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To: gleeaikin
The Shia and the Sunni are going through the kind of thing that Catholics and Protestants went through 3 or 4 Centuries ago.

That's like saying that a molehill is the same kind of thing as a mountain.

The reason why our founding fathers voted for a secular government.

How long are you going to promote that Orwellian lie here? None of the Colonists or Founding Fathers seemed to have received your memos on the subject. THEIR view, in contradistinction to YOUR view, was that NATIONS, as well as all CITIZENS, have a DUTY to worship God. Because they were forming a government UNDER GOD, "the great Governor of the universe" they could not have been forming a "secular government". The two concepts are mutually exclusive. THEIR notion of what government is and YOUR notion of it are two different things. Are you a citizen of these United States?

TUESDAY, MARCH 20, 1781

The United States in Congress assembled, agreed to the following proclamation:

In times of calamity and impending danger when a vindictive enemy pursues with unrelenting fury a war of rapine and devastation to reduce us by fire and sword, by the savages of the wilderness and our own domestics to the most abject and ignominious bondage; it becomes the indispensible duty of the citizens of these United States with true penitence of heart publicly to acknowledge the over ruling Providence of God, to confess our offences against him, and to supplicate his gracious interposition for averting the threatened danger and preparing our efforts in the defence and preservation of our injured country.

At all times it is our duty to acknowledge the over-ruling providence of the great Governor of the universe, and devoutly to implore his divine favour and protection. But in the hour of calamity and impending danger, when by fire and the sword, by the savages of the wilderness, and by our own domestics, a vindictive enemy pursues a war of rapine

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and devastation, with unrelenting fury, we are peculiarly excited, with true penitence of heart, to prostrate ourselves before our great Creator, and fervently to supplicate his gracious interposition for our deliverance.

The United States in Congress assembled, therefore do earnestly recommend, that Thursday the third day of May next, may be observed as a day of humiliation, fasting and prayer, that we may, with united hearts, confess and bewail our manifold sins and transgressions, and by sincere repentance and amendment of life, appease his righteous displeasure, and through the merits of our blessed Saviour, obtain pardon and forgiveness: that it may please him to inspire our rulers with wisdom and uncorruptible integrity, and to direct and prosper their councils: to inspire all our citizens with a fervent and disinterested love of their country, and to preserve and strengthen their union: to turn the hearts of the disaffected, or to frustrate their devices: to regard with divine compassion our friends in captivity, affliction and distress, to comfort and relieve them under their sufferings, and to change their mourning into grateful songs of triumph: that it may please him to bless our ally, and to render the connection formed between these United States and his kingdoms a mutual and lasting benefit to both nations: to animate our officers and forces by sea and land with invincible fortitude, and to guard and protect them in the day of battle, and to crown our joint endeavours for terminating the calamities of war with victory and success: that the blessings of peace and liberty may be established on an honourable and permanent basis, and transmitted inviolate to the latest posterity: that it may please him to prosper our husbandry and commerce, and to bless us with health and plenty: that it may please him to bless all schools and seminaries of learning, and to grant that truth, justice and benevolence, and pure and undefiled religion, may universally prevail.◁


26 posted on 09/22/2011 7:11:14 AM PDT by Diamond (He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people,)
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To: Diamond; All

I am uncertain as to whether you are indicating that the Protestant Reformation was a molehill, or that the curren upheavals in Islam are a molehill.

Regarding the document, I shall have to do some research on that. It appears the language may represent a compromise among the various members with the use of Creator, Providence, and Governor of the universe more appealing to the Deist faction, and words like Saviour and “bewail our manifold sins” to the Methodist and Baptist faction. At any rate when the Constitution was written the vote was for no establishment of religion, which mistaken or not, I equate with secular.


27 posted on 09/22/2011 3:35:47 PM PDT by gleeaikin
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To: cyborg; Clemenza; Cacique; NYCVirago; The Mayor; Darksheare; hellinahandcart; Chode; ...
Outrage of the Week 9/9/11

FReepmail me if you want on or off my New York ping list.

This is a different Islamic center.

29 posted on 09/22/2011 3:50:29 PM PDT by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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