the author is a LIFER who didn’t learn to proofread?


23 posted on 08/17/2011 6:03:44 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: AnalogReigns
Compound interest calculator.
24 posted on 08/17/2011 6:04:47 AM PDT by AnalogReigns
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To: TADSLOS

At least we know why they want to transform the military.

They want it to vote democrat, not Republican.


25 posted on 08/17/2011 6:06:20 AM PDT by Jonty30
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: shortstop

I swear these people want to start a revolution.


27 posted on 08/17/2011 6:09:43 AM PDT by Rummyfan (Iraq: it's not about Iraq anymore, it's about the USA!)
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To: shortstop

“The military is peopled by folks who, if they were less honorable, could have stayed home and made more money on public assistance.”

I know many police cadets, personally. Many are young men who recently finished tours in Iraq and A’stan.

NONE are the sons of wealthy businessmen. These guys are hard working, committed and HONEST... to a man.

They served voluntarily when it was neither profitable NOR safe to do so. They served in wartime when they were under NO compunction to do so or any censure if they did not.

Short change THEM?? How shabby, to even think of it.


28 posted on 08/17/2011 6:09:56 AM PDT by SMARTY (A claim for equality of material position can be met only by a government with totalitarian powers.)
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To: shortstop

“The military is peopled by folks who, if they were less honorable, could have stayed home and made more money on public assistance.”

I know many police cadets, personally. Many are young men who recently finished tours in Iraq and A’stan.

NONE are the sons of wealthy businessmen. These guys are hard working, committed and HONEST... to a man.

They served voluntarily when it was neither profitable NOR safe to do so. They served in wartime when they were under NO compunction to do so or any censure if they did not.

Short change THEM?? How shabby, to even think of it.


29 posted on 08/17/2011 6:10:12 AM PDT by SMARTY (A claim for equality of material position can be met only by a government with totalitarian powers.)
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To: shortstop

“The military is peopled by folks who, if they were less honorable, could have stayed home and made more money on public assistance.”

I know many police cadets, personally. Many are young men who recently finished tours in Iraq and A’stan.

NONE are the sons of wealthy businessmen. These guys are hard working, committed and HONEST... to a man.

They served voluntarily when it was neither profitable NOR safe to do so. They served in wartime when they were under NO compunction to do so or any censure if they did not.

Short change THEM?? How shabby, to even think of it.


30 posted on 08/17/2011 6:10:14 AM PDT by SMARTY (A claim for equality of material position can be met only by a government with totalitarian powers.)
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To: shortstop

Yeah, right after he switches the presidential perks and those of the rest of government to those of the little people.


31 posted on 08/17/2011 6:10:18 AM PDT by freeangel ( (free speech is only good until someone else doesn't like it)
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To: shortstop

A GENIUS!!!!

A ROCKET SCIENTIST!!!!

WE HAVE A GENIUS IN IN THE WHITE HOUSE!!!!
(Sarcasm)


32 posted on 08/17/2011 6:11:45 AM PDT by ZULU (McConnell and Boehner are the Judas and Ephialtes of the 21st Century)
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To: shortstop
I like it. The Progressives pissing off more people with guns and the tactical knowledge to use them. The Dims have spent 60 years ripping up the Constitution, in the expectation that the Armed Population would NEVER strike back.

Please continue. There will never be retribution...

And, to all the LEOs out there, the Sheriff of Nottingham also figured his thugs would always be able to control things...

33 posted on 08/17/2011 6:13:45 AM PDT by jonascord (Politicians should be pelted with human manure, weekly, to remind them of their worth to society.)
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To: FateAmenableToChange

History shows that bad things happen when the Military gets shafted


34 posted on 08/17/2011 6:14:11 AM PDT by SecondAmendment (Restoring our Republic at 9.8357x10^8 FPS)
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To: TADSLOS

What should one expect from a jihadi?


35 posted on 08/17/2011 6:14:12 AM PDT by onedoug
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We already have two living commies running around the world bad-mouthing us and keeping the commie mud roiled...

Carter and Clinton?

36 posted on 08/17/2011 6:14:37 AM PDT by Rummyfan (Iraq: it's not about Iraq anymore, it's about the USA!)
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To: shortstop

Face it, Obama hates the military. Not long ago, he said that soldiers with combat injuries leaving the military should not get care from the VA, but instead go find a job and have the employer’s health insurance take care of it.
There are liberals here in Minnesota who think that anyone with a military background should not be permitted to participate in the political process (unless on is a traitor like Kerry or Murtha).


37 posted on 08/17/2011 6:14:38 AM PDT by Fred Hayek (FUBO, the No Talent Pop Star pResident.)
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To: shortstop

Doesnt surprise me.

Obama cut the GI Bill Benefits.

No one is saying anything about that.


38 posted on 08/17/2011 6:16:14 AM PDT by Keith Brown (Among the other evils being unarmed brings you, it causes you to be despised Machiavelli.)
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To: ScottinVA

Oh, my! Scott!!!
*waving hand in front of face*
Couldn’t have said it better! Cheers...


39 posted on 08/17/2011 6:16:46 AM PDT by matginzac
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To: ExTexasRedhead

My vermin is a commie 0 butt kisser, he is for gutting the Military in any way he can, so he has more money for useless green, homosexual and wasteful social agendas.


40 posted on 08/17/2011 6:19:03 AM PDT by GailA (Any congress critter who fails to keep faith with the Military, will NOT keep faith with YOU!)
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To: SMARTY

There are some prominent families that have sent their sons to war; there are not many. Honest military demographics are hard to come by, especially now that Prof. Moskos has passed.


41 posted on 08/17/2011 6:20:35 AM PDT by MSF BU (YR'S Please Support our troops: JOIN THEM!)
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To: Roklok

There goes the career military force and all that experience. This is one of the stupidest proposals I have ever heard.

Then throw in discharging all those who do not enthusiastically embrace the new politically correct diversity, and you have a “bloodless” purge of our military.

Josef Stalin is smiling from the pit of Hell.


42 posted on 08/17/2011 6:21:11 AM PDT by Fred Hayek (FUBO, the No Talent Pop Star pResident.)
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To: xzins

And yet his wife, whenever she is NOT vacationing (didn’t make it to Dover the other week, did she?) and Biden’s hapless wife wrap themselves around military families for the PR and good Photo-ops (like O’bummer)...
Military families need to say NO to being used and abused by this admin...


43 posted on 08/17/2011 6:21:44 AM PDT by matginzac
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To: kayak42; AnalogReigns
Private 401K plans will remain and be your personal responsibility.

It's surprising so few FReepers understand that the pension crisis in this country is with Defined Benefit Pensions not 401K's. I think the debate should be what is the % the govt contributes to these fine men and women's accounts.

A 401K is the most liberating type of pension there is. It travels with the individual and can not be arbitrarily reduced by the employer/govt. OTOH, social security benefits will be changed by the govt.

44 posted on 08/17/2011 6:22:49 AM PDT by wmfights (If you want change support SenateConservatives.com)
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To: Rummyfan

Six Days in May.


45 posted on 08/17/2011 6:23:42 AM PDT by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: AnalogReigns

“I understand the outrage at singling the military out, while continuing to pour billions for (much) less worthy folk in the rat hole...however, I’m fairly certain the income from a 401K, conservatively invested, after 20 years can exceed a 1/2 pay pension.”

You’re missing something—currently the military retirement annuity is based on a Principal which never decreases; a 401k annuity decreases the Principal. There really is no comparison here.


46 posted on 08/17/2011 6:23:59 AM PDT by Nabber
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To: TADSLOS

Obama knows it has been his attention to his promise to “fundamentally change America” and I cannot think of a single policy he has supported -nor law he has signed proudly to suggest he is anything but an ENEMY of Our Country And to accomplish his goal he must divide America, he must destroy our Patriotism— and must necessarily destroy our Military. He has done more HARM to America via his policy and his support
than any foreign Army has ever been allowed. And I am reminded of Abe Lincolns address to the Young Mens’ Lyceum
that we would live through all time as Freemen or die by suicide. America may have been beguiled by the Beguiler to accept the hemlock but I shall have no part in helping another drink it.


47 posted on 08/17/2011 6:24:26 AM PDT by StonyBurk (ring)
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To: xzins
Which is why we now use mercs for many roles.

That truck driver making $200K a year is still costing less than the private in the Army who used to drive the truck. The difference is that the driver gets much of the cost directly, while the private costs in training, benefits, housing, etc.

The truck driver will be done in a few years, and then be gone. He will not cost anything more the day he stops working. The private will be a long term cost.

Similar thing in business. You hire contractors to do what you used to do in house, because it cost much less in the long term. My old job hired a bunch of contract engineers to do a project, and paid them $150K for a year. That is much less than they would have paid a full time engineer to work for the company for 5 to 7 years at $60K.

48 posted on 08/17/2011 6:28:25 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: MSF BU

“There are some prominent families that have sent their sons to war; there are not many.”

I don’t meet them. Anyway, how many of these wealthy kids want to enroll in college to study Criminal Justice when they come home?

Bottom line here, I am talking about the majority of veterans, not the demographic exceptions


49 posted on 08/17/2011 6:29:07 AM PDT by SMARTY (A claim for equality of material position can be met only by a government with totalitarian powers.)
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To: AnalogReigns

“I don’t know the exact numbers, but, the power of compound interest is a mighty thing...”

...said the old hedge-fund manager to the young soldier”.


50 posted on 08/17/2011 6:29:21 AM PDT by ngat
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